Posts from Harmony - Troop Symmetry Auto-translated

I rearranged the spells within the magic schools – the result is quite interesting:
---Darkness---Light---Summoning---Chaos---
Fire Wall---Blind---Teleport---Earthquake

Only the Fire Wall spell has changed level – now it’s level four; I’ll need to recolor it or something similar – it will be called “Wall of Shadows.”

Updated the first post.

I've made changes to the spell placements within the schools of magic – the result is quite interesting:
---darkness-----------light----------summoning-----------chaos------
fire wall-----blindness-----teleport------earthquake

Only the fire wall's level has changed – now it's a fourth-level spell; I'll also need to recolor it or something similar – it will be called "wall of shadows."

For now, it's unclear what the purpose of this is and why these decisions were made; they are not at all obvious.
Out of everything described above, I could personally agree only with the teleport spell, and even then, only if it can be cast not only on friendly units but also on enemy units (in that case, it would logically fit better under summoning than light). I tried this version, but then I reverted it: teleporting enemies turned out to be too overpowered and less interesting (just teleport archers to the front and you win).

It's not yet clear what the purpose is and why, these are completely obscure decisions.
Out of everything described above, I would personally only agree with the teleport, and even then, only if it can be cast not only on your own units but also on enemy units (then, logically, it would fit better under summoning than light). I tried this option, but then I went back: teleporting to enemy units turned out to be too overpowered and less interesting (you can carry ranged units to victory at the start and that's it).

I'll explain:
1. Blinds with nothing but a flash of LIGHT, hence the placement of this spell.
2. Summoning magic, which is also creation magic, should summon or create something, and should be related to spatial spells. Chaos magic, which is also destruction magic, should have spells that destroy and deal damage - hence the placement of the "earthquake" spell.
3. The teleport is already clear.
4. To maintain balance, something from chaos needs to be moved to darkness - "wall of fire" is more or less suitable, but it needs to be reworked - firstly, let it be black and purple, secondly, the name should be "abyss of shadows" or "wall of shadows", and thirdly, the question is - can it be made so that when passing through the wall, damage is not dealt, but a curse of dark magic is applied???

Teleporting to enemy units turned out to be too overpowered.

It would be good to set a range for the "teleport" ability...

I'm explaining:
1. It blinds with a flash of LIGHT.

Remember how the "blindness" spell works.
If a flash blinds, the blindness effect shouldn't wear off after attacking the target.

I think that, considering the overall picture (the balance of power among the schools of magic), "blindness" would be best placed in the "Summoning" school (and renamed to "Visions," for example).

Yes, and one more thing... I keep forgetting to suggest:
"Vampirism" should only work on undead (common sense and balance).


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As I understand it, you can't delete posts yourself, right?

In general, because of:
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this happened...

It would be great to set a range for the "teleport" ability...

I disagree with the teleport and the blinding effect – blinding definitely doesn't belong in the summon ability, and the essence of teleportation is moving to any point in space without traversing it linearly, but through another dimension or by warping space – I would make all teleporting units have maximum speed (so they can at least move diagonally and cover the map during a siege) – these would be faceless and teleporting demons.

the essence of teleportation

and the essence of a peasant is to impale everyone. But for some reason, he doesn't do that in Heroes 5. (apparently, we need to wait for Heroes 8)

Regarding "blinding" - in my opinion, it would be desirable for the key magic of the game to be distributed evenly across all types of magic, and not to gather everything in one.
Teleportation, in theory, differs from a portal in that the creature must see where it is teleporting to. And the range of vision is affected by the size of the unit

I don't know. Refreshing the page copies posts (when information about an error appears).

Updated the first post; I'll finish the dwarves and orcs soon (I don't have much time).

General skill tree for all factions (some ideas taken from related threads).

Will a lucky wizard have any effect on a Barbarian? After all, he has spells that deal damage.

Regarding the plague tent – I think the skill isn't very useful, and it's also weaker compared to the ballista. If you max out "rapid fire" on the ballista, you get one shot for the "ballista" skill and one shot for the "rapid fire" skill. But with the plague tent, after learning "plague tent," you have to take the "tent" skill, and when dealing damage with the tent, you don't get anything from the "tent" skill. In other words, two interchangeable skills can't work simultaneously, so I discarded the plague tent.

The Barbarian is not affected by Special Ability, so in my mod, a replacement effect will be added to this perk: +X to Knowledge, where X is the level of the Luck skill.

Regarding the plague tent, I don't think the skill is very useful.

That's right, in the original game, there's too much health, so the damage from the tent isn't noticeable compared to a ballista. And there are only 3 shots from the tent (if it hasn't changed).

For these reasons, in the original game, the first perk won't work without a replacement, and the second is not very effective.

Added 7 hours 59 minutes ago

Explanation:
1. Blinding is caused by a flash of LIGHT, hence the movement of this spell.

Blinding is the deprivation of sight. Which can happen from anything, including a flash of light. Including the effect on the mind (darkness). Including from a fog cloud (summoning). Including from burning out the eyes (chaos). It all depends on the desire, and blinding can be explained anywhere. But from the point of view of game logic, blinding is definitely a negative effect, and its place is in darkness.

"Vampirism" should only work on undead (common sense and balance).

It is impossible to implement the effect only on undead. It is possible to implement that access to this spell will only be available to a necromancer, but it is not a fact that the necromancer will only walk with undead, right? What about mixing troops or hiring a necromancer from another city? In addition, vampirism is also a dark analogue of removing curses. It is not for nothing that an additional effect "becomes undead" was added to it.

It's impossible to implement an effect that only targets undead creatures. You could implement a system where only a Necromancer has access to this spell, but it's not a given that a Necromancer will only use undead creatures, right? What about mixing troops or hiring a Necromancer from another town?
Besides, vampirism is also a dark analogue of dispel. It's no coincidence that it has an additional effect: "becomes undead."

And how can you make it accessible only to a Necromancer? - for example, by linking it to a skill and giving access to this skill only to Necromancers; then, when encountering a hero with dark magic and the "scholar" skill, he will be able to teach them this spell - but that's not the way to do it.
...so how do you do it? - there's the Banshee's Cry spell; it can't be learned, just like Prayer and Inspiration; how does that work?

I completely forgot to post this here – now, suppression won't only apply to Orcs; almost all races will have the ability to learn only a certain set of schools, while suppressing the rest.
1. Elves will suppress Darkness; Light is their forte. Furthermore, considering their connection to the elements (as is the case with High Elves), they need the schools of Chaos and Summoning.
2. High Elves will suppress Light; they can learn everything else.
3. Orcs – access to all suppressions and no magic schools.
4. Mages – access to all magic schools and no suppression.
5. Humans learn Light, suppress Darkness; Chaos and Summoning are not their forte, but they will still have two magic schools in the guild, so they can learn Summoning in the guild, and thus learn Summoning, while suppressing Chaos.
6. Dwarves – learn Chaos, suppress Darkness; they also learn Light and Summoning.
7. Demons – specialists in Chaos and Darkness; they definitely suppress Light, and probably Summoning as well – creation is clearly not their thing.
8. Undead – develop Darkness and Summoning; they suppress Chaos and Light.

Added 6 minutes later
Here's another idea – could we make access to Specialization through one racial and two common skills, instead of one racial and three common skills? – it's almost never achieved, so what's the point of having it? – and playing up to level 30 and higher... well, maybe in single-player (two to four months of gameplay in multiplayer is just right), and there's no need to talk about imbalance – we're not speeding up the path to Specialization for just one person, but for everyone at once.

Don't talk about imbalance – we're not just speeding up the path to Super Unit for one player, but for everyone at once.

I will address the imbalance, specifically the imbalance of choice. When one path becomes obvious (too easy and achievable early on), while the others become unnecessary. Because the power of a Super Unit corresponds to 5+ perks for 1 slot. For this reason, in my mod, I tie the Super Unit not to leveling up, but to an expensive super artifact (amulet), which only becomes worthwhile under these conditions. By the way, the power of the Super Unit also varies between different races, so imbalance will also arise based on this criterion.

Regarding the debuffs – it's unclear why this is needed, giving situational skills to races instead of magical ones. I would say that the debuffs, in the form they exist in the original game, are a disgrace to the Orc race and represent incomplete development paths (taken strictly for the endgame and usually chosen randomly). Unless they are somehow strengthened, making them combat-oriented. Because spending up to 6 slots just to hinder only 1 school is a clear failure. Compare this to the Dwarves – magic resistance + dwarven luck, which effectively counters 2 schools at once, costing only 2 perks.

Regarding the levels – in the original game, achieving a Super Unit is possible around level 25, and level 20 is achievable as early as the 3rd-4th week. The conclusions are obvious – with focused leveling, achieving a Super Unit is almost always possible within about 2 months, if the opponent doesn't kill you sooner. However, either this is not a very powerful Super Unit, or it requires taking irrelevant perks (sacrificing), which you have to endure throughout the entire process (and you can fail in the endgame if you don't get the Super Unit in time). And this is where the element of balance lies.

Regarding the mentioned 2-4 months – I would call this mode not Multiplayer (competitive), but Multi-Singleplayer (a relaxed, cooperative playthrough of the map at your own pace, with a final showdown to see who developed better). Because the key feature of Multiplayer is the desire not just to complete the map, but to outplay the opponent, which implies the need to act more efficiently and faster. I have never seen tournament reports where the game ends later than 2 months.

I understand that everyone has their own style and pace of play; I am just explaining why this idea may not work for other players.

I'll talk about the imbalance, specifically the imbalance in choices. When one path becomes obvious (too easy and achievable early on), while the others become unnecessary.

Well, I'm convinced on this point – if it's easy to achieve, then why bother with other branches.
But tying it to an artifact... – then the amulet should be destroyed after reaching the fourth level in the racial skill.
Okay, let's leave the three branches as they were.

Regarding the suppression – no one forces you to take suppression skills; if you don't need them, don't take them. As I understand the WGE's idea, they want the skills that are always needed to drop, but the fact that an unnecessary skill drops when leveling up is unacceptable. But how can you know what the player needs and what they don't? – that's a personal matter for each player, which means that both necessary and unnecessary skills will always drop in any case.