Birth of Legends — Maps: Tribes of the East

13га

10 years ago

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I completed the new version of the map in 60 days ("Hero," Humans, Iris/Rutger). The initial setup was terrible: in the first month, there were two weeks of fever and one week of plague. Since a week of griffons eventually appeared, I changed the main hero. Now, about the gameplay itself. The game has become completely static. Even the smallest element of surprise has disappeared. The computer-controlled heroes sit behind their garrisons like canned goods, waiting for the player to break through the defenses and attack them. In the previous version, when heading towards the blue Castle, you could expect an attack from the green Castle or another faction on your home Castle. Now, you don't have to worry about the safety of your rear. This doesn't make the game more interesting. It turns out that the player only fights against garrisons on the roads. I completely agree with Rambo1969 (#22) regarding the Astral Gate spell. Banning it on the map will deprive the AI of its last chance to reach the player. The AI cannot break through such a strong garrison for a very long time, if it even decides to try. I didn't like the section where the outer buildings attached to the Castle are located. First, creatures of levels 1-3 are very important at the start, but their value only decreases later. Second, the defense at the gates is an order of magnitude weaker than the garrison blocking the road to them. If the player has already passed along the road, nothing will stop them further. Third, from the moment I broke through the blockade on the road to the end of the game, less than two weeks passed – the outpost had no effect on the game. That's all for now.

Rambo1969

10 years ago

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I couldn't resist playing this map again with the Dark Elves (especially since there aren't any other new maps yet). Again, I chose Leto as my starting hero, and this time I managed to develop him as planned – in the first stage, focusing on dark magic and logistics, then on witchcraft, chaos magic, and summoning. The key battle was against the Cyclops, which I fought with two Furies and five Goblins, after which the hero's level increased by five points and exceeded the critical threshold.
In the Guild of Mages, as always, there were no Berserk or Hypnotize spells available, but Hypnotize was found in the spell shop. As a result, on the third week, I managed to break through the outposts to the blue castle and conquer it within the same week. It turned out to be a weak player who didn't even bother to develop the Guild of Mages beyond the first level (what a jerk!). Spending five days developing it was an unaffordable luxury, so I had to break through the outpost to the teleport again, practically using only Hypnotize. I made it to the upper half of the map, conquered the outposts to the yellow castle, and on day 29, I captured the yellow castle (it was guarded by Devils). Thank goodness they developed the Guild of Mages to level 5, and it contained both "Berserk" and "Curse," so the rest of the game was reduced to beating up weaklings; even the last two outposts to the green castle didn't create any obstacles, but only accelerated the completion of the map (Path of War). As a result, I completed it in 35 days.
I got more than 10,000 points, but I was given the "Warmonger" achievement again :( - I don't understand at all how many points I need to get to be given the "Black Dragon" achievement:confused:

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Если споришь глупцом - срочно проверь не делает ли он тоже самое!:smile13:
Древняя восточная мудрость (вольный перевод)

In reply to 13га

Ясветушка

10 years ago

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13ga

I completed the new version of the map in 60 days. ("Hero". Humans, Iris/Rutger). The initial setup was terrible: in the first month, there were two weeks of fever and one week of plague. Since a week of griffons eventually appeared, I changed the main hero. Now, about the gameplay itself. The game has become completely static. Even a small element of surprise has disappeared. The computer-controlled heroes sit in their garrisons like canned goods, waiting for the player to break through the defenses and attack them. In the previous version, when heading towards the blue Castle, you could expect an attack from the green or another faction on your home Castle. Now, you don't need to worry about the safety of your rear. This doesn't make the game more interesting. It turns out that the player only fights against garrisons on the roads. I completely agree with Rambo1969 (#22) regarding the Astral Gate spell. Banning it on the map will deprive the AI of its last chance to reach the player. The AI cannot break through such a strong garrison for a very long time, if it even dares to try. I didn't like the area where the outer buildings attached to the Castle are located. First, creatures of levels 1-3 are very important at the start, but their value only decreases later. Second, the guard at the gate is much weaker than the garrison blocking the road to them. If the player has already passed along the road, nothing will stop them further. Third, from the moment I broke through the blockade on the road to the end of the game, less than two weeks passed – the outpost had no effect on the game. That's all for now.

As they say, there is no limit to perfection!))) 13ga described everything perfectly, clearly, and concisely!
Now, let's go over the requirements again:
1) We need to return the "Astral Gate" spell to the map, but in such a way that the hero can learn this spell at a high level (25-35). However, this will require some work because I don't know how to do it. Maybe it's possible in a modded version...:smile32:

2) We need to do something with the garrisons, i.e., either slightly reduce them or combine them in some other way. As I understand it, for players with a good level, any outposts are not an obstacle at all. In addition, we need to consider the capabilities of the AI so that the outposts are within their power.

3) Set up a mini camp with 1-3 creatures near the Castle. Everything is clear here.

If I missed something or you want any other changes, please let me know!
By the way, my schedule has become very tight, so I will be working on the new version of the map for a long time. I rarely have time for something like this.

Rambo1969

10 years ago

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Yasvetushka

Something needs to be done with the garrisons, either slightly reduced in size or combined in a different way... As I understand it, for players with a good level, any outposts are not an obstacle at all. Also, the AI's capabilities need to be taken into account so that the outposts are manageable for them.

To "conjure up" a solution for the garrisons, they need to be less diverse. For example: it shouldn't be possible to combine blue elven archers with orcs and cyclops, otherwise their morale becomes non-existent, and they are useless. The most dangerous creatures in the existing outposts are titans (because spells that affect the mind don't work on them, and if you deprive them of the ability to shoot, they use lightning and always hit), you can't protect yourself from them with walls and crystals; they (unlike dragons and cyclops) accurately hit their target and don't hit their own. P.S. It is also necessary to prohibit the Angel Wings cloak and Sandro's Cloak; otherwise, a hero who randomly acquires these artifacts gains a huge advantage. P.P.S. As for the existing creature camp, in this situation, it is not needed on the map at all; going to it and capturing it is simply a waste of game time.

Если споришь глупцом - срочно проверь не делает ли он тоже самое!:smile13:
Древняя восточная мудрость (вольный перевод)

In reply to Rambo1969

13га

10 years ago

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Having read what has already been written, and given the author's desire to make some adjustments to the map, I would like to share two somewhat different thoughts. Ideally, they should not be mixed up randomly. So, the first thought: the map in its current version – without the "AV" spell, with mixed garrisons, etc. – is a quite successful piece of work. It has become a map for simulating game situations, on which it is convenient to practice different hero upgrade options and Castle building tactics. Development proceeds quickly, and you can get an assessment of the result within a game month. There are guidelines from Rambo1969 for this, and you can also see how far the AI, which also developed in isolation, has progressed. In this context, the existing garrisons are a good idea. They allow you to use a variety of schools of magic and spells. There is no point in strengthening them or setting up a guard consisting only of Titans and Dragons – this raises the bar for the player's skill, but most people would benefit from simply learning how to use magic correctly. Perhaps, it is worth only bringing the main garrisons to a single type. Currently, they differ in the set of creature upgrades. The outer dwellings can be completely removed, or you can leave levels 1-3, but near the Castle. Their presence is a useful asset for non-magic races. For the Tower and Necropolis, they play a secondary role on this map (for the Necropolis, I built a Castle from two dwellings and a five-story magic tower – this is quite enough to win).
The second thought. The map space is still poorly utilized. More than half of the surface does not participate in the events. The changes made have not solved this problem. You can compare screenshots from Rambo1969 before and after the editing – the amount of explored area on the map has hardly changed (the same is true for me). The vast area behind the two-way teleport is dead. The proposed changes are not capable of reviving it. It is necessary to completely change the road system, add new roads, which in turn will significantly change the entire map design. So, there is a question to consider: is it worth doing finishing work when the foundation has "shifted"?

Rambo1969

how many points do you need to get to get the "Black Dragon"? :confused:

In version 3.1, the "Thunderer" is the highest-level unit.

Лотос

9 years ago

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The map is made very beautifully. It’s a real feast for the eyes.

Rameliya

9 years ago

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Yes, the map turned out really well! The graphics and gameplay are excellent. Good balance. But most importantly, it's just fun to play. By the way, this map is participating in the Map Editor Contest 2015-2016:
/topic/12225/
I decided to cast my vote for it

Лотос

9 years ago

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I'm trying to figure out how the author created that glow effect on the objects, like the magic schools, for example. I tried to replicate it in the editor, but everything looks dull. I'm still trying to figure it out.

In reply to Rambo1969

Heleg

9 years ago

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Rambo1969

I completed a new map created by drug addicts, without any "Astral Gates," in 39 days – and I got another Thunderlord (I was 129 points short of 10,000). It's frustrating; I wasted the last two days – a cowardly yellow gnome, instead of defending his Castle, started running away, so I had to chase him.
I deliberately destroyed all outposts I encountered along the way. After battles with outposts and key battles with opponents, I created demos again:

P.S. To view them, you need to place them in your profile folder; the standard path is:
My Documents\My Games\Heroes of Might and Magic V — Tribes of the East\Profiles[COLOR="Red"]Username[/COLOR]\Replays[br][/br]After that, enter the game and select "Settings" in the main menu, then "Recordings," then "Battle Recording." A list of available demos in that folder will appear, and you can choose one.

As for strengthening outposts, that's up to the creator, in my opinion – the map is already very interesting, and I enjoyed spending several evenings playing it, so thank you very much.

I reviewed the recording of the first battle. Are these "Phoenix" parameters provided by the map, or is it some kind of mod?

In reply to Heleg

Rambo1969

9 years ago

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Heleg

I reviewed the recording of the first battle. Are those "Phoenix" stats intended by the map, or is it some kind of mod?

What's wrong with it? It's a regular phoenix, and not even the most powerful one. :)

P.S. For example, here, I quickly retrained the hero on another map ("Uninvited Guests") from "Chaos" to "Summoning" and created a much "more interesting" monster. :smile51:

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Если споришь глупцом - срочно проверь не делает ли он тоже самое!:smile13:
Древняя восточная мудрость (вольный перевод)

In reply to Rambo1969

Heleg

9 years ago

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Rambo1969

What's wrong with it? It's just a regular phoenix, and not even the most powerful one. :)

P.S. For example, I quickly retrained the hero on another map ("uninvited guests") from "Chaos" to "Summon" and created a much "more interesting" monster. :smile51:

That is, with summoning magic, you can summon a phoenix with parameters higher than a non-summoned phoenix. Example in the first battle:
Attack - 80
Defense - 79
Damage - 291-436
Hit Points - 1170
In the second battle, it's actually a masterpiece:
Attack - 33
Defense - 33
Damage - 30-50
Hit Points - 150.

Added 35 minutes ago
I looked at the latest save, and what do the parameters of the summoned phoenix depend on? And do you refuse to play as the High Elves out of principle?

S.0.N.I.C.

9 years ago

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I'm new to the game and encountered a major problem. By the time I clear out the entire location, I lose about 50% of my army to the computer's guard (Phoenixes, Archangels, Lava Dragons, and Colossi). If I kill the guard on their side, there's practically no army left. Is it possible to weaken the guard so it's not so devastating?

In reply to Heleg

Rambo1969

9 years ago

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Heleg

That is, with summoning magic, you can summon a phoenix with parameters higher than a non-summoned phoenix. ... I looked at the latest save, and what do the parameters of the summoned phoenix depend on?

The summoned phoenix has little in common with a regular one (just as the death avatar of necromancers has nothing in common with a summoned dragon), it does not resurrect after being destroyed (at the same time, the hero who summoned it completely loses all his mana).
And the parameters of the summoned phoenix are determined by the level of magic of the hero who summoned it, and they are almost always higher than those of a regular one.

Heleg

And you don't play as the High Elves out of principle?

I play as all races, but I prefer Warlocks :)

Если споришь глупцом - срочно проверь не делает ли он тоже самое!:smile13:
Древняя восточная мудрость (вольный перевод)

In reply to Rambo1969

Heleg

9 years ago

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Rambo1969

I play as all races, but I prefer Warlocks.

I'm just curious, how would you approach these outposts while playing as the Light Elves?

S.0.N.I.C.

I'm a beginner, and I've encountered a major problem. By the time I clear everything inside the location, I lose about 50% of my army to the computer-controlled guards (Phoenixes, Archangels, Lava Dragons, and Colossi). If I kill the guards on their side, there's practically no army left... Is it possible to weaken the guards so it's not so difficult?

If you read the entire thread, you'll see that the author strengthened the guards based on player requests. The only way to weaken the guards is to play the map at a lower difficulty level.

In reply to Heleg

Rambo1969

9 years ago

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Heleg

I'm just curious, how would you approach these outposts while playing as the High Elves?

The High Elves have good blue-colored ranged units, but I think it would still be difficult without magic.
And if we're going to approach it that way, then for the sake of a clean experiment, we should try playing as the Barbarians (they are generally averse to magic).

I'll find some time to play and write about it later ;)

Если споришь глупцом - срочно проверь не делает ли он тоже самое!:smile13:
Древняя восточная мудрость (вольный перевод)