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Posts from 2009 World Championship for Heroes IV Online.
>> 5. At that point, I already had many suspicions about the judge's bias, as he was demanding save files.
If, for some reason, you are not satisfied with the judge's decisions, there are other judges. There are organizers, after all. And the judge's requirements must be followed. In any competition.
Your complaints are expressed quite coherently and eloquently. However, I know the people who have spoken out about this here as being quite reasonable and intelligent. Therefore, I think they have reasons for making a decision that is not in your favor.
As for your guilt, it is at least in the fact that you "set yourself up" by not following the direct instructions of the judge. That's all.
As for "what the save files are for," again, it would have been enough to say, "I didn't make any saves, the password for my game is %%%," and that would have been it. There wouldn't even have been any formal reason to disqualify you.
This is me, as a judge from the previous World Championship, speaking.
If, for some reason, you are not satisfied with the judge's decision, there are other judges. And ultimately, there are the organizers.
Happy New Year. And to whom did I address the letter on the previous page?
The judge's requirements must be followed. ... As for your guilt, it is at least in the fact that you "made yourself vulnerable" by not following the judge's direct instructions. That's all.
In my opinion, I explained in sufficient detail that the requirements were knowingly impossible to fulfill, especially after I stated that I could not provide several save files. Especially within such a short period of time. And regarding the requirements of the judges, which must be followed, what if a judge demands that you submit a report about a lost game, even if you won it? Will you blindly agree to this, or should you listen to common sense? You can answer "yes," but you will be wrong.... In any case, I would like the judges to at least somehow respond to player complaints. Otherwise, you can build such logic: The judge does not respond to a complaint -> he does not fulfill his direct functions (see point 1 of my previous message). He does not fulfill the functions of a judge -> he is not a judge. He is not a judge -> he has no right to demand anything. So, even if I am guilty of ignoring the judge's request (which I categorically deny), the judge STRANIK is guilty of not responding to my complaint a few days earlier. However, no sanctions are even being considered against him (see point 2 of my previous message). Although, this violation should be considered earlier!
Your claims are expressed quite coherently and beautifully. However, I know the people who have spoken out about this here as quite adequate and intelligent. Therefore, I think they have reasons to make a decision not in your favor.
I'm sorry if this offends you, but it sounds like this: it seems that you are right, but my friends are here, so I'm on their side... In any case, if the judges have any clearer reasons than "ignored an unreasonable request," then I, as a direct participant in the controversial situation, should be informed of them before all possible deadlines pass? I still haven't heard anything about them...
There wouldn't even be formal grounds for removal.
You are indirectly confirming bias against me, because it seems that there is only one formal reason to keep my opponent in the game. In a game that he lost miserably.
This is me, as a judge from the previous World Championship, speaking.
It remains only to regret that you are not a judge in this Championship. Although, I am ready to nominate you as a candidate on par with Zybr and Lee if justice prevails. Don't be alarmed, even I almost don't believe in it :) Not to mention...
Пандора
16 years ago
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Dear SkidVicious and commenters, you have already conveyed the main points of your complaints to the tournament organizers and its participants. Please pay attention to this point in oxygen_hl's message:
oxygen_hl
And one more thing: there will be no public discussion of the situation. If you have any questions, please contact the judging or organizing committee. We are always open to dialogue.
Therefore, I ask you not to clutter this thread with the same information repeated in different words, and also not to escalate this problem.
That’s how the news goes. I should have contacted you right away. And what complaint did my opponent file? And when did STRANIK hide this from me as well? I’m simply unaware of any of this and can’t even understand what my opponent might complain about (could it be that I play better?).
It’s strange that you’re asking such questions. But I’ll have to answer. The complaint from your opponent is that you are a cheater. He told you that too. And it’s strange to hear that you’re unaware of this; it seems like some kind of nonsense. The last assumption (in parentheses) is generally an excessive display of self-confidence. I understand that the game situation may have been in your favor, but since a controversial situation arose, you could at least try to prove it with facts rather than making baseless accusations against everyone.
Therefore, I ask you not to clutter this thread with the same information, rephrased in different words, and not to escalate this problem.
I respect your work and will follow your recommendations – I will not rephrase or escalate. I will simply respond to the judge... LordZezuk
It's strange that you are asking such questions. But I will have to answer. A complaint was received from your opponent that you are a cheater. He also told you this. And it's strange to hear that you are not aware of this; it's some kind of nonsense.
Aha, so that's what the complaint is about. In this case, it is quite obvious that judge STRANIK deliberately misled me (so as not to repeat myself, as Pandora requested, I will simply quote myself):SkidVicious
You misunderstood the situation. The first controversial situation arose when the opponent called me a cheater and left the game. I turned to judge STRANNIK (according to the Rules, see paragraph 1 of this message). And he, as he later told me, resolved this situation by telling me that the opponent would continue to play and everything would be fine. I decided to continue playing as if nothing had happened [...] Thus, the episode (the first controversial situation) is resolved. A few days later, I asked STRANNIK again to confirm that everything was indeed okay and that the opponent was playing. Answer: yes, he is playing.
And not a single word about the fact that such serious accusations were made against me. I think this explains the "strangeness" of my questions?
I understand that the game situation may have been in your favor, but since a controversial situation arose, you should at least try to prove it with facts, rather than making unsubstantiated accusations against everyone.
It is not possible, but definitely in my favor, without any doubt. I provided the facts that I was not aware of the opponent's complaint about cheating in this post.
Now I would like to hear evidence of my "cheating" in addition to the above requirements
shnurov_hl
16 years ago
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It’s not just possible, it’s definitely in my favor, and there’s no other option. I provided the facts about me not being aware of the opponent’s complaint about cheating in this post. In fact, no one is obligated to notify you about the opponent’s complaints.
Now, I would like to hear evidence of my “cheating” in addition to the above requirements. How can this be verified when you haven’t provided any save files or passwords? :D
I apologize if this offends you, but it sounds like this: it seems you are right, but my friends are involved, so I’m on their side... No. It means that I, not being a judge, don’t have all the information. In particular, I wasn’t aware of the communication between the judging panel and your opponent. That’s why I say that they probably have grounds to make such decisions, although I’m not informed about them. :)
You are indirectly confirming bias against me, because it seems there is only one formal reason to keep my opponent in the game, even though they lost badly. Bias... Hmm. I don’t know. A lot needs to be done and said to create bias.
Although, I am ready to nominate you as a candidate on par with Zybr and Lee. Thank you, but I was offered to be a judge for this Competitive event. I declined. :)
if justice prevails All that was needed was to send the save file and password by email...
Zybr
16 years ago
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SkidVicious, you should still refrain from making harsh statements. I'm talking about accusations of bias. Try to be more neutral in your posts. Of course, it's possible that you were a little upset by the decision, but it's not worth putting up barriers. It simply won't turn out well for you, purely from a psychological point of view.
And one more thing: there will be no public discussion of the situation. If you have any questions, please contact the judging or organizing committee. We are always open to dialogue.
No one is obligated to notify you about your opponent's complaints.
I'm not asking to be notified about every complaint, only about the complaint against me. I should be able to defend myself. Let's assume that everything is as you think, but why deceive me twice about the opponent being ready to continue the game? In any case, I still believe that I have not violated anything, because I am not obligated to fulfill the absurd demands of the judges, since the rules do not say anything about it! A judge in all sports is a person who monitors compliance with the rules, and not imposes his own... I wonder why they asked me for the saves not immediately after the opponent complained, but two weeks later? :) Again, only one answer suggests itself....
How can this be checked when you have not provided any saves or password? :D
I am ready to provide the save and have never refused to do so. But again, it seems to me that they should prove my guilt, and not my innocence, right? For example, it would be good to know the opponent's arguments, what exactly he suspects me of. Otherwise, anyone can claim that their opponent is a cheater when they are in an absolutely losing position. Then a familiar judge will demand saves that do not exist and award defeats...
All that was needed was to send the save and password by mail...
You are setting me up for Pandora's wrath :) I will repeat briefly: it was impossible to fulfill the requirements, despite all my desire... Zybr
Of course, it is possible that you were slightly wronged in the decision, but it is not worth putting up barriers. This will simply not turn out well for you, purely from a psychological point of view.
You see, it won't turn out well for me in any case (everyone understands that no one will award me a legitimate victory), so I will at least demand something for others :) By the way, so far I have complaints only about one judge and I still hope for the common sense of the organizers and other judges...
SkidVicious, my ICQ number is listed in my profile. There are private messages. There is email. Or maybe I didn't express myself clearly? If so, Pandora clearly pointed out my request to you.
And the second point. You have no evidence to support your accusations. But there is quite concrete evidence against you.
If you want to continue, give permission to publish the full correspondence with the judging panel. If you're not ashamed, of course.
Until I receive this permission, I ask the moderators of this section to delete all messages related to this topic. Because these are unsubstantiated provocations.
Well, that's a worthy decision. However, it only confirms that I was right...
Now we wait for the election of the third judge, or will the remaining two judges decide on controversial issues (is a 1-1 outcome possible)? This interests me because I want to know if my case will be considered by three (with the newly elected judge) or two judges? oxygen_hl
SkidVicious, my ICQ number is listed in my profile. There are private messages. There is email.
I sent you a message on September 17, 2009, but I haven't received a response yet. But here, there are responses... oxygen_hl
Or maybe I didn't express myself clearly?
This and the following questions seem as if you are trying to offend me and provoke me. But I won't give in to the provocation, especially since my requirements regarding the judge have been met. All that remains is to finally award me the victory, but this is already the responsibility of the judges, so I no longer see any reason to communicate with you, especially since you are so aggressively настроены...
Added: I see that my defeat is listed in the table. Not surprising. It's a pity that the judges didn't inform me about this (at least, the distribution of votes, not to mention the reason). I hope that the respected Shnurov won't say that no one is obliged to inform me of the results of my games :)
fairly judging, they can't say anything, as usual they will defeat each other.
oxygen_hl
16 years ago
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Judges' decision regarding the match between Skid Vicious and Lord Nadicus.
Skid Vicious receives a technical defeat. Lord Nadicus advances to the next round. The decision was made by the judges: Lord Zezuk, DJN.
Reasons: repeated failure to comply with the judges' requirements by player Skid Vicious.
Skid Vicious refused to publish his personal correspondence with the judging panel, and therefore I ask all players and viewers to treat his description of the situation as a subjective opinion that does not claim to be the truth.
Neither I nor the judges will engage in a debate due to the lack of evidence and the player's refusal to publish the correspondence. Simply put, there is no point in retelling the conversation in a way that is favorable to each side. The decision was made based on the fact that the judges' requirements were ignored. And that is the end of it.
The judges' decision regarding the match between Skid Vicious and Lord Nadicus.
Do you understand how ridiculous you look? :)
So that my words are not again called distorted, I will present the facts to the public (I remind you that the organizers consider only their words and the words of the judges to be facts, and the words of the opposition are a priori distorted), i.e., I will present only the words of the organizers and the judges.
Fact #1:oxygen_hl
Skid Vicious receives a technical defeat. Lord Nadicus advances to the next round. The decision was made by the judges: Lord Zezuk, DJN.
Reasons: repeated failure to comply with the judges' requirements by player Skid Vicious.
Fact #2:oxygen_hl
Player [Skid Vicious] is accused not of not making saves, but of ignoring the judge's request. At the time of the request, at least one save was available. There were no complaints about the number or frequency of saves.
And where is the "repeated" failure? :) No other requirements were presented to me; they are not mentioned here. It turns out that I simply ignored an absurd request from a judge who is not really a judge! :) And this has nothing to do with the reason for my technical defeat. So, is the judges' decision wrong? :)
Third fact: My defeat in the official tournament table was recorded long before the official decision, which is a gross error by the organizers responsible for filling it out.
Isn't that too many errors in one direction? "I haven't read Pasternak, but I condemn him" (c) :)
Fact #4:LordZezuk
A complaint was received from your opponent that you are a cheater. He also told you this.
Since the judging panel did not recognize me as a cheater, we can conclude that I am not a cheater (damn, how logical :)). In addition, no arguments were presented to me or the public. Therefore, the words of Lord Nadicus are a very serious statement and, in particular, an insult to me as an honest player. Therefore, as a participant (not only as an opponent) in the tournament, I have already filed complaints with the judges DJN and Lord Zezuk via email (although the latter has not yet responded to my previous requests) against the player LordNadicus: 1. Serious insult to player Skid Vicious, i.e., me. 2. The lack of reaction from the judges to baseless accusations of cheating by players in the tournament in an absolutely losing game discredits the organization! If there is still room for more :)
Now, personally to the organizer oxygen_hl:oxygen_hl
Skid Vicious refused to publish personal correspondence with the judging panel.
Why are you asking for permission? Do you have it?
oxygen_hl
16 years ago
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And where is the repeated violation? No other requirements were presented to me; they are not mentioned here. It turns out that I simply ignored the absurd demand of a judge who is not actually a judge! And this has nothing to do with the reason I received a technical defeat. So, is the judges' decision incorrect?
The requirement to cease the discussion on the forum was repeatedly violated, both by me and by the forum moderator.
Third fact: My defeat in the official tournament table was recorded long before the official decision, which is a gross error by the organizers responsible for filling it.
Long before the publication of the official decision. If you don't feel the difference, then I have nothing to add.
And why are you asking for permission? Do you have it?
No. I don't have it. I very much hope that you will find the answer to the question "why me" yourself. Fortunately, this is completely irrelevant to the matter.
Brennus Whiskey still can't figure out what to accuse us of. Sometimes he says that we are defending the Russians. A Frenchman participates – it means we are supporting our friends. But even here, he is wrong; for example, I am not familiar with Nadikus at all. Sorry that I am reacting to blatant trolling, but I couldn't help myself.
Since Pandora is reacting very slowly, I will probably request moderator rights for this section for one of the judges.
