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Poll with comments: skill tree.

Tournament History Closed Topic
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Cheat or no cheat?
69 voters
Single choice
This poll is closed.
Cheat!
46.4% 32votes
Well, I don't think so
30.4% 21votes
I'm having trouble answering
23.2% 16votes
In reply to Ment
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Offline Mike L
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Posts: 50
#78
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Ment
The program described in the topic performs an action that is already available to the player through legitimate means (writing down the locations of trees on paper or in a separate file and then referring to it, or even memorizing them). However, revealing the map is not possible. You cannot write down or memorize the map for a random game, to put it simply.

It is possible. But only if you are some kind of "Rain Man" :smile26:
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Offline Juristis
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Posts: 1,423
#79
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Voted for "no"; if it's banned at the software level, I won't use it, and my gameplay won't suffer. If it's just a rule, then I'm sorry, try to convince me again.

Seriously, the benefit of the program is hardly greater than that of a guard calculator, so I think the hype around it is pointless. I got it from one of the viewers of my stream. If needed, I can make it publicly available. There are only 2 heroes in it.

P.S. Someone just got upset after losing to Pekabler in the OFB).
heroes3.tv/juristis
ICQ - 488-784-621, skype - juristis18

Весна 2014.
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Offline twaryna
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Posts: 2,156
#80
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Juristis
P.S. Someone just got upset after losing to Pekabler in OFB.

Oh, yes, you revealed the truth! :eek: I got so mad after playing against Pekabler in OFB that now I'm constantly harassing him and making his life miserable. And that's exactly why I decided to mess with your cozy little world with this warm and fuzzy program :river:.

ps. and not because I genuinely think this program is cheating and want to settle the score. It's about whether it's allowed or not according to the rules. And if there are no problems.
http://heroes3.tv/twaryna
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Offline Heroin_HP
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Posts: 614
#81
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twaryna


ps. and not because I genuinely believe this program is a cheat and want to put all the points on the table regarding this issue. Whether it's allowed or not is a matter of the rules. And then there are no problems.

I've never used a calculator or any other nonsense, and I don't think my gameplay has suffered because of it.
If they want to use it, let them, if that's how they enjoy playing. Why worry about it?!
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Offline Nitro
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Posts: 1,019
#82
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In my opinion, fixed skill trees are a programming flaw in Heroes (something like buggy one-sided trees). Ideally, this should be fixed through HD+. Banning this program is nonsense because it simply visualizes the skill tree options, which can be memorized or written down on paper anyway. P.S. I haven't seen or used this program.
ICQ 627769385
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Offline Medium_HP
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Posts: 756
#83
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The program is a cheat. No card collections or clever strategies can replace it. It works perfectly online and can provide an advantage and ensure a positive outcome in many situations. It would be good to have a software ban, but it should probably be optional, only for online play.
Награда: Лучшему игроку сезона Осень 2009 за замок Конфлюкс
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Offline Sanin
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Posts: 2,074
#84
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Are we talking about this program?
ICQ 423164784

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Offline Medium_HP
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Posts: 756
#85
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Sanin
Are we talking about this program?
I was thinking of a different one; I'm seeing this one for the first time.
Награда: Лучшему игроку сезона Осень 2009 за замок Конфлюкс
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Offline JustObserver
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Posts: 495
#86
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Medium_HP
I meant a different one; I'm seeing this one for the first time.
It's in the latest post, the one you're talking about.
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In reply to numOne
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Offline Pit for LM
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Posts: 2,479
#87
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numOne
Let's wait and see what Kostya and Pete have to say about it.
Pete found out about the program yesterday and thought it was about a Polish text editor that breaks down the game's structure.
I don't know how it works or what impact it has on the gameplay, so I'm ready to incorporate any decision from the forum into the rules.
Подарок от Gomunguls на ДР :)


Осень-Зима 2013-14.
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Offline Wicc
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Posts: 5,099
#88
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Maphacks and similar cheats provide the player with information they shouldn't have access to. Based on the description, the program is simply a database of skill trees, which can be compiled without it. For example, if Kreg is offered diplomacy at level one, this strictly determines the skill tree number (because it's the only one like it), and this allows for more informed progression (if that tree is recorded somewhere). And yes, how will you control compliance with the rule? A large sample of games is needed to detect anything amiss. Therefore, banning them, in my opinion, makes no sense. If someone gets upset, it's better to ask Baratorch to change the algorithm for offering skills at each level. For example, make the skill tree number two bytes, meaning there will be not 256 trees, but 65,536, and the program will break trying to analyze them all.
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In reply to Juristis
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Offline Psyche_7
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Posts: 573
#89
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Juristis
Voted for "no," if it's banned at the software level, I won't use it, and it won't make me play worse. If it's just a rule, then I'm sorry, try to prove it again.

Seriously, the benefit of the program is hardly greater than that of a guard calculator, so I think the hype around it is pointless. I got it from one of the viewers of the stream. If needed, I can make it publicly available. There are only 2 heroes there.

P.S. Someone just got upset after losing to Pekabler in OFB.

Post it, please. The main thing is that everyone is on equal footing - if it's banned, then it's banned, but it's easier to "legalize" it.
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Offline Dirty_Player
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Posts: 11,094
#90
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Personally, I've known about this program since its release (probably about 5 years ago). For those who don't know how the program works, I'll explain. As everyone knows, there are 255 skill trees for each hero. Using this program, you can determine the number of a skill tree and view it for the first few levels. Formally, it can't be called cheating, because the program doesn't take data from the current save file; it simply provides a way to visually browse the trees, making it easier to search through them. However, there is one caveat. For the program to work, the game must be running, and a save file must be loaded (any arbitrary save file). This means that to use such a program during a game, you need to open a second instance of the game. Personally, this aspect raises questions for me regarding its legality, although the rules currently don't prohibit opening a second window. Theoretically, I don't think there would be any difficulty in creating a version of the program that doesn't depend on the game being running. As for my opinion on this program, I don't see anything wrong with browsing the 255 skill trees. If the program showed the current skill tree immediately, I don't think there would even be this question. Damage calculators and guard strength calculators are much more "cheaty," in my opinion.
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Offline ДаУ
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Posts: 868
#91
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Dirty_Player

The damage calculator and the guard strength calculator are much more "cheaty". IMHO.

Damage and guard strength can be calculated in your head — for example, by remembering an object's value (Dragon Fly Hive 15000 — on Diamond, SM, strong monsters), but you can't calculate the skill tree in your head. Regarding calculators: it's better to learn to calculate yourself — you'll train your memory and get more enjoyment from the game.
672466033
Миха#7845
Ландау лев https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNj_9EQxDoI&t=1174s

Тут делимся книгами /topic/at/1139927/
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In reply to Wicc
Offline Medium_HP
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Posts: 756
#92
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Wicc

Based on the description, the program seems to be just a database of skill trees, which can be compiled without it.

For example, if Kreg is offered diplomacy on the first level, this strictly determines the skill tree number (because it's the only one like that).
This is based on the description. But based on my experience using it, I can say that it's not just a database.
Here's how to prevent something – you can't do without Baratorch.
Message from Dirty_Player
As for my attitude towards this program, I don't see any problems with viewing 255 skill trees. If the program showed the current tree immediately, I don't think there would even be such a question.
Either we're talking about different programs, or you don't know everything about the program's capabilities.
In general, I think it's time to clarify things; you can't hide something forever. The Oracle calculates the current skill trees for all heroes on the map, including those of opponents, and even after acquiring skills. It works online. I'm not sure, but I think you can calculate the skill progression of an opponent's heroes; you can definitely catch the desired skill, avoid unnecessary ones, time wisdom for Pandora, and so on.
Награда: Лучшему игроку сезона Осень 2009 за замок Конфлюкс
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