"Mirrors" — Tournament History online

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Overview Participants Reports

Announcement

Toganash

11 years ago

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The first long-awaited tournament on mirror templates

Spirit and idea of the tournament

Since the times of VT, everyone has been expecting an adaptation of mirror templates for SoD. And now it has happened. Here there is minimum room for "luck" and maximum opportunity to demonstrate your "skill".
Forward!

The tournament prize pool is 15000р. For first place – 8000, second – 4000, third – 2000, and 1000 rubles will go as a people's choice award.

I. Registration and Regulations:
a) The tournament starts on July 17, 2015.
b) Registration is open until July 16, 18:00 MSK.
c) The tournament bracket and system of conduct will be determined after registration closes depending on the number of participants.
d) In the event of a large number of registrants, a bracket option will be chosen to conduct qualifying games in the shortest possible time and weed out most participants so that only truly experienced players participate in further struggles and the tournament does not stretch over time.
e) To participate in the tournament, it is necessary by the end of registration to have at least 5 played and confirmed games on ХВ. Also, recently registered ХВ members who do not meet the requirement for the number of played games may participate if they are sponsors of the tournament (contribution of at least 1000 rubles to the fund) and have no past violations of portal rules.
f) The group stage deadline is until 31.08.2015.
g)The upper and lower bracket finals are played bo3 (one match diamond + h3dm1, if a 3rd match is necessary, a coin toss).
The Grand Final is played bo5, with a score of 1-0 in favor of the player from the upper bracket.

II. Rules and Templates:
a) By default, games are on version HoTA (1.3.8)+HD-mod with the HW-Rules 1.34 patch connected; by agreement, opponents may play SoD.
b) Color and the right to choose a hero are negotiated (therefore red-rush is allowed). First, castles are determined (in the case of mirror templates, it is the same), then negotiations for color and hero follow alternately.
c) Each player has the right to cross out 1 undesirable castle, as well as 1 hero before the start of negotiation for them (may choose not to use this right), after which a ban on these castles is set in HW-Rulz mode and a random 1-castle generator is launched. The game will be played with this castle.
d) The template for the game is chosen from two existing "mirrors": "mir_Diamond", "mir_h3dm1" by agreement; if an agreement cannot be reached, the choice is made by a coin toss in hw-rulz. 1 - h3dm1, 0 - mir_Diamond.
e) "Hit-and-run" is prohibited.
f) There is 1 subjective restart and objective restarts (restart due to a block (inability to leave the castle) or a severe generation bug).
g) Roads are medium.
h) It is forbidden to steal anything other than resources and chests from guards that have been shifted, or to visit objects (except mills) that do not have their own internal guards.
i) The use of diplomacy is prohibited except for paying off enemies.
j) Game timer is chess: 21+8,30+1,15. Starting difficulty - 160%.
k) Use of in-game bugs described in the rules on ХВ and various kinds of cheat codes is prohibited.
l) The main rule is game ethics and a respectful attitude toward the opponent.
m) Everything that is not forbidden by the rules is allowed.
n) For SoD, any building is allowed; however, in captured villages and towns, building an additional necromancy amplifier is prohibited, except in the starting town.
o) ДД no more than 1 time per day regardless of the "Air" skill level.

III. Organizational Issues:
a) The tournament is unofficial.
b) The tournament is conducted according to the Rules for organizing, conducting, and participating in HOMM3 online tournaments.
c) Tournament leaders and judges – Redwhait HP (658339987), KobRa_RR (286406830), Toganash (564224919). Chief judge - Dirty_Player (ICQ 408722873).
d) Leaders have the right to make any changes to the regulations and rules during the tournament, as well as the right to refuse participation to any player without a public explanation of reasons.
e) For each played game, participants must submit a report and confirmation.
f) Saves of all games must be kept until the end of the tournament and presented upon the first request of the tournament leader or judge.
g) The judicial decision is made primarily based on the tournament rules. If the situation that arose is not regulated by the rules, judges are guided by basic logic and game ethics.
h) All tournament games go into the seasonal rating. Reports and confirmations are written in this thread and will be copied to the "Online game reports and their confirmations" thread.

Good luck, and may skill win!!!

In reply to GoD

Noom

11 years ago

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GoD

The opponent took the horse den for 20-49 gold and placed Djinns near the house with the help of Solmyr. I quickly took 2 Inferno and built them in both locations. Towards the end of the week, Kirra joined, and in the end, there were about 5 roughly equal heroes in the expert lobby, which allowed us to gain an advantage.

Thank you for the game!

Thanks to Solmyr, I also managed to recover somewhat after losing on the second week, outsmarting and taking the maximum number of consulates in 2 days. On the first day, I was late in taking the key Utopia with the hat for the entire fifth week (I scouted this treasure too late) and gave the opponent the opportunity to take it on my side after he took it on his. After that, on the next day, I was ambushed and killed while rushing to another treasure. Thank you for the game.

In reply to Dave_HUN

u2noob

11 years ago

Dave_HUN

Lucky start with gosha,he already had expert necro day 1,so skeleton farming went nicely.We had 2 minimum cons that we took on day 3,then I decided to give 1 angel to monere and go for hive with gosha.The area I went to was nice,3 hives (1 maxi),cons,and tope.I was planning to take tope 121 with 3 angels 24 wyverns 150 skeletons.It was maxi utopka :eek:
I still decided to go in because it would be waste of time to come back later.Gosha was 8 7 6 5 expert shield expert stone skin,and i brought flux army as meat (4 physic 5 earth 20 air 12 water elementals).Fortunately my wyverns didnt get bad morale in first 2 rounds,so I lost only meat and skeletons.1 angel died in the end because of bad morale.
I expanded quickly with the help of thant with 4 birds,took 2 more topes 123 but they were useless.Meeting with opponent at 124 where I killed 3 angels 3 firebirds then he surrendered.Not long after that he gives up. GG WP :)

Спс за игру.

In reply to Toganash

Gee

11 years ago

I managed to assemble armor of the damned. So I rushed to my opponent who didn't do that. A better army on me, not to much though and slightely better stats. That was enough to assume victory in this game. Thanks for the game.

Gee

Faction Random

Start Hero Дас / Dace

Main Hero Дас / Dace

Победа / Def

Dr.Ftor

Faction Random

Start Hero Гуннар / Gunnar

Main Hero Гуннар / Gunnar

Map Template: h3dm1
Game Length: 147 days
Game Date: 8/3/2015
Reported: 8/3/2015 7:44 PM

Gee 1261 → 1282 +21 ↑

Dr.Ftor 1439 → 1418 -21 ↓

Rated Sep 28, 2022

Accepted by opponent on 8/3/2015 7:49 PM

In reply to Gee

Dr.Ftor

11 years ago

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Gee

I managed to assemble armor of the damned. So I rushed to my opponent who didn't do that. A better army on me, not too much though and slightly better stats. That was enough to assume victory in this game. Thanks for the game.

Confirmed. I was doing well. But a couple of serious mistakes slowed down my pace, which is why I had to start playing more cautiously. I invested in air and earth magic. But I didn't assemble the Artifact of the Damned when my opponent did. My army turned out to be slightly weaker than my opponent's, but the Artifact of the Damned proved to be the deciding factor.
Thanks for the game!

Agree. It wasn't bad. But a couple of serious errors slowed my pace, because of which I had to start playing more safely. I invested in air and earth magic. But I didn't assemble the Artifact of the Damned when my opponent did. The army was slightly weaker than the opponent's, but the Artifact of the Damned proved decisive.
Thanks for playing!

In reply to Toganash

Kamnerub

11 years ago

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I wasted a restart because I made a foolish mistake on the first day.
The game proceeded from there. Immediately upgraded Magogs. In the first week, I placed Efreeti and Orodii at the Citadel, plus I took an external dwelling of Orodii. With this lot, in the second week I stumbled upon a Dragon Fly Hive (8 Wyverns) — and went to break Zephyrs, of which there were enough along the way. By the end of the second week, I picked up two nearby external dwellings of Hydras. I wouldn't have gone for just one. But this way, a stack of 4 Hydras was already pleasant.

On day 131, Tazar's stats were 8-18-2-6.
26 Cyclopes, 11 Wyverns, 4 Efreeti, 2 Hydras, 33 Magogs.

I didn't have time to bring two more Hydras and grab the Dragon Fly Hive right under my nose, nor to bring over 50 Magogs and the rest of the growth from the Inferno-Castle.
Because the opponent surrendered.

I was glad to play the game, thank you! :smile20:

Kamnerub

Faction Random

Start Hero Аксис / Axsis

Main Hero Тазар / Tazar

Победа / Def

Deferatto

Faction Random

Start Hero Калид / Calid

Main Hero Ябаркас / Jabarkas

Map Template: h3dm1
Game Length: 131 days
Game Date: 8/3/2015
Reported: 8/3/2015 8:21 PM

Kamnerub 1427 → 1445 +18 ↑

Deferatto 1508 → 1490 -18 ↓

Rated Sep 28, 2022

Accepted by opponent on 8/3/2015 8:34 PM

In reply to Kamnerub

Deferatto

11 years ago

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Kamnerub

Wasted a restart, because I blundered on the first day.
After that the game went on. Immediately upgraded Magogs. On the first week I placed Efreeti and Orodii in the Citadel + took the external dwelling of Orodii. With this army I stumbled upon a Dragon Fly Hive (8 Wyverns) - and went to break the Zephyrs, of which there were enough along the way. By the end of the second week I picked up 2 nearby external dwellings of Hydras. I wouldn't have gone for just one. But this way, a stack of 4 Hydras - that's already nice.

On day 131 Tazar's stats 8-18-2-6.
26 Cyclopes, 11 Wyverns, 4 Efreeti, 2 Hydras, 33 Magogs.

I didn't have time to bring 2 more Hydras and take the Dragon Fly Hive right under my nose, nor bring 50 Magogs and the rest of the growth from the Inferno castle.
Because the opponent surrendered.

I was glad to play a game, thank you! :smile20:

At the start everything was going very, very well. There was plenty of meat, and I had already firmly decided to demonize the earlier the better, so I didn't upgrade the Magogs. In the end it turned out there was nowhere special to catch money and I could forget about demonizing, but I realized this too late. And so by day 117 I only upgraded the Magogs. On day 121 Grand Elves in the Citadel (in a captured Rampart), and at home Orodii in the Fort + a dwelling in the treasure zone and an external dwelling of Orodii. The second week showed that besides a box of 10k under the Swordsmen, there was nothing special for shooters to catch here (Dragon Fly Hives, Zephyrs everywhere and all under fast guards + a couple of Giant Hives, which turned out to be large - no Slow or Haste, so I was afraid to go in). For the most part, I simply idled through the second week while the opponent confidently built up his forces. I saw the opponent was close and knew I was weaker in the tavern, so I picked up several artifacts for +sp and +knowledge, doubled my mana, hoping that seeing my stats on day 131 he would go break my main. I picked up the 5th scroll (it turned out to be Sacrifice). In the end: no money, no strong spells, I could have started on week 3 to break the Griffin Conservatories discovered on another respawn, but I realized I was behind in tempo almost 5 days, so I didn't believe I could somehow pull out such a gap against Tazar with decent stats.

Thanks for the game)

In reply to Deferatto

Redwhait

11 years ago

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Updated the table.
Even added an extra day. Those who wanted to, wrote and managed to participate.
Superseb joins Group C, replacing the absent Recordjke.
Wowa joins Group H, replacing the absent Player_.
Also, we'll be collecting outstanding debts in these groups from those who promised.
The other groups are more or less okay.
At the beginning of September, I will set the score to 0-0 if there is no information about the matches.

In reply to Redwhait

Wicc

11 years ago

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Watched a few streams. Perhaps it would be better to keep the rule prohibiting the use of the "Enhance" spell and Grand Vampires in SoD. If one player gets a Necropolis and the other doesn't, it's game over. And if the Necromancer is weak (like Nimbus), it's not necessary to make him the main hero; you can give him the Grand Vampires so he can collect skeletons, and the effect will still be very strong.

Added after 2 hours and 23 minutes
And regarding the HotA mirror matches, wouldn't it be better to play them on faster maps? Especially h3dm1, where the distance to the opponent is slightly greater than on the Diamond map, and contact occurs later.

If anyone is willing, please play some matches on fast maps and some on medium maps, and then compare your impressions.

In reply to Wicc

Dirty_Player

11 years ago

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It seems to me that the problem of a "hero who gets a lucky start" is much more acute in HotA than it was in WOTG, when the starting town was almost the only viable option. If you start with Goshan, Luna, or, for example, Crag, it can completely change the game and ruin the balance. In HotA, this isn't as noticeable, due to the nerfed Necropolis and the more powerful armies.

In reply to Dirty_Player

bubuch

11 years ago

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Dirty_Player

the problem of a "hero who got lucky"

this is a problem for "daddy players"), but for the average player, it's an opportunity...
if you balance it too much, it will turn into chess.
personally, I didn't like the mirror match from the very first game; there's no joy in getting a nearby resource, a stable, or cool art, karma is powerless)) In a mirror match, I'll never get into the Top 8 and won't be able to play interesting games for me.

In reply to bubuch

Wicc

11 years ago

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Well, a replay is positioned as a template for developing skills. You play yourself, then you watch how an opponent played the same scenario. If they did better, you remember what they did and try to repeat it in the next games. It's also useful to try to analyze and improve the game of a more skilled opponent, find their mistakes and inaccuracies, and play the scenario better than them, even if it's offline. In other words, post-game offline analysis of scenarios and player actions is just as interesting a part of the game as the online part, and it's much more useful for improving your skills. This approach will lead to success much faster than simply gambling on scenarios.

In reply to Wicc

dom2

11 years ago

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Post-game offline analysis of the map and player actions is just as interesting a part of the game as the online part.

+1. Mirror mode is incredibly interesting; kudos to Vikku for creating it. I would like to share a couple of my observations, in case they are helpful:

In h3dm1, the game tends to become a grind if the skills are comparable, as there is practically no element of surprise.

Bakunin's quote, "You cannot cut off even a piece of freedom, because all freedom is concentrated in that piece," is quite applicable here, in my opinion. All the randomness is concentrated in one or two parameters (a clear example is different heroes in the tavern). Moreover, these are practically uncorrectable parameters, unlike the situation in non-mirror maps, where there are many random factors and/or many challenges.

I don't know how accurate my observations are and how to fix them. This is just an attempt at tester assistance from an average-skilled player...

In reply to dom2

Wicc

11 years ago

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In h3dm1, the game becomes more about skill when the players' skills are comparable, as there is practically no element of surprise.

Yes, that's true. That's why I suggest trying h3dm1 on fast maps, so you can reach your opponent faster in case of a rush. Or to collect all the goodies from your half of the map earlier.

Bakunin's quote, "You cannot cut off a single piece of freedom, because in that piece lies all of freedom," is quite applicable here, in my opinion. All the randomness is concentrated in one or two parameters (a clear example is the main hero). Moreover, these parameters are practically unchangeable, unlike the situation when there are many random factors and/or many challenges.

The Wizard is working on a technology to make the tavern consistent, so that the same heroes appear in the same sequence. But it requires a lot of programming, so the implementation timeline is unknown.

In reply to Wicc

Javdet

11 years ago

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Wicc

Regarding HotA maps, wouldn't it be better to play them on fast roads? Especially h3dm1, where the distance to the opponent is slightly greater than on Diamond, and contact occurs later.

If anyone is willing, please play some matches on fast roads and some on medium roads, and then compare your impressions.

I don't think that's a good idea. On medium roads, you can often reach one town from another in a single turn.

In reply to Javdet

Wicc

11 years ago

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Javdet

I don't think that's a good idea. On medium-sized maps, you can often reach a treasure from one village to another in a single turn.

Yes, I thought the same way when I was designing the template. But now, after watching some streams, I thought that maybe the games would be more interesting if the planned contact was on the 3rd week (instead of the 4th week as it is now), and if a successful rush on the 2nd week was actually possible (now it's more of a negative move).

However, it might just be the perspective of a viewer who finds blood, guts, and dismemberment more interesting than cultivating a garden, while from the player's perspective, it might seem different - who knows.