Discussion of third-tier monsters. — General

Zybr

4/24/2012 3:21 PM UTC

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Are you saying that the weekly increase in Djinns will make Ogre Mages viable in any case?

Of course. Just separate 1 Djinn from the main stack, and that's it.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Zybr

makiavelli990

4/24/2012 4:19 PM UTC

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Zybr

Of course. You separate 1 Djinn from the main stack, and that's it.

I tried it... 5 Djinns against 5 Ogre Mages (5 of each spawn in a week)
Djinns: 4-1
Ogre Mages: 1-1-1-1-1

Hmm... when applying Magic Shackles to the Djinns, 30 health was removed. I added "Energy Drain"... it removed 60.

So, I understand that you need to separate 1 Djinn so that the stack of Ogres can be hypnotized with the Song of Peace? (This is, of course, if there is only 1 stack of Ogres).
In general, in the first round, the Ogre Mages cast "Energy Drain" and "Magic Shackles" on 4 Djinns, and that was it...

By the way, if there are fewer than 4 Djinns in the stack, they won't be able to cast Illusion (but I guess everyone knows that).

I did all this on version 3.55.

So, I understand that if there are 50 Djinns against 50 Ogres, the outcome will change...? After all, Magic Shackles will still remove 60 health.

Added after 9 minutes
In general, yes, the damage from Magic Shackles depends on the amount of mana used by the opponent, that is, if Ice Dart costs 3 mana, the damage will always be 30.
“Illusion” also costs 3 mana, so the damage is the same...

dnaop-wr

4/25/2012 6:28 AM UTC

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Probably so. If in the regular Heroes of Might and Magic IV, with the right tactics, the increase in Djinns could overwhelm any monster of their level, then in the expansion, Ogres were improved, and a Djinn might not be able to stand up to them in a 1-on-1 fight, unless the Ogre starts casting buffs on itself while under the effect of the "Song" spell.

Техника в руках индейца мертва.
Справочник по НоММ-4 http://handbookhmm.ru/pamyatka-dlya-heroes-iv.html

Памятка по НоММ-3 http://handbookhmm.ru/pamyatka-dlya-homm-iii.html
и HotA http://handbookhmm.ru/vyishla-obnovlennaya-pamyatka-dlya-homm-iii-hota.html

Zybr

4/25/2012 6:58 AM UTC

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genies: 4-1
ogre mages: 1-1-1-1-1

hmm... when applying magic shackles to genies, 30 hit points were removed; I added "energy drain"... it removed 60.

So, I understand that you need to separate one genie so that the ogres can be hypnotized by the song of peace? (This is if there is only one stack of ogres.)
In general, in the first round, I had the ogre mages cast "energy drain" and "magic shackles" on 4 genies, and that was it...

By the way, if there are fewer than 4 genies in a stack, they won't be able to cast illusion (but I guess everyone knows that).

I did all this on the 3.55 patch.

If there are 1-1-1-1-1 ogres, I would go into melee combat with 4 genies. I would first cast "blessing" on the single genie, and then act according to the situation.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Zybr

makiavelli990

4/25/2012 7:32 AM UTC

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Zybr

If the ogres are 1-1-1-1-1, I would go with 4 genies in melee combat. I would first cast "Bless" on the genies, and then act according to the situation.

I've tried it, but genies have no chance.
Ogres also have "Blood Frenzy," "Serpent's Strike," and "Magic Resistance" in their spellbook.

Unless the opponent is really clueless, you can't win with genies.

ColdWarrior

4/25/2012 11:09 AM UTC

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It all depends on the number of Djinns; even though an Ogre-Mage won't defeat a Djinn in a one-on-one fight, other level 3 creatures, independent of magic, will kill him. It's good that they have an increased growth rate for Strength; they already gain it quickly. And they are inexpensive. A powerful combination: Enclosure, Festival of Life, Nobility (level 5) - 11 Thunderbirds per week).

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In reply to ColdWarrior

makiavelli990

4/25/2012 11:39 AM UTC

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nikitos palisos

It all depends on the number of Djinns; even if an Ogre-Mage doesn't defeat a Djinn in a 1-on-1 fight,

I think that even 100 Djinns wouldn't defeat 100 Ogres...
The most effective way to use Djinns is with illusions, but Ogres have very good Bless, so illusions will be easily countered, and you won't be able to cast many.
Ogres have 50% magic resistance, which doesn't allow Djinns to run wild...

In reply to makiavelli990

Rainer

4/26/2012 7:18 PM UTC

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Yes :) Everyone voted for vampires, but they were nerfed in Equilibris, and that's a good thing :D Now necromancers won't be able to resurrect them so actively. Regarding the topic. I like the ifrits, their abilities are also good, they are a decent unit :)

In reply to Rainer

Alor

5/1/2012 9:34 AM UTC

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Dear online players, I would like to ask you about the 3rd tier creatures of the Chaos faction: which ones are preferable to take in online games, the Kobolds or the Ifrits? I would very much like to hear the opinions of experienced players. Thank you in advance!

ColdWarrior

5/1/2012 11:33 AM UTC

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Perhaps Ifrits, with their flight and fire shield, are a good choice, although Nightmares have more health and deal more damage, and can cast Terror, but they are slower compared to Ifrits.

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In reply to ColdWarrior

Rainer

5/1/2012 9:37 PM UTC

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nikitos palisos

Probably, Ifrits with their flight and fire shield, although Nightmares are stronger in terms of health and damage and can cast Terror, but they are slower compared to Ifrits.

It all depends on the quantity :) If you want something more powerful but have limited funds, take Nightmares; they have 20 more hit points. And by the way, Terror is a preferable ability compared to the Ifrits' fire shield. :cool:

In reply to Alor

CTPAHHuK

5/2/2012 5:32 AM UTC

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Alor

Dear online players, I would like to ask you about the 3rd-level creatures of Chaos. Which ones are preferable to recruit online: Nightmares or Ifrits? I would very much like to hear the opinion of experienced players. Thank you in advance.

The choice depends on the map.

In online games, for example, when there is an opportunity to gather 20 or more 3rd-level monsters, it is undoubtedly more advantageous to take Ifrits in pairs with Champions of the Arena. Their high speed on the map and in battle leaves no chance for Nightmares. Another situation favorable for choosing Ifrits is playing with a tank or with damage dealers and a Demonologist in a hit-and-run strategy. The reason is the same.

But there are also maps where it is more advantageous to build Nightmares. Plains of Despair can serve as an example. It is very difficult to accumulate even 10 Ifrits before breaking through the defenses (in 2 game weeks). And in any case, it will not be easy to keep them safe while breaking through the defenses. And in the final stage, they are less useful than an expert of any magic. Therefore, 3rd-level creatures are simply not used by Chaos: they play with 6 heroes + Champions of the Arena. Of course, it is more convenient to use Ifrits for quickly building Champions of the Arena, but on the Plains map, I prefer to build Nightmares. With them, it is much easier to rob nature banks, and terror helps. Using them only in the first week and bringing them in a little later to break through some key points is much more advantageous than using Ifrits.

Heroes of might and magic 4 on-line World Championships

Rainer

5/25/2012 10:03 AM UTC

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I would like to replace the poisonous creatures with liches, as their appearance is very annoying, and the archer is not very good:mad:.

ColdWarrior

5/26/2012 8:38 AM UTC

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Nah, not bad. They might look ugly, but they can take down anyone in a straight line, especially with their poison. If they're on a Tower, it's hard to capture the Castle (unless you use Haven or Chaos magic). As for strength, I lost all my creatures by the time I reached them.

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In reply to ColdWarrior

Rainer

5/27/2012 6:37 AM UTC

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nikitos palisos

No, it's not bad. It looks like a real monster, but in a straight line, and with poison, they can take out anyone. If they're on a tower, it will be difficult to capture the castle (without the intervention of Haven or Chaos magic). As for strength, I lost all my creatures by the time I reached them.

It's a pity that their growth is small. And on small maps, you won't be able to gather many of them.