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Posts from ASW – Alternative hero leveling.Auto-translated
For example, I never liked the skills of magic, speed, and stone skin – let spells be in magic. If you want acceleration (stone skin) as a general skill, remove a slot for light magic and upgrade Wrath or Guardian. Besides, if there's stone skin in defense, there should be punishing strike in attack. I'm for removing these skills or replacing them with others.
But what about a necromancer with stone skin or a dark elf with acceleration? The question is actually debatable. There are pros and cons on both sides. SRD
And why give enchanted arrows to others? Let's give stunning strike and banshee scream to everyone – this could reduce the choice of a game race to the choice of how the creatures we lead into battle will be designed. This is about the need for individuality (the more, the better).
The point is that you can make another skill individual. The problem here is that we are used to the skill being racial, but if there was another skill like that, people would cling to it just as much. Conclusion: a unique skill is necessary, but it doesn't necessarily have to be the old one. SRD
I also suggest adding a mod that changes the starting skills of heroes (without changing specializations or the hero's composition).
Because you phrased it in such a way that it was unclear. Therefore, I clarified it just in case.
Previously, any aesthetic connection was rejected, but now it's "yes."
If this connection improves gameplay or balance, then why not? But if the connection is just for the sake of connection, then I am against any justification for it. :) For example, firearms in the machinery branch in the catapult tree. After the sulfur rain, there is an association by name/out-of-game meaning (the technology of fire projectiles), in addition, the branch itself is not called a catapult, but artillery. But the meaning of this transfer is not at all that, from an associative point of view, firearms look good there, but that it is optimal in terms of gameplay, and at the same time, it can be logically connected.
But when I see the same firearms in attack or chaos, a connection can be invented there, but such a position is not justified by gameplay in any way, on the contrary - it harms.
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But when I see the same ranged attacks in Haven or Chaos, you can come up with a connection, but this situation is not determined by the gameplay in any way, on the contrary - it harms.
The opinion has changed again))) By the way, Haven units deal additional fire damage. There is a fire lord in Chaos ;)
My opinion has changed again... By the way, siege engines deal additional fire damage. Chaos has a Fire Lord ;)
No, my opinion hasn't changed; you probably misunderstood it initially. I'm not against tying things together based on aesthetics if it's dictated by gameplay, not just aesthetics. And I'm against trying to force everything to fit an aesthetic, ignoring all other factors.
Have you checked if the damage from siege engines is equivalent to magical fire (reducing defense and pyrokinesis)? If so, there is an additional connection, but that doesn't negate the fact that this decision is bad from a gameplay perspective. In practice, this will lead to: 1) Engineers without Chaos (or non-engineers) will complain that the ballista is too weak, or engineers with Chaos will have an overpowered ballista (depending on the base stats of the ballista). It's impossible to find a "golden mean" because of two variables and a huge range. 2) In Chaos, this perk will only clutter the upgrade path if there are no siege engines and, especially, if there isn't even a ballista.
On the other hand, if firearms are in the siege engine branch, what complaints can there be about the gameplay? And if it's also in the catapult branch, which solves the problem of the huge range of the engineer's and non-engineer's ballista, and also creates two alternative upgrade paths for the ballista (rate of fire OR firearms)? I don't see any downsides to the gameplay. Now about the connections: 1) The catapult branch is called Artillery - Sulfur Rain - Fire Arrows (there is an association in terms of out-of-game meaning, the development of siege technologies and fire projectiles). 2) Artillery and Sulfur Rain deal direct damage to enemy troops, in addition to enhancing the catapult only in siege battles, thus there is a connection in terms of the damage dealt by machines.
You can nitpick about the connections (it's a matter of personal opinion), but they do exist. We have: an objective improvement in gameplay + a subjective difference in determining which connections are sufficient and which are not. In my opinion, that's how the upgrade tree should be structured (objectivity in primary details and possible ambiguity in secondary details).
But we've already discussed these arguments; I'm just giving them as an example.
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It seems your opinion hasn't changed, and perhaps you initially misunderstood. I'm not against aligning things based on aesthetics if it's dictated by gameplay, not just aesthetics. And I'm against trying to force everything to fit a certain aesthetic, ignoring all other factors.
Then why repeat the same thing using different words? I call it "mechanics," you call it "gameplay," for example. It's an argument about nothing...
It's better to judge something based on specifics.
Added 3 minutes later I'm still a proponent of alternative upgrade paths. For example, having a choice between upgrading attack or rate of fire, rather than doing both at once. Or choosing between an enchanted ballista or a rapid-fire weapon, etc. But this concept completely harms single-player games, while it's more interesting for multiplayer. It depends on the perspective. There are pros and cons everywhere. Why be an antagonist to every idea?
I call it "mechanics," you, for example, call it "gameplay." It's a pointless argument...
As I understand it, "mechanics" refers to the fire damage and its effects in both cases (we need to check if they combine), and the compatibility of the two perks in terms of gameplay. And gameplay refers to more global considerations, such as:
1) Engineers without Chaos (or non-engineers) will complain that the ballista is too weak, or engineers with Chaos will have an overpowered ballista (depending on the base ballista stats). It's impossible to find a "golden mean" because of the two variables and the huge range. 2) In Chaos, this perk will only clutter the build if there's no machinery and, especially, if there's no ballista itself.
And that's a huge difference.
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
As I understand it, "mechanics" refers to fire damage in both cases (needs to be checked if they combine), and the synergy of the two perks in terms of gameplay. And gameplay refers to more global considerations, such as: And that's a huge difference.
We have different understandings of the mechanics of skills and abilities (darkness is a debuff on parameters and similar characteristics, machines are what enhance machines, etc.). I repeat, this is a pointless argument. Many posts left recently boil down to just one sentence.
I am still a proponent of alternative builds. For example, when there is a choice, whether to upgrade attack or rate of fire, and not both at the same time. Enchanted ballista or rate of fire, etc. But this concept completely harms single-player games, while it is more interesting for multiplayer. It depends on the perspective. There are pros and cons everywhere. Why be an antagonist to any idea?
You're already imagining things here. :) Although I usually don't write anything when I agree, because it's usually obvious.
I fully support the multiplayer perspective. I doubt it harms single-player games; it depends on the type of player (whether they like variety or complete development).
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I have schemes for Order in Chaos, Order in Machines, and Order in Attack.
It's important to understand the purpose for which the mod is being created.
Order in Chaos gives an advantage to those with a high percentage of Machine and Chaos creatures (demons).
Order in Attack is the standard option for most players.
Order in Machines is for single-player (enhancement) or multiplayer (alternative).
We have different understandings of the mechanics of skills and abilities (darkness is a debuff on parameters and similar characteristics, machines are what enhance machines, etc.). I repeat, this argument is pointless.
Concepts may differ, but the objectivity of gameplay considerations remains unchanged. You cannot refute the gameplay arguments given above by simply stating that you have a "different mechanic" (just as you cannot refute an apple with a boot).
Again. A different mechanic is, for example, one person's opinion that cold steel is needed in attack (because it enhances attack), and another's opinion that it is needed in chaos (because it deals magical damage). But from a gameplay perspective, these details don't matter. There are objective consequences of one decision and the consequences of another; these are what need to be evaluated. And in this case, the consequences are exactly as follows: additional enhancement of the warrior + the ability to counter ranged physical damage (if there are no extraneous links from chaos), versus the secondary enhancement of the chaos faction's troops + a counter for the chaos faction against ranged physical damage, leading to the "ultimate" level 3 perk - deadly cold.
Therefore, I suggest focusing on objective (general) things, rather than subjective ones (different concepts, mechanics, etc.).
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I fully support the multiplayer aspect. I doubt it will harm single-player fans; it depends on the type of player (whether they like variety or complete progression).
Even small advantages for one aspect can be more important to someone than a large advantage overall.
I have schemes for both Machine-based and Chaos-based upgrades, as well as Attack-based upgrades. We need to understand the purpose of the mod. Chaos-based upgrades give an advantage to those with a high chance of Machine and Chaos creatures appearing (demons). Attack-based upgrades are the standard option for most players. Machine-based upgrades are for single-player (enhancement) or multiplayer (alternative).
Everything is written correctly. Personally, I don't see the point in further strengthening demons when they already do well with machines. The standard option is for conservative projects that aim to avoid changes where possible. The last option remains, in my opinion :)
But in general, in my opinion, 3 > 2 > 1. Machine operators are usually warriors (too many perks are spent on ballista, leaving not enough to fully develop magic), therefore, firearms in the attack skill will at least be accessible to everyone, giving all warriors the opportunity to acquire high-quality machines. In addition, in the original game, firearms usually go through the ranged attack skill, which is rarely taken anyway (due to the unconvincing perk compared to Battle Fury, Mass Haste, and Retribution), which means that firearms clutter the build less than in the Chaos skill.
By the way, there is a way to get rid of the "clutter" (both in Chaos and Attack), by linking the upgrade to the Rapid Shot skill (but these are external links, which add more complexity).
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Also, keep in mind that the general public doesn't react well to changes in the "skill tree" progression. But a smaller, dedicated group of Heroes players actually appreciates it. So, the target audience also matters.
Added 1 minute ago
And, as practice has shown, they don't really notice changes in the power of skills.
Also, keep in mind that the general public doesn't react well to changes in the "skill tree" progression. But a small circle of Heroes enthusiasts will love it. So, the target audience also matters.
In the case where you don't change the skill tree at all - yes.
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That's why the idea of a separate mod came about. But we wanted to maintain compatibility with NHF. However, considering the two basic skills, this is hardly possible. That's the big problem.