Posts from Necropolis and Demon.

Results of the first game: Necropolis vs. Inferno

Lordesat
Necropolis, hero Zoltan, starting bonus - artifact.

Ganseng
Inferno, hero Daleb, starting bonus - artifact.

Map: "Former Friends". I am under the red flag, Lord is under the blue flag. The conditions were as follows: I attack his city when he upgrades the general plague spell.
I got an artifact that is completely useless for demons - the Trident of Titans. I cleared my territory in a week and a half. In the second half of the second week, I broke through to the center. The result of the second week: I obtained the Staff of Sar-Iss and a stash of devils, and with two gold mines, I managed to build devils in the city on day 7.
By the time the siege began, mid-week 3, I was at level 15. What I managed to upgrade:
Expert Gating - Curse, Soul Eater.
Expert Mechanics - Ballista, Catapult, First Aid.
Permanent Luck - Soldier's Luck, Magic Resistance.
Logistics Basics - Fast Gating.

The result turned out to be exactly as I described in one of the previous posts: the contested territory is completely under my control, and I have all 4 relics. Among them: the Staff of Sar-Iss, the Tome of Chaos, the Armor of the Forgotten Hero, and something else, I don't remember. I have 4 gold mines at my disposal.

Necropolis Army: 300 skeleton warriors, 89 unupgraded ghosts, about 30 vampire lords, about 150 unupgraded zombies, 15 upgraded ghosts, 7 higher liches, 8 archliches.

Inferno Army: 142 imps, about 110 elder demons, 98 fire hounds, 6 cave horrors, 7 devils, 15 succubi, 12 horses in the city, and 1 devil in the city.

Result: 0:1, in favor of Inferno.

Tomorrow, we will play a late-game match. I will post the result, and maybe I will upload the replay.

Generally, games where some players tried to play against me, like Hafiz or cheaters, often ended in failure because I know how to counter rushers.

It was a promising statement; however, it remained unclear what Zoltan was doing while Deleb was clearing the center. Was he preparing to punish the arrogant rusher by capturing an Inferno castle, thus leaving the enemy without troops? :smile19:

On this rush map, the Necromancer should have chosen Kaspar instead of Zoltan. Then, focus on developing machines and being the first to break through to the center. On this map, whoever breaks through to the center first has a greater chance of winning. I believe this is the main reason for the defeat.

Map: "Former Friends". I'm under the red flag, Lord is under the blue flag. The conditions were: I attack his town when he upgrades the general plague.

The whole point is that I didn't upgrade the general plague, meaning I did, but when we reloaded, I got something completely different. And you forgot that you also had the Tome of Chaos? I admit, I made a small mistake; I didn't think you would clear out the Dwelling, I thought you would go straight for the castle. Besides, I didn't have a Berserker. And the armor served you well.

Results of the second game: Necropolis vs. Inferno

Lordesat
Starting hero: Kaspar, final hero: Lucretia.

Ganseng
Starting hero: Daleb, final hero: Nimus.

We played on a tournament map. I was under the red flag, Lord was under the blue flag. Conditions: We met in... well, in an open field at the beginning of month 4. Both of us reached level 35 by the scheduled time. My skills:

Expert Gating - Call of Urgash.
Luck - Soldier's Luck, Wide Gates of Hell.
Leadership - Troop Gathering, Aura of Speed, Gate Master.

Necropolis army: 1100 skeletal warriors, 722 plague zombies, 193 spirits, 315 vampire lords, 104 archliches, 107 banshees, 51 spectral dragons.

Inferno army: 604 imps, 483 greater demons, 183 fire hounds, 110 succubi, 66 hellhounds, 40 cave horrors, 18 archdevils.

We met in a very tough battle at the scheduled time. The replay is attached.

Result: 1:1 in games. In the late game, the Necropolis still has more chances than the Inferno, but the Inferno also has a chance.

:smile17:

Oh dear... Don't misunderstand me, and most importantly, don't get offended.
Explain the point of the game within 3 months. Maybe it was necessary to reach level 50?! Maybe it would be even more interesting?:smile17:

You wanted to know which faction is stronger on the given map? In my opinion, in this mode (3 months), you are unlikely to figure it out...

Because starting with medium-sized maps (and I think this map is one of them), it is difficult to understand the strength of a particular race when playing for such a short time. What manifests itself in this case: the player's skill, existing gaming experience, etc.? It turns out that we just level up and fight mindlessly? Well, make a map where you can level up to the maximum right away... What's the point of spending so much game time...

The only other thing I can ask is about the demon's build. And what's the point of Urgash's call? It turns out that in this game, two builds were simply messed up (darkness and leadership). If there was also Sandro's cloak, maybe darkness would have won. But it is unlikely to win it or buy it. And against the Necromancer, you should have taken defense (instead of leadership) and, at worst (instead of darkness), light. I assume that this map has a mentor, a library, and other nice things (since it is a tournament map)...

And what did the Necromancer build, may I ask?

Added after 55 minutes
I watched the replay. The cloak was there after all. But I'll say it straight: this battle once again confirmed my guess that this build is not effective against the Necromancer, not to mention how the battle itself went... No offense, but in this case, the inferno build lost in many aspects...

What is being demonstrated in this case: the player's skills, their gaming experience, etc.?

Imagine, yes, the player's skill is being tested. I played against another Necromancer (there was this guy who vehemently insisted that he would crush me with Necromancers, but unfortunately, it turned out to be the exact opposite). Not only did he assemble a truly terrible army for a Necromancer, but he also lasted only a turn and a half under the pressure of the summons. Doesn't this speak to the player's skill, or rather, "lack of skill"?

Just make a map where you can level up to the maximum right away...

This map has level 35, which is the maximum. I don't understand what other maximum you need.

And what's the point of the "Call of Urgash"?

Probably to double the army size in the very first turn? Think about how quickly I would have been defeated if I had to wait another turn for reinforcements to arrive? And don't try to use "fast gating" as an argument. With "fast gating," the summons don't appear faster; it just reduces the initiative cost for gating by half, meaning the unit that used gating is pushed back not by 0.5 on the ATB scale, but by 0.25.
And why would I need Light without Divine Retribution, Mass Divine Power, and Smite? It was completely useless in this match, like "why would you need a balalaika on a pig."

Regarding summoning creatures: what's the point of summoning them directly into this battle? Why summon them to a place where they'll be immediately killed by your opponent's units? And then, only two of the Inferno creatures have an initiative equal to or lower than the Necropolis creatures. Even with skillful summoning, they wouldn't have had a chance to act without being attacked. But here, they were simply killed immediately:( (you just needed to summon them somewhere else). I agree that the specifics of the game you were playing have an impact on the gameplay. But still, the Inferno was handled carelessly in this battle.

About light: of course, light looks strange for a demon, but that's only at first glance. On the other hand, I disagree that it's impossible to upgrade mass buffs, especially on a tournament map. And Divine Retribution isn't even necessary...

You can especially boost light mass buffs on a tournament map; I do this by buying secondary heroes, such as Helmar, Miva, etc. Now, regarding the game. In my opinion, Ganseng played quite well overall, but he made some tactical mistakes that played a fatal role. In my opinion, he should have prioritized subduing the vampires first and then the dragons. The summoned creatures should have been positioned slightly differently (I agree with KillAndAction). Also, I can't help but praise Lordesat; he played tactically well and assembled a good army, although, in my opinion, it should have been 20-30% larger. It's clear that he has more experience playing as Necromancers than Ganseng does as Demons. I really enjoyed the battle; it was a great clash, and I wasn't sure who would win until the very end. We need more games and final battles like this! As for the map, I can say one thing: it was created by a good mapmaker specifically for competitions and inter-racial wars (this map was used in the last Ukrainian tournament in the 6-8th place bracket)! This map is well-balanced and gives a smart gamer the chance to fully utilize the best aspects of each race, as well as a wide range of tactical options.

Actually, I initially wanted to berserk the vampires. I looked it up in the guide, but it seems like they had a shield. So, I controlled the banshees because their turn came right after mine, and I planned to use them to take down more vampires. But it didn't work out.

I wasn't aiming to be a super-strong demon player anyway. But I think now there will be fewer shouts of "necro will tear demons to shreds."

Well, I’ll probably share my opinion. I think the key factor was the demons having Sandro’s Cloak. That’s what I don’t like – the fact that it can be used not only by Necropolis. With the cloak, the demons have a real chance of defeating the Necropolis in the late game. But without the cloak, it doesn’t look very promising, especially considering that the Necropolis can have multiple castles.

Sorry for the off-topic comment. KillAndAction, weren't you playing Heroes with Dashem in the duel club at LKI? Your nicknames are similar.

:smile43:

To be honest, I can't say for sure. The only thing I can say is that I was mentioned in an article in the LKI magazine. Although, I might have also been mentioned in the LKI dueling club, but I don't know for sure...

It all depends on the player, the hero, the level, and many other factors. But I would bet on luck.

Everything depends on the situation!