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Posts from Red Orb (Sphere of Prohibition)Auto-translated
What you're suggesting was done about 3 years ago. Or are you unhappy with the current state of affairs?
Of course, it's fine. I just wanted to know what needs to be done to return to a full-fledged SOD (Simultaneous Online Duel) system, not just on one template, but at least on a few (anarchy doesn't count), or at least minimize the rules, because we are moving towards a system that restricts the game more and more, and consequently, the interest in it.
It seems you want to ignore what is written in parentheses: (in the form it is now).
In the form it is now, it is no better than VT. Because, in essence, it is another limited version. Even though it's the SoD 3.2 executable :D R55Max
This happens because the absence of the game's owner gives others a chance to mess with it, and other owners of modified versions appear!
But why? There is a copyright holder. Buka. And modified versions can exist even with the original owner of the game. For example, Heroes 5 and the Heroes 5TE mod. R55Max
It seems you have a sheet over your head if you don't understand.
:smile40: R55Max
I'll repeat it to you again, person: (in the form it is now).
R55Max
Decided to show off with banality, well, okay, don't play.
Emmm. Show off with banality? No, I didn't. And in any case, I'd rather not shine with sheets :D. R55Max
If SoD is a miserable ANALOG of VT, then VT is a hegemon over SoD.
Yeah, yeah, yeah... (in the form it is now) R55Max
Play VT.
R55Max
Don't mess with SoD, and everything will be GOOD.
:D :D :D R55Max
Write to Asmodeus to remove what you don't like in VT and force him to do what you think is appropriate - I think you understand the path you will be directed to.
Will they really direct me? No, it's not clear. Completely unclear. If you didn't have a sheet over your head :D, you would understand that I'm not forcing anyone. :smile42: R55Max
Regarding opinions, it's true that it will never be possible to create a balance that will satisfy everyone. There is SoD 3.2, and it should remain.
Yes, indeed. We just need to create a decent template for it, as has already been suggested. Maybe Screamer will do it, or someone else. So that we can play the game that was made by the creators, and not an incomplete version. And not shout that this is the best thing in the world and that this version is a sacred relic.
Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/ За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того
I voted for banning the red orb, but then, in my opinion, the black orb should also be banned.
Honestly, it doesn't matter anymore who voted how. Because the opinions are divided almost equally, and even if there were more people who were in favor of banning, it would be wrong to make such a decision.
update. I checked the poll, and it's not even close to equal anymore :D
Added 1 minute ago PReDS
What you're suggesting was done about 3 years ago. Or are you unhappy with the anarchy?
Anarchy is not good because it has a fixed size. Well, at least it's definitely not higher than L.
Added 29 minutes ago R55Max
You see, every change to the original (in its current form) leads to a greater divide.
Lider1
Instead, tell me why these changes are happening? Preferably in detail, as you like, in a long post.
R55Max
It seems like you don't want to notice what's written in parentheses: (in its current form) This is happening because the lack of an owner of the game gives people a chance to mess with it, and other owners of modified versions emerge! You probably have a sheet over your head, that's why you don't understand.
Now, seriously.
It's really bad that you don't understand why this is happening. And it's happening precisely because all these rules and restrictions are not just invented, but for the sake of balance. And not to just mess around. No one is saying that rules are not needed. They are definitely needed! Because SoD is far from perfect. And it's unbalanced.
It's just that in our Heroes community, it has long been customary to play like this. Many have gotten used to it. And they don't want to change anything. Some haven't realized it yet, some will never realize it, well, that's fine. Some are afraid that these changes will affect their "game strength." Everyone has their own reasons.
But to hear statements like, "play WoG, everything is perfect there if you want it so much, but the SoD we have now is a pristine land, and it is what it is, an untouched pristine land, it cannot be touched," is just funny. Because SoD has a lot of restrictions and changes. And they were made for the sake of balance. That's exactly what I was suggesting with the orb restriction. Well, if not, then so be it.
Added 13 minutes ago Yes, the topic can be closed. Everything is clear here.
Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/ За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того
To Lider1:
I perfectly understand that WoG is for balance, which is why I believe WoG and SoD are different games, as the game itself was intentionally created by the developers to create balance from imbalance, to create a counter-force for every strength. Yes, they didn't quite manage to consistently implement this idea everywhere, but that doesn't mean we should destroy artifacts like the Orb. It would be better to come up with some kind of sphere that absorbs the Orb's effect or at least a water spell that negates the Orb's effect and starts working from the 2nd round, thereby affecting all magic.
If we follow the ideology of WoG, then we need to eliminate all random possibilities: for example, the damage range should be fixed, like for Angels; remove artifacts that affect morale, resistance skill, and luck, as their effect is random; make the Red and Black Orbs, the arrival of heroes in the tavern, and the skill tree predictable; in the end, only play on mirror matches.
And for some reason, there is a false understanding that all 4 schools of magic should be equal. Their names and corresponding spells themselves indicate that water is against fire, and earth is against air (Town Portal vs. Dimension Door, Berserk vs. Hypnosis, etc.). The schools of magic themselves are not necessarily required to be equal in strength to each other.
You also write that someone will never realize that SoD is bad or that the Orb is bad. I'll reveal a small secret: awareness is understanding that a person simply prefers either WoG or SoD, and not understanding that their desires must necessarily be desired by others. Some people like Nyusha, and some like Ksyusha.
The topic can indeed be closed:) the main question has been resolved, and it's good that most people are in favor of the Orb
МУДРЫЙ - не обязательно старый, ОПЫТНЫЙ - не обязательно мудрый... обладатель и того и другого всегда должен помнить слова НАПОЛЕОНА БОНАПАРТА: Война состоит из непредусмотренных событий; В каждом большом деле всегда приходится какую-то часть оставить на долю :smile33: СЛУЧАЯ...
We are still trying to do this with the rules. R55Max
TP vs. DD, Berserk vs. Hypnosis, etc.
offtopic: Hypnosis in SoD is very strong :D R55Max
You also say that someone will never realize that such a SoD is bad, or that the Orb is bad. Let me reveal a small secret: awareness is understanding that a person simply prefers either VT or SoD, and not understanding that your desires must necessarily be desired by others.
Let me reveal a secret to you. The point is not at all in my desires, which must necessarily be desired by others. And not at all in the fact that some people like VT and SoD more or less. I'm tired of repeating this.
But in the fact that the understanding really comes with time. The choice of what you like/don't like is not made randomly. But based on a series of events. Perhaps games. Perhaps analysis. It's hard to describe. I didn't say that you can't understand this in principle; play another hundred games, new situations will arise. You will remember this old, forgotten topic. And maybe you will radically change your opinion. Of course, there are old-school players who realize all the "charm" of the Orb. They say we like it this way. We love SoD as it is. But if you dig deeper, why does this happen?I'm afraid to suggest that it's in order to keep everything running according to established patterns. To use the classics. Tazar + Red Orb, and so on. They don't love "SoD as it is," but rather these rules that they are used to playing by. It's not for nothing that they are different on every site. Even though SoD seems to be the same. We have one set of rules, the Westerners have another, the Chinese have a third.
And I wasn't saying that SoD is bad, but that, in my opinion, these rules with the Red Orb are far from perfect. (although they strive for perfection). It is they that are bad, as they limit magic and mages when there is a massive imbalance in the number of warriors in the game. And I insist that when you say SoD, please call the originalSoD without restrictions SoD. Only it is such. And SoD with rules is no longer SoD.
and think about it: why were the rules invented? why don't you play without rules? why are some rules introduced normally and without problems, while others are difficult
don't answer right away R55Max
The topic can really be closed:) The main question has been resolved, and it's good that most people are in favor of the Orb.
well, thank you for the permission, captain. I think that's what one of the moderators was waiting for :D
*** that's all from me. I'm tired of repeating myself.
Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/ За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того
really 5 minutes? In tournaments, a match can start after 20 minutes, just deciding who goes first, who gets which color, whether auto-play is possible, and other stuff. And if you start a discussion about Mulligans, Solmires, double-plays, rests, it takes about 2 hours.
apparently, there is a problem, there are default rules (any), and you only adjust deviations from them (and who goes first is a question for the third person in the chat, 1 or 2 - you decided beforehand who is number 1 and who is number 2): 1) one rest 111 + per block or ... 2) slow roads, rest - yes, yes, no, no let it take 10-15 minutes, and what kind of auto-play :smile33: ??? Vatya
Therefore, if this issue needs to be resolved, it should not be done at the software level, but at the rules level. In friendly matches on the Hive, everything is clear, but how do you solve this at another level? Some use a mod, some don't, and there are always a lot of questions, what roads, how many restarts, Sod or VT, and so on... But if there's just a link to the rules, that's it...
in tournaments, there is a team representative/captain/organizer who decides everything and conducts polls among his players 100 times, but we cannot change the rules on other platforms (whether it's the developers or the Chinese :D) Lider1
what were the rules created for? why don't you play without rules? why are some rules implemented normally and without problems, while others are difficult to implement
1) in what sport/competition/contest are there no rules?
2) I will answer that I am only unhappy with diplomacy and unlimited time - THAT'S IT, everything else is acceptable
3) rules/rule - if they want to introduce something from scratch, it's easy, but when it's added to an already established set of rules, one person promotes it, and everyone else has to accept it without exception (in short, one against all - conditionally)
if some rules are easily adopted, it means that they were needed or everyone wanted them. For example, if 99% voted to allow diplomacy to join troops, then 1% would either leave completely or play without it with the players they can agree with (without scouting/without restarts, etc.)
For everything else, there's a private message/ICQ, isn't this a discussion forum, or am I interfering...? :D :D :D (just kidding) Lider1
SoD is great. SoD isn't about being professional. We like SoD the way it is, flawed and rough, and if I simply love SoD.
That's why SoD is loved :smile16: Amen. That's what I'm saying, that you can't improve SoD to/under a PRO level. SoD is and will be an amateur thing, and no one can take anything away from it or add new features (in terms of physics). It's loved for its unpredictability. Will a mage find a red orb :D or get the Air book in the first week with knowledge level 1 :smile16: Lider1
Then why have rules?
Even in no-rules fights!!! there are these (censored:D) rules.
P.S.: If you really want to push something through, don't just state it, but provide arguments in your favor, discuss with opponents, prove that it's beneficial, etc., because simply saying "I'm right, and that's it" won't convince anyone, believe me (the same example with WT, I've been saying for a long time what their unpopularity is due to) :smile15:
apparently, it really is a problem. There are default rules (any rules), and you only adjust the deviations from them (and who goes first – that's a question for the third person in the chat, number 1 or 2 – you decided beforehand who would be number 1 and who would be number 2): 1) one rest, 111 + per block, or... 2) roads are slow, rest – yes, yes, no, no and even if it takes 10-15 minutes, what kind of auto-play is that? :smile33:
Well, that's what I'm saying, there are already a lot of questions, and if there weren't any rules, we'd just keep going.
...3 Solmyr, yes/no, and if yes, with what restrictions? 4. Mullich, yes/no, and the same goes for him. 5. Butterfly upgrade, yes/no. and so on, and so forth, which will take who knows how long.
But there's already a mod, and using it already implies several questions about roads/save passwords, etc. So I don't see any point in doing this in a mod.
For example, I'm playing with some Chinese player. I'm the host and I'm using a mod that bans the Genie. And the Chinese player doesn't know about this and just uses the same Tazi to clear everything possible in search of this Genie. But he doesn't know that the Genie can't exist on the map. But there are simply rules in a publicly accessible place that describe this. If these rules don't suit you, we'll look for a compromise. But not a ban at the program level, because the creator knows about the ban, but the opponent doesn't.
And regarding the game with the Chinese player, it seems a bit suspicious... fair play should be a priority, more so than any victory achieved through any means.
P.S. Even if there are a million questions, the main thing is that the communication doesn't become strained (something like that).
And the game with the Chinese player seems a bit shady... fair play should be a priority, more than any victory achieved through any means.
P.S. Even if there are a million questions, the main thing is that the communication doesn't become stressful (something like that).
Dear Sir, do you read what I write, or do you only see what you want to see? I'm telling you that it's easier to write all these questions in the rules, rather than at the program level, to reduce the number of questions that need to be clarified before the game.
Dear Sir, are you reading what I am writing or only seeing what you want to see? I am telling you that it is easier to write all these questions in the rules, and not at the program level, in order to reduce the number of questions that need to be clarified before the game.
yes, I read if I answer the person asking. link to the rules - /topic/7430/ what is NOT CLARIFIED in these rules? -and clarifications with an opponent are precisely carried out on an INDIVIDUAL/UNIQUE approach between two players FOR NON-STANDARD GAMES (not according to the template of the rules), how else can I convey that everything is written in the rules?Vatya
Well, that's what I mean, there are already a lot of questions, and if there were no rules, then let's go further: ..3 Solmyr yes/no, if yes, then with what restrictions 4. Mullich yes/no and so on 5. Butterfly upgrade yes/no and other nonsense that will stretch for who knows how long.
scorp
and it really is a problem, there ARE default rules (any) and you only discuss deviations from them
THERE are rules and always have been, all your 3-4-5 points are described in the rules, I haven’t played a single tournament without specific rules provided by the tournament organizer!
P.S.: There is no point in quoting if there is no comment/answer to the quoted post.
Message from Lider1: It’s better if I reveal a secret to you. The point is not at all in my desires, which must necessarily be desirable to others. And not at all in the fact that some people like WT and SOD more or less. I’m already tired of repeating this.
But in the fact that the understanding really comes with time. The choice of what you like/don’t like is not made by chance. But based on a series of events. Perhaps games. Perhaps analysis. It’s hard to describe. I didn’t say that you can’t understand this at all; play another hundred games, new situations will arise. You will remember this old, forgotten topic. And maybe you will radically change your opinion.
How can you possibly know whether I understood or not... I played WT, didn’t like it compared to SOD, made a choice, and that’s it. There’s no point in talking about a couple of hundred games (it’s the same as me telling you to ditch Nyushka, she’s not very attractive, live with the “attractive” Ksyusha :D. It’s like comparing apples and oranges), and even more so about not understanding that WT is cool; I can also say that someday a WT player, tired of endless changes, will realize all the charm of SOD and return to it. Stop discussing probabilities; anything can happen, but it’s better to talk using past experience and the present.
Of course, there are old-school players who realize all the “charm” of the ball......
And there’s no point in digging deeper; everyone thinks for themselves, and you shouldn’t lump everyone together. They made a choice, and you’re making assumptions for them; decide for yourself. New players can be just like old players.
What were the rules created for? Why don’t you play without rules? Why are some rules introduced normally and without any problems, while others are difficult to implement?
Scorp wrote it well. They are needed for “legitimacy” (the ban on cheating is also a rule), order, and a clear understanding of the order of various actions.
scorp, I wasn’t actually writing to you.
I didn’t see anything in my inbox; it made me smile :)
МУДРЫЙ - не обязательно старый, ОПЫТНЫЙ - не обязательно мудрый... обладатель и того и другого всегда должен помнить слова НАПОЛЕОНА БОНАПАРТА: Война состоит из непредусмотренных событий; В каждом большом деле всегда приходится какую-то часть оставить на долю :smile33: СЛУЧАЯ...
even in fights without rules!!! there are these (censored:D) rules
They exist, they really do. I just wrote about what kind of rules I'm talking about - rules of fair play. But why were the others created? Isn't it obvious? :D scorp
P.S.: and if you really want to push something of your own, don't just state it, but provide arguments in your favor, discuss with opponents, prove that it is beneficial, etc., and simply saying "I am right and I don't care" won't convince anyone, believe me (the same example with WT, what kind of advertising do they have: I've been saying for a long time what their lack of popularity is) :smile15:
You know, I'm tired of proving something that is obvious to me. And as the poll shows, it's also obvious to 40% of those who voted. Thank you, but I'm getting tired of it. I can't write eloquently like Vic, and I don't want to. And about mass control of warriors and everything else.
Do you like the ball? Okay, play with it, super-spectacular and interesting battles are guaranteed - develop :D R55Max
From where can you even know if I understood or not...
Of course, you understood. What's there to understand? R55Max
I played WT, didn't like it compared to SOD, made my choice and that's it.
Good for you. I didn't praise WT, though. And when I talked about the WT-SOD versions, I made a comparison of +- R55Max
and moreover, about not understanding that WT is cool, I can say the same.
Again, I didn't position myself as a staunch WT fan anywhere. R55Max
and it is desirable to speak using past and present experience.
Especially for you, a screenshot. Past, present, and future of SOD. Let's rejoice. Hallelujah. R55Max
And it's not worth digging deeper, everyone thinks for themselves and you shouldn't lump everyone together. They chose, and you are deciding for them.
But I think it's still worth it! But of course, everyone is different. It's not necessary for everyone. R55Max
Scorp wrote it well. They are needed for "legitimacy" (a ban on cheating is also a rule), order, and a clear understanding of the order of carrying out various actions.
I ASKED, FOR WHAT??? SPECIFICALLY, WHAT ARE THE RULES FOR? IS THAT ALL? All your options?
And the most important thing, you still didn't say. R55Max
Didn't see anything in PM, it made me smile though :)
And you won't see anything there, because the discussion is open and I addressed you publicly. But since it made you smile, that's good.
Screamer1982
