Taking of the Necropolis [COMPLETE EDITION] — Reference materials for online players.

favio

13 years ago

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No, guys, the scheme isn't perfect, of course, which is why I want to work with everyone who supports the idea to develop the ideal scheme specifically for regular archers. Maybe we can keep more spearmen, and perhaps someone will come up with something, invent something?)

Well, I don't know, on WCL, no one ever puts archers on Jebus on the first week, and everyone handles it perfectly, and so do I. I can't imagine how to play with archers.

Oelm

13 years ago

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Let me throw in my two cents.

First of all, what's the point of writing strategies for SoD without an army from the third hero? It's understandable with Swamp, where there's a penalty, or with Rampart, where losses are acceptable. But for Castle, why waste resources for no reason? Secondly, if you don't have an upgrade for archers, you usually build a Mage Guild, at the very least you can count on the shooter, especially with Caitlin. Strategies should probably have some practical purpose.

And then, of course, the rats will come running and start shouting about offline mode, but in yesterday's game on Jebus Cross, I took a utopia on turn 116 with Castle, and on 117 a second one with capturing the center. While you, with your strategy (even with perfect play), often won't even start fighting properly until turns 115–116. Do you feel the difference?

Земля нуля.
Все в ней нулево и кукольно.

Javdet

13 years ago

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I recommend watching streams on Jebus Cross playing Castle by experts, for example Dubrovin. Then it will become clear why archers are upgraded.
Pasha consistently reaches 121-122 in the center already with arches (the argument regarding WT is accepted, but the game version doesn't change the essence of the matter). Moreover, in half of the games he emerges having grabbed artifacts from his home Dragon Utopia. I doubt that this is possible without upgrading archers, especially with an unpredictable Sods start.

Даже если вас съели - у вас два выхода:smile19:

Зима 2011-12.

In reply to Oelm

favio

13 years ago

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Agreed, Oelm, that GM1 is placed on day 111 and the archers will be 100%. And with their help, such a crypt can be handled with no effort at all and with no losses.
But I brought up this topic because there are situations like we constantly have on WCL now — archers are not built or upgraded. They still go into crypts. And I'm sure you do the same on HW; I just didn't know. Now I know that you always build archers and upgrade them. And somewhere in the thread, words were mentioned about how it wouldn't be a bad idea to create such a scheme... so I decided to work on it a bit.

A small thing, but who knows)

I remember once taking a Dragon Utopia with Castle on the first week on Jebus Cross, of course without building or upgrading archers. The layout was such that archers were already built, an external dwelling of angels, 2 external dwellings of cavaliers, some kind of conservatory, 4 hives, all along the road. And Tazar too)

And also: it's true that the top WCL players, by not building archers, generally don't enter serious battles until roughly day 115 — I've studied hundreds of saves. I don't deny it! But is it necessary?

I've been playing my whole life without archers, and with Castle, I make it to the center on day 122–123 in 75% of games. So I think it's a matter of style??

In reply to Oelm

Lider1

13 years ago

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Oelm

Well, and then, of course, the rats will gather and start complaining about the offline mode.

Is this a phrase about something that bothers you? How is it related to the context?

Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/
За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того

Oelm

13 years ago

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It's not just about the timing. What you bring is important. Sorry, but I don't believe in fairy tales about good exits in SoD (at 50%+) on 122-123.

P.S. And who is considered a top player in VTSL these days?

Земля нуля.
Все в ней нулево и кукольно.

In reply to Oelm

favio

13 years ago

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Oelm

It's not just about the time limit. What matters is what you bring to the table. Sorry, I don't believe in fairy tales about consistently achieving good results in SoD (50%+) on levels 122-123.

P.S. And who are considered the top players in the WCL these days?

You mentioned time limits, and I responded.

If you don't believe me, just watch my streams. I used to stream regularly before the incident with TheVinz.

Last season, the top ten included Maretti, TheVinz, Liophy, Dave, me, Heroes_Magic, Mogi, Andi, and Tiamath. And I don't know who would play Jebus better than TheVinz and Liophy. They are the best Jebus players in the world.

In reply to favio

KobRa_RR

13 years ago

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favio

You mentioned deadlines, and I responded.

And why don’t you believe me? Just watch my streams. I used to stream regularly before the incident with TheVinz.

Last season, the top ten included Maretti, TheVinz, Liophy, Dave, me, Heroes_Magic, Mogi, Andi, and Tiamath. And I don’t know who would play Jebus better than TheVinz and Liophy. They are the best Jebus players in the world.

Everyone is strong in their own sandbox.

In reply to favio

PReDS

13 years ago

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favio

Well, you wrote about the deadlines, and I answered.

And why don't you believe me? Just watch my streams and that's it. I think I streamed regularly before the incident with TheVinz.

As for last season, Maretti, TheVinz, Liophy, Dave, myself, Heroes_Magic, Mogi, Andi, Tiamath made it into the top ten. Even though I don't know who could play better on Jebus Cross than TheVinz and Liophy. The best players in the world on Jebus Cross.

Oh really? Maybe you'll take a bet on the best players too?
I remember about 3 years ago, Stiki organized a tournament on Jebus Cross. Moreover, effectively by WCL rules: Dimension Door and Town Portal were banned, as were double-builds, use of external markets, etc. If my memory serves me correctly, Cobra took first place, and Javdet and NeoAndi were among the top four (I don't remember the exact placement).

Javdet

I suggest watching Jebus Cross streams for Castle by a specialist, like Dobrovin. Then it will become clear why archers are upgraded.
Pasha consistently reaches 121-122 in the center already with arches (the argument regarding BT is accepted, but the game version doesn't change the essence of the matter). Moreover, in half the games he arrives having grabbed artifacts from his home Dragon Utopia. I doubt this is possible without upgrading archers, especially with an unpredictable Sod start.

I've watched several streams by Dobrovin and Albertas, looked at Dobrovin's saves after games with Lizard a couple of times, and actually, I suggest the opposite: they are categorically contraindicated for beginners, at least.

In reply to favio

Albert@s

13 years ago

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favio

I've been playing for my entire life without archers, and in 75% of games as Fortress, I consistently reach the center on day 122-123. So, I think it's about playstyle?

75% - not sure if Rion with 10 pikemen can carry a Fortress resupply... and 25% - losses?

In reply to favio

Captain

13 years ago

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favio

Well, in the last season, the top 10 included Maretti, TheVinz, Liophy, Dave, me, Heroes_Magic, Mogi, Andi, and Tiamath. And I don't know who would play Jebus better than TheVinz and Liophy. They are the best players in the world on Jebus.

favio, you didn't make it into the top 10 on VSL last season. :)
# Rating: Rank: Player: Country:
1 2449 Prince mogi1012 Korea
2 2290 Prince Maretti Denmark
3 2225 Prince Heroes_Magic Korea
4 2175 Prince Liophy Bulgaria
5 2129 Prince Ebe Korea
6 1987 Prince TheVinz Netherlands
7 1986 Prince Stuff Finland
8 1887 Lord GA_Tiamath Poland
9 1874 Lord Andi Poland
10 1743 Lord gyulma Korea

But, as my colleagues have already said, the VSL has a weak lineup.

Regarding upgrading archers or using GM1 on level 111, it depends on the situation. I prefer to use GM1, but sometimes I upgrade them.

Дипломатия - искусство говорить собаке "хорошая собачка" до тех пор пока не найдешь подходящую палку.

In reply to Captain

favio

13 years ago

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Exactly, I'm on the 11th. The player using fixed builds, gyulma, unfairly pushed me back :smile43:

There's no need to argue about the grade anymore; it's a matter of style. Even Maretti never places archers and upgrades them in the first week on Jebus; you should all have seen that... and he wins consistently)

I'm just suggesting that we gather the best minds and develop this tactic to perfection! Using regular archers, in the Dungeon. But if you're not interested in that, then just say so; arguing is pointless.

LeBron

13 years ago

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the concept of "best" on JC is very relative; if in full WTS with trading, the game is still somewhat stable, then in SOD, the variance in outcomes is so huge that you need to play a very large number of games to see a more or less adequate and accurate result. And something tells me that the players mentioned above are undoubtedly very strong on JC according to their own rules, but the title of "best in the world" is clearly an exaggeration.

"Это нам идеально подходит!" [Новосибирск, 2013]
"Красавчик! Если только не читер.." [Киев, 2014]
"Это Вам не шутки - нажрался Dust в маршрутке" [Новокузнецк, 2015]
Сам ты фиш (с) :D

zoog

13 years ago

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What causes strong disapproval is that the videos spend several minutes (in my opinion, excessively) demonstrating the launch of Mexican rap and loading screens, while strategic moments of waiting or defense go unnoticed during video recording. I almost quit because of this recently.

Ihtiandr

13 years ago

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There you will also find a detailed description of the battle, where all the nuances are explained. Watch the video in its entirety and don't miss anything ;)

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