Round table — Online Tournaments

Dirty_Player

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

1. Both templates are unbalanced. Jebus is much more unbalanced.

This is a misconception. In Jebus, one chocolate might be "more chocolatey" than another, but you can still play. In the CM template, if it pushes you into a difficult situation, there's no way to recover.

Wlk777

2. Jebus is too easy in terms of money and resources; it's not interesting to just collect them under your feet instead of earning them like in the CM template.

If you just collect resources haphazardly, you won't get results. You need to collect them strategically! And not everyone has the intelligence to do that.

Wlk777

3. Jebus is too "fat" of a template; there's too much free stuff.

That's its specific characteristic; it can't be called a disadvantage. If in the CM template you need to earn money from crypts/gnome dens, etc., then in Jebus, within the same timeframe, you need to solve more serious problems.

Wlk777

I haven't played much on Jebus.

This is the key phrase in the entire discussion. After you take Utopia or break the Gate of the Underworld on the first week in ONLINE mode, then I will change my opinion about this template.

Wlk777

Using the "skill" argument in such debates is already a broad and sweeping step towards "garbage talk." I don't recommend it. =)

I hope we can distinguish between "garbage talk" and a normal discussion about templates?

Wlk777

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Dirty_Player, the fact that Jebus Cross is a flawed template is confirmed by people who have played it extensively. On SMK, completely dead layouts are rare. If I was able to break ГО and Dragon Utopia in ONLINE on the second week on SMK, then I think I can do the same on Jebus Cross on the first week. I just don't have the desire. Just as I don't want to argue with you =)

In reply to Wlk777

Dirty_Player

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

People who have played a lot on Jebus Cross confirm that it is a flawed templateAnd as for the SM being a flawed template, basically everyone around here says so :D Which of these?

Wlk777

If I broke ГО and Dragon Utopia in ONLINE on the second week using SM, then I think I can do it on Jebus Cross on the first.And I am sure that you won't be able to!
I mean, who hasn't broken ГО and Dragon Utopia by the second week now? No one is surprised by that. But on Jebus Cross during the first week, those are isolated cases, and layouts with 50 wyverns in week 1 are more like myths.

Wlk777

Just like arguing with you =)If you have no desire to argue with anyone, then why write in the first place? :confused: Since you've stated your point of view, be kind enough to defend it or don't write at all.

Wlk777

16 years ago

Auto-translated

I said "I think I can." And if the goal is specifically breaking ГО\taking the Dragon Utopia (regardless of what remains after that), then I definitely can. It's just that I really don't intend to spend a huge amount of time on this online.

Added 1 minute later

Dirty_Player

Everyone around here says the sm-template is bugged :D

and 80-90 % of games still run on sm =)

Javdet

16 years ago

Auto-translated

VLK, will you ever calm down? Kostya says it's valid because he has experience playing on Jebus Cross, and your theories are being pulled out of thin air.
I can provide real examples of games (in a very clear format - saves) where what mattered was not a crappy generator but actual skill!
As for the imbalance of Jebus Cross, I naturally admit it, but a player's skill is much more noticeable on it than on SMK.

In reply to Javdet

Wlk777

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Javdet

VLK, will you ever calm down? Kostya says it's true because he has experience playing Jebus Cross, and your theories are pulled out of thin air.

Alright, I'll calm down :) . Though Jebus Cross is disliked even by some people who have played it many times, and Kostya generally plays online quite rarely, but oh well.

In reply to Wlk777

Redwhait

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

I said "I think I can." And if the goal is specifically breaking ГО\taking Dragon Utopia (regardless of what remains after that), then I definitely can. It's just that I really don't intend to spend a huge amount of time online doing it.

Added after 1 minute

and 80-90 % of games are still played on smka =)

1) And is it too hard to say it directly?
2) Where did you find such statistics about smka? Provide facts and exact calculations :)

In reply to Wlk777

Dirty_Player

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

and 80-90% of games are still played using the SM (Stronghold Map) style.

Firstly, this percentage has now dropped to around 60%.
Secondly, have you ever wondered why? When people create templates, they are often willing to play different maps (which is why template creation is popular now), but since preferences often don't match, and people often create templates that their opponent likes, the SM style becomes a compromise that often suits both players, but this doesn't mean that they actually like it.

In reply to Dirty_Player

Wlk777

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Dirty_Player

eliminates both

This is the main thing :)

In reply to Wlk777

Dirty_Player

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

That's the main thing :)

He chooses it because he's picking the lesser of two evils (playing a well-worn template or playing a template that's unfamiliar to him but familiar to his opponent). I'm saying this because I do the same thing, so I don't have to play other L-shaped templates.

RomarioGrom

16 years ago

Auto-translated

so, a question for the experts: I keep encountering a series of unplayable random maps on CM (the generator keeps creating maps with unfair starting positions) and it's starting to feel more like a roulette, is there any way to adjust it so that the imbalance isn't so noticeable?

In reply to RomarioGrom

Oelm

16 years ago

Auto-translated

I have the impression that the imbalance in the CM (Conflux) is greatly exaggerated. In my opinion, a match on CM to two wins is approximately equivalent to a single game on 8mm6, which is generally considered the fairest template.

Added after 1 minute
If it doesn't suit you in principle, you can just play other templates.

In reply to Oelm

SEM_56

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Oelm

I have the impression that the imbalance in the CM (Conquest Map) is greatly exaggerated. In my opinion, a match on the CM to two wins is approximately equivalent to a single game on 8mm6, which is generally considered the fairest template.

Added 1 minute ago
If it's fundamentally unacceptable, you can just play other templates.

What do you think about an example using 4 templates?!
Simply put, on the CM, Jebus, Mini-Nostalgia, and 8mm6, the game offers unplayable setups!
Out of 19 games, only 3 wins, and those were purely by chance...
Otherwise, it's a complete disaster: either 1 path to the Castle after 2 rests (also with terrible setups), or complete poverty and miserable respawn points!!

I don't really want to play after so many failures, and the game has become a significant part of my free time!
Just a couple more disappointments, and that's it!!!:mad:

Wlk777

16 years ago

Auto-translated

SEM_56 , Rom, try WT; as a rule, the layouts there are actually better than in SoD (at least there's definitely more money), and playing without experience or taxes is no harder than in SoD, but it's more convenient and interesting. If you don't believe me, ask "Uchitel" ;)

In reply to Wlk777

SEM_56

16 years ago

Auto-translated

Wlk777

SEM_56, Rom, try WT, the rewards are really better there than in SoD as a rule (at least you definitely earn more money), playing without experience and taxes is not more difficult than in SoD, but it's more convenient and interesting. If you don't believe me, ask "The Teacher" ;)

I wanted to learn how to play SoD properly, but it seems it's not meant to be.