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Posts from HoMM3 HD is a mod (add-on) for the game Heroes of Might and Magic 3.

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In reply to Ment
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Ment
What do words have to do with it? Are you demanding real proof of the theory's elementary nature in this matter? Or what are you suggesting I prove in practice? That such things are not of scientific interest to me (because I wrote a little earlier, I will clarify that this applies specifically to me, I do not extend it to everyone)? Or did I miss some other thought?

I want to say that you do not understand the full depth of this elementary nature. Because it lies on the surface. Even if you can determine who is following whom in a real battle, there are still many other things to consider, and not just blindly look at the situation "I know who is following whom." The whole point is that when there are many thoughts and plans, when you think about how to win, the obvious (sequence) is lost due to scattered attention; multiply that by n rounds in a real game, and it can lead to failure, while the program will simply show it flawlessly. This is absurd. Online is not offline.
If you really played, you would understand what I'm talking about.
Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/
За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того
In reply to R55Max
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R55Max
It seems unfair to me that the ability to determine the turn order, remember it during battle, and account for all influencing factors is an unnecessary part of the game that should be eliminated!
Out of everything described above, this sentence only affects the second point.

Added 9 minutes later
By the way, a question for Dirty. Why do they record chess moves? Doesn't it affect the gameplay?! Someone might forget something and mess up, and you can win because of that...

It's the same here. It's just a battle, like a mini-game of chess. Nothing лишнего...
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Vatya
The numbers above/below/in/behind the units do not affect the gameplay in any way, but HD+ already breaks it, at least by changing the skill tree. So at the very least, it won't be any worse.
The skill tree is changed for offline mode; for online mode, it remains random with certain probabilities, as it was before. If it were somehow known what would be offered at the next level, then I would agree that this is a change for the better.
Vatya
Should we go back to pure SoD?
We're already playing SoD. HD+ isn't critical for me; the HD interface is enough. If a player wants to separate a unit, it's just a matter of time, whether it will take 1 second or 20. If a player wants to see how far a centaur will move, they can either turn on the highlight and spend 1 second, or count the squares for 30 seconds. But knowing who goes after whom is already a direct hint that is not provided by the game. For example, when all the stacks of griffins are gathered in one pile, and you need to guess which one will go first, then in this case, it's not the same.
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Vatya
Of everything described above, this statement only affects the second point.
LOL, are you talking about these points?
1. I only see one drawback. "I REALLY DON'T WANT TO" and no constructive input.
2. This is a forum, not just you and me chatting. Others will come, read, think about it, and there will be constructive discussion. It's pointless to expect it from you...
So, discuss these points. I agree, you don't want to, as they say, and that's why you abstain from constructive input. They tell you one thing, but you say that's not the case, and you can't explain why it's not the case, so you accuse others of lacking constructive input. I'm ready to discuss every detail.
МУДРЫЙ - не обязательно старый, ОПЫТНЫЙ - не обязательно мудрый... обладатель и того и другого всегда должен помнить слова НАПОЛЕОНА БОНАПАРТА: Война состоит из непредусмотренных событий; В каждом большом деле всегда приходится какую-то часть оставить на долю :smile33: СЛУЧАЯ...
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I want to say that you don't understand the full depth of this simplicity. Because it lies on the surface. Even if you can determine who is following whom in a real battle, there are still many other things to consider, and not just blindly look at the situation and think, "I know who is following whom." The point is that when there are many thoughts and plans, when you think about how to win, the obvious (the order) is lost due to scattered attention. Multiply that by n rounds in a real game, and it could lead to a failure, while the program will simply show it flawlessly. This is absurd. Online is not offline.
Let's assume. What is the difference between online and offline here? Is it that the opponent is deliberately trying to confuse you? Well, not everyone is like Max.
 

К А
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In reply to Dirty_Player
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Dirty_Player
If a player wants to separate a unit, it's just a matter of time – whether it takes 1 second or 20. If a player wants to see how far a centaur will move, they can either turn on the highlighting and spend 1 second, or count the squares, which will take about 30 seconds. But knowing who is moving after whom is a direct hint that is not provided by the game. For example, when all the stacks of griffins in the same area are gathered together, and you need to guess which one will move first, then this is no longer the same.
Why guess? You can simply spend 2-3 minutes reviewing and recording the moves. What's the difference? In both cases, it's just about time.

Added 2 minutes later
R55Max
LOL, are you talking about these points?

Well, then discuss these points. I agree, you don't want to, that's why you're avoiding constructive discussion. They tell you one thing, but you say it's not true, and you can't explain why it's not true, so you accuse others of not being constructive. I'm ready to discuss every detail.
Look above. You are arguing for the sake of arguing. Specifically for you, in all caps.

THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE GAMEPLAY, IT ONLY SAVES TIME!!! I CAN SIT WITH A NOTEBOOK AND RECORD EVERY MOVE, OR A MOD CAN DO IT FOR ME!!!!

I hope this is clearer?
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Vatya
Why guess? You can simply spend not 1 second, but 2-3 minutes watching and recording the moves. What's the difference? In both cases, it's just about time.
The difference is that it will say "Griffons fly here, griffons fly here, griffons fly here, griffons fly here..." but it's unclear what kind of griffons and where they are going, and you can't reconstruct it from the battle log.
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Vatya, with a chess timer in the game, you can even redraw the map; your time is yours to manage as you wish :) The idea significantly affects the gameplay and noticeably simplifies it; what's not to understand?
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Vatya

THIS DOES NOT AFFECT THE GAMEPLAY IN ANY WAY, IT JUST SAVES TIME!!! I CAN SIT WITH A NOTEBOOK AND WRITE DOWN EVERY MOVE, OR A MOD CAN DO IT FOR ME!!!!

I hope this is clearer now?
Listen, do you even live on this planet? I'm explaining to you that THIS IS NOT JUST ABOUT SAVING TIME!!!!

It saves time if both players know everything perfectly and have this information, and also know how to extract it correctly from their notebooks! The point is who knows what!

According to your logic, when playing Luna and before placing a wall of fire, the mod should definitely show you where the units will go, so you don't have to calculate their moves, waste time calculating the movement algorithm of the units (which cell they will end up on after the attack), and take into account the unit's hex and the terrain! Do you understand that this IS a hint, and its essence is extensive, and accepting it can lead to absurdity!

These knowledge of these nuances ALSO constitutes the skill of the player. It's not just about saving time!
МУДРЫЙ - не обязательно старый, ОПЫТНЫЙ - не обязательно мудрый... обладатель и того и другого всегда должен помнить слова НАПОЛЕОНА БОНАПАРТА: Война состоит из непредусмотренных событий; В каждом большом деле всегда приходится какую-то часть оставить на долю :smile33: СЛУЧАЯ...
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Dirty_Player
the difference is that it will say griffins fly here, griffins fly here, griffins fly here, griffins fly here... but it's unclear which ones and where, and you can't reconstruct it from the battle log.
You still haven't answered what the difference is between recording moves in chess and here. Why is it necessary there, but in Heroes it affects the gameplay?

Moreover, we're not even talking about the moves themselves, but simply about numbering the units.

And even with numbering, it will still be unclear which griffins are flying where...
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Vatya
You still haven't answered what the difference is between recording moves in chess and here. Why is it necessary there, but in Heroes it affects the gameplay?
In chess, recording is essential because controversial situations can arise (someone knocks pieces off the board). In Heroes, players also used to manually save games (record matches) until autosave was introduced. But writing down in a notebook where a particular griffin flew means getting distracted from other aspects of the game. And if you can record moves and use them to your advantage, then that's your skill, and you're doing great.

I'm not arguing, having an initiative bar would be convenient and comfortable (like in World of Xeen with the ability to measure distances with millimeter precision), but it's no longer necessary. In the pursuit of comfort, you can reach absurdity. IMHO.
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Vatya
You still haven't answered what the difference is between recording moves in chess and here. Why is it necessary there, but in Heroes it affects the gameplay?

Moreover, we're not even talking about the moves themselves, but simply about numbering the pieces.
For historical purposes, chess is not soccer; the record allows you to replay any game.
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Dirty_Player
I'm not arguing, having an initiative bar would be convenient and comfortable (as in WOT with the ability to measure distances with millimeter precision), but it's no longer necessary. In the pursuit of comfort, one can reach absurdity. IMHO.
Are you reading diagonally again? What initiative bar? Just numbers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 above/below/in/behind the stacks AND THAT'S IT!!!

Added 2 minutes later
Belendor
for history, chess is not football, you can replay any game from a recording
Here, too, for historical purposes, you can replay any battle from a recording (without taking morality into account). There are many recorded battles that people have used to learn how to play.
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In the end, the issue will still boil down to time or money (according to Murphy's Law). HD+ and the chess timer are all gameplay changes. When changes are implemented more or less smoothly, they are perceived more calmly.
to Vatya, although Heroes is often compared to chess, they are completely different games. And chess players record their moves because the rules require it; this instills discipline and provides information for the judges. And they generally have excellent memories. Numbering stacks, the skill tree, quick transfers and exchanges of troops and artifacts, and so on are also just a matter of time. Somewhere here lies the boundary where one person thinks it's a significant simplification, while another doesn't think so. And this is indeed a very debatable point. One could even argue based on the existing principle that the system of the universe tends towards simplification. Those who work faster with their hands but slower with their minds have their own arguments against quick-thinking "turtles" (almost like warriors against mages). I wouldn't agree that Heroes is purely an intellectual competition (especially since there's a timer), and making hundreds of clicks quickly is not the same as moving a piece, although you don't need to lift weights either. Simply, some kind of modernized operation will save more non-game time (the time wasted by slow-thinking players) than an intellectual with a good memory would like. Numbering stacks simplifies things for the former, while intellectuals are then at a disadvantage. But it may also be inevitable that touchscreens will develop, and quickly marking units on the screen may turn out to be easy and fast...
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here is the save file
the blue hero, controlled by AI, is attacking the Legion of Griffons in the world of Myrlund
there are almost no losses, only the Basilisks have changed – the horde has become a crowd
I replayed it in auto-battle mode, and the losses were much greater
it seems that the Griffons controlled by AI retreated, but in the editor, they never run away
HD+ is enabled
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