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Posts from Examples of how to conduct complex battles (detailed turn by turn). Everyone must read this!Auto-translated
The best result without magic was – 3 surviving goats and two ifrits, all of them Magogs.
Yeah, it definitely doesn't seem suitable for online play; there are too many critical moments, and even in the "best-case" scenario, the losses aren't really worth the reward. Losing almost the entire army, except for the Magogs (an Ifrit might survive, or maybe not at all), and the Magogs are only useful for the endgame or as cannon fodder for demons... So, it turns out that the entire "meat shield" – the main attacking force – consists of 4 angels? And they won't be reinforced from the castle until the end of the second week; the only hope is for clues and more conscripts, but if you're aiming for the maximum, there won't be many conscripts available. 4 angels are often more effective than a depleted army, but it will also be difficult to secure a large number of conscripts with them later on, and running around with only 4 angels until day 127 isn't very promising... P.S. This tactic is practically no different from taking the maximum number of conscripts with Elves on the 2nd week, but there's much less risk and fewer losses. Also, there are some doubts about: 1) the army's survivability (it would be good to write down the losses after each attack, even if it's just an approximate estimate). 2) why attack the griffins with demons? And in general, why attack everyone except the ifrits in the first round? 3) what guaranteed force distracts the Griffin King from the Magogs in the first round? (For the Elves, it's the Dryads, which will definitely take the hit (if they're near the Elves) and hold them back in the second round thanks to their roots).
The main thing is that the griffins don't get morale problems.
Обыкновенный любитель игры в героев..:smile43: Не профессионал:smile49: но и не аутсайдер:smile10: Могу сыграть с любым соперником на рейтинг!:smile08: Ася - 415-646-988:smile02:
I just tested taking the maximum number of Dwarf Mines with a Stronghold army, using the strategy from the first post in this thread: I must say, it's excellent work; the atmosphere of despair is 100% captured. Only 4 Goblin units are lost, but the morale... (with 2 morale, and once with a full stack, the losses were 1 Roc and 15 Goblins, because if they receive morale in the first 9 rounds, they will, at best, kill the units needed to remove retaliation, because even with retaliation removed, the Roc has less than 10 HP left at the end...).
I'll add that I just checked: with a similar army, but a Swamp army, Dwarf Mines 20 can definitely be taken. I just took it using a similar strategy, but with a level 5 Vistan, Expert in Ranged and Defense, stats 2-7, and an army with the following setup: 23 Lizardmen, 1 Fly, 1 Fly, 36 Gnolls, 1 Fly, 1 Fly, 2 Wyverns. I lost 2 Flies, although I suspect it could have been done without sacrificing them (Lizardmen have twice as many arrows, and their damage is close to that of Orcs with Jabar's Hammer, and Flies are better at distracting). There are so many Gnolls - they are a hidden unit, which are level 1, and they appear more often than level 3, which is needed to get 23 Orcs in the first week...
Now I'll try to take Dwarf Mines 30.
Added after 36 minutes
I also took Dwarf Mines 30, but with a slightly more developed Vistan and a slightly stronger army. Vistan is level 6, let's say with a Centaur Axe, stats 4-8, Expert in Defense and Ranged (the other 3 skills can be useless, although Offense could also be useful). The army is also quite good for the first week for Vistan - a hidden stack of Gnolls and Lizardmen, but this is quite common. I found Dwarf Mines only with an upgraded stack, which, of course, spoiled the plans a bit, but not much. The setup is also quite questionable: 1 Fly - 1 Fly - 1 Fly - 40 Gnolls - 1 Fly - 31 Lizardmen - 2 Wyverns, the losses are ridiculous, but I took it randomly on the first try - 11 Gnolls and 3 Flies.
Tactics: put a Fly in front of the upgraded stack so that, while blocking the Lizardmen, they attack the Fly, use another Fly to remove retaliation in the first round, then attack the upgraded units with Wyverns and Gnolls, then, closing in the lower corner, finish off the 2 stacks that arrive (with morale, there may be greater losses of Gnolls or the loss of a Wyvern), and lead the 2 remaining stacks with the surviving Fly to victory. With ranged attacks at half strength, 7 arrows remained at the end of the battle (this is in response to the question of whether an upgrade for Lizardmen is needed in the first week).
Ибу ибуди - хуйдао муди - Шаг за шагом можно достигнуть цели (китайская мудрость)
Кто к нам с пером придёт, тот от пера и погибнет!:smile51:
Bone, respect to you for testing!
Regarding the gnomish strategy against Barbarians, I think the tactic is designed for Throne of the Elements (TE), where morale is disabled for neutral creatures. In TE, starting as Vistan, players upgrade lizards to level 111 without hesitation (damage increases and ammunition is replenished), and without morale, they attack any gnomish settlement.
As for Shades of Darkness (SoD), the start is not as easy... and you need to be more careful with morale. It all depends on whether we need to take such a risk. It's easier in TE. I even managed to capture a max-level gnomish settlement as Fortress!
P.S.: If you're going to describe something, don't forget to include screenshots for clarity.
Capturing Utopia-3 (3 Golden Dragons, 4 Black Dragons, etc.) with Necropolis on the 2nd week. Hero: Galtran, level 10.
Necropolis is considered one of the strongest castles on random maps in many scenarios. Often, to maintain a good pace, it's necessary to capture Dragon Utopia early. One way to do this is with an army of 270 Skeleton Warriors, 20 Zombies, Galtran with Expert Defense, Earth, and Advanced Attack (which can be replaced with Bloodlust magic). In the spellbook, have Shield and Stone Skin.
The point is that it doesn't always make sense to bring Wyverns and Angels to Utopia, as antimorale is possible, or there may be fewer than 5 Angels. This always leads to unnecessary losses, while sacrificing Skeletons can often be beneficial to gain control or acquire good artifacts. The battle takes place on neutral ground; on Necropolis ground, everything is the same, only upgrading the Skeletons is not necessary. On grass or underground, the turn order of the Dragons will differ. I suggest experimenting on your own.
Dragons make their first moves differently, so in the example, I will only show one of the options. Attack/Defense 7-7, no attack but with Bloodlust. There should be enough mana for 8 rounds, and the magic power should be at least 4, so that spells are cast on the Skeletons in each round.
Round 1: Black and Golden Dragons attack the Zombies. Red and Green Dragons attack the single Skeletons. With a single Skeleton, we remove the retaliation from the Green Dragons (sometimes it's not possible to reach them, then the first attack is on the Red Dragons), we surround them with single Skeletons, and the main stack attacks them as well. Cast Mass Shield on the troops.
Round 2: Golden and Green Dragons attack the single Skeletons. Cast Stone Skin, and attack the Golden Dragons.
Round 3: Red Dragons attack with a burning effect (sometimes they don't do this). Cast Bloodlust, and attack the Green Dragons.
Round 4: And so on, we maneuver and make sure that the Skeletons are always under the effect of a spell.
Dude, respect for testing! Regarding the gnomish strategy against Barbarians, I think it's designed for Test Environment (TE) where neutral creature morale is disabled.
That's exactly where I tested the max gnomish strategy, but with morale enabled. There wasn't an option to disable it back then, and I generally don't play with morale disabled.
РП (Реальное папство!) *Автосейвы не беру и не даю.
Bone, respect to you for testing! Regarding the gnomish strategy against Barbarians, I think the tactic is designed for Throne of the Elements (TE), where neutral morale is turned off. In TE, starting as Vistan, they upgrade Lizards to level 111 without thinking (damage increases and ammunition is added) and, without morale, they attack any gnomish settlement. As for Shades of Darkness (SoD), the start there isn't as easy... and you have to be more careful when attacking with morale. It all depends on whether we want to take such a risk. It's easier in TE. I even managed to capture the maximum number of gnomish settlements as Fortress on level 111!
P.S.: If you're going to describe something, don't forget to include screenshots for clarity.;)
Example of taking a tier 2 resource node with a polished army, not on grass, for a tower in the beginning of week 2. Hero: Nella, level 6, with 2, 4, 3, 2 experience. Equipped with experience-boosting armor, experience-boosting waterskin, basic literacy, and haste in the spellbook.
Why a tier 2 army? Because there are no strong creatures, no ambushes, no ranged attacks, no mass magic, only native troops.
Brief description and setup: 10 mages, 1 griffin, 13 gargoyles, 5 greater nagas, 15 golems, 120 mushroom men, 1 gargoyle.
For accuracy, screenshots are provided below.
First, the gray griffins move, attacking the 13 gargoyles. Then, the naga casts haste on the mushroom men and attacks the griffins (see screenshots). The mushroom men push them to the lower left corner. The remaining griffins move. The gargoyles and golems defend. The mages attack the griffins in melee.
In the next round, the gray griffins attack the mushroom men. Haste is cast on the mages. The mushroom men wait. The nagas attack the griffins. The mages position themselves in front of the gremlins. The remaining griffins attack the golems. The mushroom men finish off the gray griffins in melee.
After that, finishing off the griffins is just a matter of technique! :smile14:
P.S. I hope someone finds this interesting. Please don't judge too harshly, as I haven't been playing online for very long, only 3 months! :smile13:
P.S. With the right actions, the resource node can be taken without problems, with minimal losses and minimal risk.
I don't know if it's a difficult battle or not, but without Nagas or oil, it's best not to mess with the Medusa nest. And yet:
Capturing a minimal Medusa nest with an upgraded stack. (4 Medusas per stack, on snow) Level 1 Alchemist hero. Army and formation: 80 Gremlins-1 Gremlin-4 Gargoyles-2 Gargoyles-1 Gremlin-4 Gargoyles-6 Golems
Round 1 The stacks of 4 Gargoyles lock down the upgraded Medusas — it will hold for 4-6 rounds. 2 Gargoyles fly to the right middle stack. The main Gremlin stack takes out the top left Medusas. Single Gremlins lock down the top right Medusas. The upgraded Medusas hit the Gargoyles — petrification. The top right Medusas kill 1 Gremlin. The bottom right Medusa stack shoots the Golems (always!). The middle right Medusa stack melee attacks the Golems (always!) — petrification. This happens because the Gremlins are too far away (broken arrow range) and the Golems are too close. If the Golems are not petrified, they should move right and down.
Round 2 The Gremlins take out the Medusas near the Golems. 2 Gargoyles block the bottom right Medusas. The remaining three Medusa stacks fight in their corners, and the bottom right stack cannot take out the two Gargoyles in one hit. If in round 1 the top right stack panicked and killed the single Gremlins, then 2 Gargoyles fly to them.
Round 3 The Gremlins hit the top right stack. The upgraded Medusas are still locked down. The bottom right Medusa stack breaks free.
Round 4 The upgraded Medusas break free. The Gremlins kill them. The Golems recover from petrification, but the bottom right Medusa stack will likely shoot the Gremlins — however, at broken arrow range, they won't kill many. In rounds 5 and 6, we finish off the remaining Medusas.
If the Gremlins hit weakly and a single Medusa remains, don't hesitate — finish it off with the shooter. It's also a good idea to cast Slow on the upgraded Medusas and Stone Skin or Haste on the Gremlins. Approximate losses: 2-8 Gremlins, 6-10 Gargoyles, and 2-4 Golems. If you'd like to check, here's the save
PS For Tower, capturing a Medusa nest before building Nagas is not relevant — the respawn is usually rich, but rough cases do happen.
Taking on the maximum-sized stack (40 griffons per stack) as a rampart on the second week, author - Forrest
We have an Ivor, level 5. Expert in ranged attack, expert in attack. 3-6 (attack/defense).
We attack the maximum-sized stack with upgraded units. Not on grass. IMHO, this isn't crucial. The army: 1 Kent, 9 Dryads 70 Kents, 6 Unicorns, 1 Kent 30 Elves, 20 Dwarves (if you change the formation, the griffons will immediately eliminate the elves.) (The stacks are a bit large. But it's the maximum stack, what did you expect?) But the army is real, taken from a real game without reinforcements.)
Round 1. White griffons attack the Kents (minus 20). The Elves move to the left and down. Unicorns are positioned opposite the Elves, one square away (they can't reach them directly). The upper right griffons eliminate the Dryads (minus 2). The upper left unit moves next to the upper left griffons. The main Kents move, targeting the Elves in the lower left corner (50 health remaining). The lower right griffons attack the Dwarves (minus 7). The upper left griffons eliminate the unit. The last pack of griffons eliminates the Dryads (-2). The Dryads are on defense. The Dwarves are positioned as close as possible to the Unicorns.
Round 2. White griffons eliminate the Dryads (minus 2). The Elves attack the upper left griffons (damage over 400). The Unicorns wait. The Kents are on defense. The pack of griffons that attacked the Dwarves in round 1 eliminates them. Our last unit moves, positioning itself next to the Dryads between the griffons that attacked them. The upper left griffons fly to the center. The griffons eliminate the last unit. Another one eliminates the Dryads (minus 2). One Dryad remains. The Unicorns eliminate the nearest basic griffons (thanks to the last Dryad surviving and holding back the white griffons).
Round 3. The white griffons eliminate the last Dryad, freeing everyone. (We have Elves protected by 50 Kents, 6 Unicorns (we'll protect them after the Elves' move). In fact, the battle is already won. Using the well-known method of not completely eliminating the nearest griffons. The main thing is to protect the Kents (that is, first eliminate those that damage them). With Blind, the battle is won without any problems (its probability is high, which makes everything easier, even if it happens only once in the battle).
Estimated losses: 3-4 Unicorns, all Kents, all Dwarves, all Dryads.
Addition from Gynnar: This tactic is universal for all factions where one of the combat stacks is ranged (i.e., you can use the same principle to break stacks on the second week, playing as Tower, Castle, but not in such large numbers, since these castles don't have such a powerful level 5 unit as the Elves).
Today, I took on a level 123 stack with upgraded units on grass. 1 Kent, 9 Dryads, 65 Kents, 6 Unicorns, 1 Kent, 28 Elves, 32 Dwarves. Base with ranged attack and advanced offense and defense. I took more Dwarves to preserve the Unicorns. So, the griffon stack doesn't move first, but my Unicorns do. I position them in front of the white griffons (I don't attack, because Blind can prevent creating a pocket), and they, the bastards, deal damage to the Elves - a total of minus 7. 21 Elves, 50 Kents, and 6 Unicorns remain. I'm not saving the game because of the Time Event (maybe that's why they attacked the Elves? :)). But the fact remains
I don't upload the save because few people are interested in it (maybe that's why it's about Elves? :)), but the fact remains.
When I was testing, I also wondered about this. Even in the tests, battles unfolded differently from the same save... I concluded that who knows what these griffins will decide and who they will attack :smile32:
I also had some doubts that the white creatures would attack anything BUT the elves... I tested a save with maximum console commands and a buffed unit on the portal for Ivor... I identified 2 reasons why I thought the white griffins' actions were logical: 1. Unit Placement ...depending on the placement, if the centaurs are in the 1st or 6th slot (elves in the 3rd) or the elves are in the 6th, and the centaurs are in the 3rd - then they would definitely not attack the elves in the first round... but with other placements, they sometimes attacked the elves. 2. Strength of the elf stack ...according to the save, it was approximately 32, and there is an opinion that the griffins either specifically feared the elves (counter-attacks) or simply the counter-attack from the elves was stronger than from the centaurs. 3. Hero Ivor is a specialist in elves, who buffs them... increasing the effect of point #2 P.S. I think I heard something similar when analyzing the capture of mermaids, etc., when dragons are afraid to attack a stack of trolls, for example, if their number (stack strength) is greater than a certain number... the same applies to angels.
Quite often, the Greys attack Elves.
Based on my observations, this happens when we have more melee units.
In other words, they seem to realize they're losing and attack those who deal more damage. But when we haven't reached that point in terms of the balance of power, they usually attack the melee units and block the archers. Although there's also an element of randomness – sometimes, the same save yields different results. I don't know, anyway. It's unpleasant when the Greys attack the Knights, and you just sigh: like, "yay, here you go" – and then they always attack the archers, and it hurts the Knights. Okay, that's not what I wanted to write about.
So, the Grey pack doesn't go first; my unique units do. I position them in front of the white Griffons (I don't attack, because Blindness might prevent creating a pocket).
I would attack, and I always do.
Blindness, firstly, reduces the number of white Griffons without losing hit points on the Knights, and secondly, nothing will prevent us from shooting at the top units and retreating to the upper left in the second round. It seems to always work, as far as I remember.
Hello everyone, I read the posts and couldn't find how to deal with the Naga Bank, so here's an example for variety: Minimum Naga Bank: 2 Royal Nagas and 8 regular Nagas. We have a level 3 Shakti with advanced attack and 118 Trolls. Ideally, there should also be Harpies and troops from 3 heroes, but without them. Speed: The upgraded Nagas move first (7), then all our Trolls (6), and the regular Nagas have a speed of 5. Formation: Place one Troll each, and the main stack under number 2.
Round 1. The Royal Nagas cannot reach the main Troll stack; they attack the central unit, number 4.
I tested this setup several times. I took the save from a real game. In the first turn, the upgraded Nagas always kill unit number 1, so there's nothing to retaliate with, but the main Troll stack still usually kills the upgraded Naga stack. But it's still better to have more Trolls, at least ten more. Next, it's very important to position unit number 3 correctly, two squares from the left edge; otherwise, the Nagas from the upper left corner will bypass it and attack the main Troll stack. Then, if the Nagas don't get morale boosts and the Trolls deal maximum damage, the Nagas will fall one by one, and the losses will be only 15 Trolls. But if you're not lucky, you'll lose half the Trolls, and you might even lose, but that's only if you're really unlucky and the Nagas get morale boosts in a row.
Военное дело просто и вполне доступно здравому уму человека. Но воевать сложно.
Alex_R
