JUDGMENT — General — HeroesWorld

IronAxe

9/10/2007 6:07 PM UTC

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BASON;111740

I wouldn't want to become some kind of Superman! Perhaps this is a blow to one's ego, because many have been using their nicknames for months, or even years. So, it's not as simple as it seems.

But they're not judging you :) And in general, we're talking about newcomers, and maybe they don't value their nicknames as much as the veterans do yet ;)

Added 6 minutes later

OptiMAL;111741

It would already be a sign of respect if he sticks with this nickname and starts learning to play (even against the computer). At the same time, as he learns something, he will participate in discussions. Later, I think, they might allow him to participate, but time will tell.

Well, this definitely sounds like you're advising someone to learn how to dive into a pool without water. Like, "Once you learn, then we'll fill the pool." I understand that it's unrealistic, but put yourself in his shoes (even though it's hard to imagine) - what would you do in his place - would you dive into a pool without water, or...? Let's look at the situation realistically.

In reply to IronAxe

OptiMAL

9/10/2007 6:10 PM UTC

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IronAxe;111744

Well, this definitely sounds like you're advising someone to learn how to dive into a pool without any water. Like, "Once you learn, we'll fill it up." I understand that it's unrealistic, but put yourself in his shoes (even though it's hard to imagine) – what would you do in his place? Would you dive into a pool without water, or...? Let's look at the situation realistically.

And what does the pool have to do with it? I won't say "if," because that's not the same. You need to feel the situation you're in, not just think "what if." IMHO. You need to learn to swim in a pool with water...
P.S. I remember when I was practicing with a friend in a pool... We couldn't swim, so we walked the entire distance along the edge:D

:D

In reply to IronAxe

Zybr

9/10/2007 6:11 PM UTC

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IronAxe;111744

Well, this is definitely more like advising someone to learn how to dive into a pool without any water. Like, "Once you learn, we'll fill it up." I understand it's unrealistic, but try to put yourself in his shoes (even though it might be hard) – what would you do in his place – dive into a pool without water, or...? Let's be realistic about the situation.

Well, not exactly. With a computer, you can learn some subtleties and tricks at the beginning, experiment a bit, and then, when you've gotten a bit familiar with the game, move on to the next level – playing against a real opponent, and then tournaments.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Zybr

OptiMAL

9/10/2007 6:14 PM UTC

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ZYbr;111748

Not exactly. You can learn some subtleties and tricks with the computer, especially at the beginning. You can experiment, and then, when you've gained some understanding of the game, you can move on to a new level – playing against a real opponent, and then participate in tournaments.

It would also be good to play with us, but not within the framework of a tournament, to get a feel for the level of play and its gradual improvement. Then you can draw conclusions about his level of play.
P.S. But this will be considered later, I think, as part of the rehabilitation process... And if they vote for disqualification, then, unfortunately.:)

:D

In reply to Zybr

IronAxe

9/10/2007 6:22 PM UTC

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ZYbr;111748

Not exactly. You can learn some subtleties and tricks by playing against the computer, especially in the beginning. You can experiment, and then, when you've gained some experience in the game, you can move on to the next level – playing against a real opponent, and then participate in Tournaments.

I'm not disputing the fact that it's better to start learning the game by playing against the computer. But since the person has already come to the forum, it means they've already gone through that stage. If someone decides to try playing in official Tournaments or against people online, nothing and no one will force them to spend a lot of time playing against the computer again. They'll change their nickname and go to Tournaments, either here or on another platform. Isn't that right? So, the situation being considered is that a person has confessed to cheating, in order to avoid using multiple nicknames, but still wants to continue playing in future Tournaments here, despite having a bad reputation for cheating.
:)
Okay, the conversation is going off-topic – in short, decide for yourselves what to do. As a forum participant, I've expressed my opinion regarding this specific case, and it's purely my personal opinion.

In reply to OptiMAL

Ley

9/10/2007 7:49 PM UTC

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OptiMAL;111741

It would already be a sign of respect if he sticks with this nickname and learns how to play (for now, against the computer). At the same time, once he learns something, he will participate in discussions in the forums. Later, I think, he might be allowed to participate, but time will tell.

If we forget about this person's ban, I'll support Iron. Why should he wait "for something," wait for when he's finally invited to participate in a tournament, and who would even dare to do that without fearing it would lower their reputation? In that case, it's much easier for him to join under a new nickname – and that's where the meaning lies for him.
OptiMAL, if you put yourself in his shoes, would you wait for that? Wouldn't it be easier to join as a "different person"?
If we're going to exclude him, it shouldn't be from absolutely all Tournaments, IMHO.

Added 1 minute ago

ZYbr;111748

Well, not exactly. You can learn some subtleties and tricks by playing against the computer, especially in the early stages. You can experiment, and then, when you've learned a bit more about the game, you can move on to the next level – playing against a real opponent, and then Tournaments.

But you can learn and memorize those subtleties much faster by playing against a person, and even better, in an offline game. Don't you agree with that? It's in the discussions that you can hear those very subtleties you're talking about

"Единственное, что можно сказать с уверенностью об удаче - она изменит..."

In reply to Ley

Zybr

9/10/2007 7:52 PM UTC

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Ley;111767

You can learn and memorize the nuances much faster by playing against a human, and even better in an offline game, don't you agree? It's in the discussion that you can hear those very nuances you mentioned.

Absolutely. But I'm talking about where to start. :)
After all, not many people play their first or second game against a human.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Zybr

Ley

9/10/2007 8:05 PM UTC

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ZYbr;111769

Absolutely. But I'm talking about where to start. :)
After all, not many people play their first or second game right away with another person.

But you did play with him, right? A newbie in the game doesn't necessarily mean they've only played 1-2 times, but you would know that, especially if you had a battle with them in the 4th installment?

And also: can a computer explain what you did wrong? Discussion is where the real power lies. ;)

"Единственное, что можно сказать с уверенностью об удаче - она изменит..."

In reply to CrasH

Nestilion

9/10/2007 8:26 PM UTC

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My opinion: We should give a chance to the newcomer, because I don't think an experienced player would cheat, and for young players, a warning and an example of how all their attempts to cheat will be exposed will serve as a lesson.

In reply to Ley

Zybr

9/10/2007 8:32 PM UTC

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Ley;111777

But you did play with him, right? Being new to the game doesn't necessarily mean he only played 1-2 times. But I guess you know that, considering you had a battle with him in the 4-player mode.

And also: can a computer really explain what you did wrong? Discussion is where the real power lies.

To be honest, I'd say he's played very few games, even against the computer, maybe a maximum of 10.
And I agree with you about the discussion.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

LeSHiJ-MaX

9/11/2007 2:09 AM UTC

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Hello, all Heroes.
Let's look at this problem as a forum issue, not as an excuse for a loud argument and even shouting. It might escalate to the point where you start arguing!
I will present my arguments regarding my position.
1. The first thing shadowmen did when he appeared on the forum was to start asking about cheat codes ":( Help, I'm playing the Russian version of Heroes of Might and Magic 3! I want to enter a code, but it always displays in Russian! I tried changing the font using Alt+Shift, but it doesn't work! What should I do? :confused:" He received comprehensive answers from forum members.
2. Before this incident, I thought that it was impossible to enter a cheat code in a network game of Heroes of Might and Magic 4 (and in principle, it is). I'm sure that if it's possible, only a few people could do it. And if it's not done on a large scale like shadowmen (100,000 gold, but at least 1,000 at the right moment), it will only be detected with a thorough check of each move – this is no longer a game.
3. He wrote in the topic "Who wants to play Heroes of Might and Magic 3 online today?" "Hey everyone! Maybe we can play Heroes of Might and Magic 3? If you don't mind playing with me ))) I have all 3 heroes! So, add me on ICQ 455358227! Or write here when you can play! And I'll beat you ) I can play anytime..."
Now imagine that a newbie comes along and starts playing with him. He can easily practice his "skills" on the newbie. If the newbie doesn't notice, then it's fine, but if he does, the reputation will be damaged, not for shadowmen, and not even for us, but for the forum itself. Then we might lose more than one honest player.
4. I'm sure that he didn't write the apology post entirely of his own free will!
I believe that such behavior should be punished severely, and we shouldn't make excuses because we might lose such a player. Of course, we can leave him, and it will be a promotional move for the forum's guests, guys, hurry up and join us, we have a humane court here, it will take care of you, clean you up, and even give you a candy, you don't even have to ask for it, just get caught cheating. But then there will be many more cheaters on the forum, and we will be scratching our heads and wondering how it happened.

С самого начала позаботься о своем месте в жизни, чтобы не уподобиться маятнику. /Херберт. Ф./
Клан: "Смертельный Альянс" - "Mortal Alliance"

Arandor

9/11/2007 10:55 AM UTC

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lol))) so much arguing because of one person))
I had a similar situation, a guy was cheating... I stopped playing with him, and I think others will lose the desire to play with him too if they find out))

P.S. and in general, Shadowman can just register a new user and that's it)))

Be strong. Believe

eXeCuToR

9/11/2007 11:27 AM UTC

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Arandor, but still, you can generally find out about him. If this was really the first game in the Heroes series, as some have said here, then he can be understood – he was simply very afraid of not winning and wasn't willing to do everything for victory. But here, it must be said – the goal does not justify the means. In general, I suggest creating a precedent and simply posting an announcement on the forum, for example: "Anyone caught using cheat codes will subsequently be banned from tournaments." It's up to the admin and the rest of the site staff to decide what to do with the offender, just so that this doesn't happen again, and so that, as the respected LeSHiJ-MaX put it, we don't make a fuss about it.

Step aside from the way of a better man than you
So you fall at his feet hes the one who betrays you
Its the servants devotion for the decay
Stand up

There are no flowers on your grave
There are no chains
There I keep chanting for the forgotten name © Amorphis

Starhan

9/11/2007 12:12 PM UTC

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there was a good idea
I'm for a table of shame :) where all the mistakes would be visible

Leshy thinks that he can no longer be trusted and that he is incorrigible, but I
have a different opinion...
of course, the one with more facts, on which he bases his opinion, is right.

and also
we forum users are not a machine or a mechanism, but a community and should take into account human factors.

Каждый может быть героем ...

SandroXXL

9/11/2007 12:13 PM UTC

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I believe that rules are rules, and if they are broken, the consequences should be faced. However, in this case, we are talking about a player from Heroes 4, and there aren't many of them. If any leniency is to be granted, it should be decided not by all of us, but by the participants and organizers of the tournament where the cheating occurred. LeSHiJ-MaX, it's clear that a violation took place, but what you're saying is slightly exaggerated. The fact that he was looking for codes for Heroes 3 is true, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything. The fact that he was looking for an opponent doesn't automatically imply that he will cheat extensively. And he might encounter someone who does the same! Let them compete (imagine a battle in the second week: 1000 Azure Dragons each :)), but after playing once under these conditions, no one will want to play with him again, and he should understand that. The forum won't suffer from this, as the players only played against each other. If the tournament were organized by the administration, the situation would be clear - a two-step ban! But in this case, the organizers and participants should be the ones to judge: 1) Because the tournament is amateur. 2) Because many participants have expressed support for giving him a second chance. But in any case, LeSHiJ-MaX, I understand that this is most unpleasant for the organizers, so removing his candidacy from this tournament is a reasonable punishment.

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