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Posts from Which faction is stronger, or a template for comparing cities based on their strength!

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Heh heh, I used to test it in a similar way! And I always ended up with the strongest RAMPART. Here are a few advantages of the Rampart: it's the most economical castle because hiring all the warriors costs less than the income generated by the castle itself. You can stay in the castle and not leave, and it will sustain itself. In the guild, you can find a City Portal.
Sub specie aeternitatis.

Под знаком вечности.

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I can assure you that the Castle is the strongest, but the Tower is not far behind. Regarding the economic efficiency of the Rampart, I can argue that the Stronghold (Barbarian) is the most economical; the Rampart needs a lot of crystals. I tested this extensively in the past under equal conditions. The Castle has the strongest units at levels 1 and 7 in the game, although the Halberdiers might be able to compete with the Centaurs. The cost is high, but it's balanced. The magic is above average. The other units are also quite good. The Tower has a very large magical potential, which is a big plus. Three archers are a plus. The units are not weak, but they don't have the strongest units either. The Palace for the Titan is simply a waste; however, the Giant is cheap!
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Yeah, Barbarians are awesome! Try to conquer their Castle, especially if they've built a Grail there.
Варвары рулят!!
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Yes, it's a very broad topic with some ambiguous points, but that's all secondary. I would like to recreate the Rampart template or something similar; it's up to you. So...
1) Town
Building Elves and Dwarves with Dryads costs a total of 5,000 gold and 15 wood. That's pretty good, and it's feasible even with a poor starting location. The upgrade also doesn't cost much. With these three units, you can easily withstand opponents and steadily gain experience, artifacts, and resources for further Castle development during the first three weeks (which is the beginning and middle of the game). With the appearance of Pegasi (10 crystals, which can be difficult to find in the first week), life becomes more interesting, and you can confidently go on the offensive. As a rule, I can build them with Unicorns in the second week, along with the Citadel and Castle (depending on the starting location). Upgrading the breeding units to levels 4 and 6 requires relatively few resources (the main problem is rather the 15 crystals), as 15 Dragonstones on green territory are mainly obtained at "discos" (dancing boy, 5 Dragonstones or 500 gold). But building Dragons is possible no earlier than weeks 3 or 4, and it's not a big problem, unlike their upgrade. But still, it's level 7, and I think that's normal compared to other level 7 units.
Conclusion... The Castle consumes the least energy up to level 7. Upgrading the breeding units requires little gold and resources, except for wood and crystals, but considering the terrain and the characteristics of the green territory, this is not a big problem. Building the Grail in this Castle seems to be the most useless at first glance, but I have a different opinion (but that's another story). The total cost of all seven levels is 24,000 gold, which puts it among the three cheapest Castles!
2) Heroes
The most useful heroes are Warriors: Keir, Enova, and Ivor. They have good starting skills (archery, logistics) and Ivor is an extremely effective hero for rushing. They also tend to gain logistics as their 3rd or 4th skill and have a good initiative. The other Warriors follow, but without any particular advantages (my opinion may be subjective). Their primary stat is defense, which is an average indicator.
Among the Druids, we can highlight a few heroes: Malcolm, Ellezar, and Alagar, but in general, they are not very good as mages.
3) Units
There's no need to talk about the special effectiveness of Elves in ranged attacks. Also, the Kentaur and Dryad units are very good at covering the rear and are always ready to contribute. The Ancients are also good for defending the Castle, and their resistance to magic contributes to this to a large extent. There are many Pegasi, but their stats leave something to be desired (they are mainly used to gain the initiative in the early and mid-game) until Angels or level 7 units from the Castle appear. Unicorns are also good with their resistance to magic and the ability to blind the enemy, which can sometimes be very useful.
Conclusion... All units have good offensive potential, resistance to magic, and, as a result, are effective against weak Druid heroes. The Castle is very good on maps of any size (especially S, M, and L) and implies a game focused on early attacks.
Well, that's it in general:smile02:
In reply to PoisonProIsen
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PoisonProIsen;128379
Yes, it's a very global topic with some ambiguous moments, but that's all just lyricism. I would like to recreate the Rampart template or something similar, but that's for you to decide. So....
1) Town
Building elves and dwarves with dendroides costs almost nothing: 5 thousand gold and 15 wood. Quite good, regardless of even the poorest respawn; the upgrade also doesn't cost much. With these three units, you can comfortably spend the first three weeks (which is the early and mid-game) opposing the enemy and methodically grinding experience, artifacts, and resources for further development of the town. With the appearance of pegasi (sometimes it's very hard to find 10 crystals in the first week), life becomes more exciting and you can comfortably go for a rush. As a rule, I manage to build them with unicorns in the second week with a Stronghold or Castle (depending on the respawn). Upgrading dwellings to levels 4 and 6 requires relatively few resources (the main problem is rather the 15 crystals), as 15 gems on green territory are mainly obtained at "discos" (dancing boy: 5 gems or 500 gold). However, dragons can be built no earlier than week 3 or 4 and aren't a particular problem, which cannot be said for their upgrade. But still, it is the 7th level after all, and I consider this normal among other seventh levels.
Conclusion... The town with the lowest energy consumption up to the 7th level. Dwelling upgrades require little gold and resources except for wood and crystals, but given the terrain and characteristics of the green territory, this is not a particular problem. Building the Grail in this town seems the most useless at first glance, but I have a different opinion (but that's a separate story). The total cost of all seven levels is 24000 gold, which places it among the top three cheapest towns!
2) Heroes
The most useful warrior heroes—Kir, Enova, Ivor—have good starting skills (archery, logistics) and IVOR is an extremely effective hero for rushing; they also have a tendency to get logistics as their 3rd or 4th skill and have good movement. Next come the other warriors but without particular advantages (my opinion may be subjective). Their defense parameter is predominantly developed, which is an average indicator.
Among the druids, a few heroes can be highlighted: Malcolm, Elezar, Alagar, but generally, they are useless as mages no matter how you look at it =)
3) Units
Well, there's no need to talk about the special effectiveness of elves in ranged attacks; also, the kents and dendroides cover the rear quite well and are always ready to "have their say." Also, the standing elders are good for defending the town, and their magic resistance contributes to this greatly. There are many pegasi, but their stats leave much to be desired (mainly used for the right of first move in the early and mid-game) until angels or 7th level units from other towns appear. Unicorns are also good with their magic resistance and the ability to blind the enemy, which is sometimes very useful.
Conclusion... All units have good striking potential, magic resistance, and as a consequence, [make] the clueless druid heroes [redundant]. The town is very good on maps of any size (especially S M L) and implies gameplay focused on early attack.
So that's it in general terms :smile02:
still, I am leaning towards the Castle.
1. Level 4 Mages Guild (above average)
2. 1st and 7th units are the strongest. 2nd level: 4th place. 3rd level: 3rd place. 4th level: 4th place. 5th level: 5th place. 6th level: 3rd place... Overall, not bad
3. With resources on the map, you can already build angels in a week (difficulty 200% together with the town).
4. Two types of shooters, while not the absolute best, are not weak.
5. Yes, few special buildings, but as practice shows, this almost doesn't matter
6. All heroes move far
7. You can boldly play with angels at the start; they don't lag behind in attack compared to many level 7 upgrades.
8. Not the most expensive town. Easier to get 10 crystals and emeralds per angel than 20 crystals for a dragon, for example.
9. Unit costs per week in general—there are more expensive ones (Dungeon, Tower)
10. And finally, my opinion is that the units themselves play a very large role in the town. Take the Archangel—the highest stats (only the phoenix is faster). He always moves first. Strong stable damage. Decent health, resurrection of comrades, high morale, hatred of devils, and I also read that in 3do this unit was created uniquely in the sense that during attack/defense/casting a spell, all stats artificially jump by 30%... Yes, there's much more that can be listed. I don't want to bore anyone, I've just done experiments on all this for a long time. And I started playing humans back in the second part, not because the Castle is great in 3. That's how it is.
In reply to PoisonProIsen
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PoisonProIsen;128379
This is a very broad topic with some ambiguous points, but that's all secondary. I would like to recreate the Rampart template or something similar; it's up to you. So...
1) Town
Building Elves and Dwarves with Dryads costs a total of 5,000 gold and 15 wood. This is quite good, even with a poor starting location; the upgrade also doesn't cost much. With these three units, you can easily withstand both the enemy and methodically gain experience, artifacts, and resources for further Castle development for the first three weeks (which is the beginning and middle of the game). With the appearance of Pegasi (10 crystals, which can sometimes be difficult to find in the first week), life becomes more fun, and you can safely go on the offensive. As a rule, I manage to build them with Unicorns in the second week, along with the Citadel and Castle (depending on the starting location). Upgrading the creature production buildings to levels 4 and 6 requires relatively few resources (the main problem is rather the 15 crystals), as 15 Dragon Stones on green terrain are mainly obtained at "discos" (dancing boy, 5 Dragon Stones or 500 gold). But building Dragons is possible no earlier than weeks 3 or 4, and it's not a big problem, unlike their upgrade. But still, this is level 7, and I consider that normal among other level 7 units.
Conclusion... The Castle consumes the least energy up to level 7. Upgrading the creature production buildings requires little gold and resources, except for wood and crystals, but considering the terrain and the characteristics of the green terrain, this is not a big problem. Building the Grail in this Castle seems to be the most useless at first glance, but I have a different opinion (but that's another story). The total cost of all seven levels is 24,000 gold, which puts it among the three cheapest Castles!
2) Heroes
The most useful heroes are Warriors: Keir, Enova, and Ivor. They have good starting skills (archery, logistics) and Ivor is an extremely effective hero for rushing. They also tend to gain logistics as their 3rd or 4th skill and have a good movement rate. The other Warriors follow, but without any particular advantages (my opinion may be subjective). They mainly develop the defense parameter, which is an average indicator.
Among the Druids, we can highlight a few heroes: Malcolm, Ellezar, and Alagar, but in general, they are not very good mages.
3) Units
There's no need to talk about the special effectiveness of Elves in ranged attacks; also, the Kents and Dryads, which cover the rear, are always ready to have their say. The Ancients are also good for defending the Castle, and their resistance to magic contributes to this to a large extent. There are many Pegasi, but their parameters leave much to be desired (they are mainly used to gain the initiative in the early and mid-game) until Angels or level 7 units from the Castle appear. Unicorns are also good with their resistance to magic and the ability to blind the enemy, which can sometimes be very useful.
Conclusion... All units have good offensive potential, resistance to magic, and, as a result, are effective against weak Druid heroes. The Castle is very good on maps of any size (especially on S, M, L) and implies playing with an early attack.
That's it in general:smile02:
This proves that Elves are stronger than some
In reply to Light God
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Everyone, as before, is trying to get their way. And where is the promised system? Or does the author of the thread naively think that the truth will emerge on its own from this argument?
In reply to Reiter
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Reiter;141946
Or does the author of the thread naively think that the truth will emerge on its own in this debate?

No, the author is confident that other players will compare the towns themselves. And the template will be helpful for them. If you doubt this, read the thread first.;)
DmitriyAS

Кто сильнее или шаблон для сравнения городов по силе.
Различие офф-лайна в Heroes II и Heroes III.
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I diligently read the thread, hoping to find something useful. In the end, I was left with only one question: why was the "important" tag attached to the thread? I struggled through reading it, thinking it was actually important... :(
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In my opinion, it’s impossible to compare cities in this way because, mathematically, 10+10+10+10 resources + 20,000 gold is a lot (for Angels), and often it’s easier to find them than 20 sulfur in a Dungeon for a Dungeon faction, and later on, finding dragon scales to buy Angels or Titans can be easy with just 3-4 magic gardens (where you get stones/500 gold every week)... but in a mathematical model, these castles will lose, or it may simply be impossible to build Behemoths with an upgrade or Cyclops in a Stronghold (which many don’t do), and the cost of the castle will be 55 expensive units and a little gold, but when all buildings require one resource, it can be extremely difficult to find it!!! As a result, when comparing the overall strength of an army for a Stronghold, Cyclops can be ignored because there are few of them, and they are often used as ballista!!!
Regarding how to obtain resources – is it easier to defeat Nagas and Medusas and get a lot of sulfur, or to be content with the meager amount of mercury in Imp towns?
I’m not a critic, because it’s been known for a long time that “if you can do better, then do it,” but it seems to me that the author has taken on an impossible task!!! This is not chess, where opponents start in equal conditions (and even then, white has the advantage of the first move), but a game with diverse starting conditions, random morale effects, and a random number of bonuses that can affect the course of the game in one way or another...

The best way to compare in this kind of comparison is statistics of won/lost games for different cities... (Conflux leads, and Inferno is in last place)...
Лечиться даром - даром лечиться!!!:smile16:
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It could be presented in a table format, listing all units and buildings, with one column for heroes (which can be generalized). Next to each unit or building, a number from 1 to 8 could be placed, indicating the number of cities. This would provide a clear and visual way to compare, for example, the Academy and Mana Vortex. The total score would show which city is better. The hero's ability is not important; it should be a purely objective comparison. For debatable points, such as whether a magic enhancer or a Yarmorka of Artifacts is better, a poll could be created.
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Hello everyone.

The topic of castle strength is interesting, and you can have endless debates about it, citing different versions of the game, maps, and playstyles.

I mainly play Heroes on custom maps and in hotseat mode. If we talk about balance and the overall system, I honestly prefer Warlords and Dungeon Siege.

I think the Elementals added in Conquest of Armageddon are unrealistically overpowered.

I most often play hotseat on Free-for-All (other names: Everyone for themselves, everyone fights everyone). I think this map is the most balanced and interesting.

In fact, my gaming experience, as well as the experience of my friends, allows me to create the following top list (this is my personal perception - based on the economic aspects and stats of units, as well as the potential of heroes):
1. Castle
2. Dungeon
3. Barbarian
4. Tower
5. Inferno
6. Necromancer
7. Rampart
8. Stronghold

Now, in more detail:
Why Castle: because it has 2 very strong ranged units, and even the crossbowmen who attack twice are worth something. Strong champions and crusaders. If you cast Prayer, they can reach almost anywhere in one turn. Again, angels and archangels provide the possibility of a one-turn move. Archangels + resurrection allow you to take castles with almost no losses.

Dungeon: I generally consider it the most underhanded castle; I don't like playing as them because I think they are unreasonably overpowered. Of the weaknesses, I can only recall troglodytes. In fact, there are 3 ranged units - yes, yes, harpies, although they are weak, they don't counterattack, have decent speed, etc. Ranged units don't have a melee penalty, and medusas can also turn enemies to stone.
A flying unit of level 6-7 with very positive bonuses.
The portal allows you to significantly increase the growth of some units, and the mana vortex charges the hero, also compensating for the lack of knowledge.

Well, Barbarians are obvious, no comments. Of the weaknesses, I will note only the guild of mages and cyclops, which, as was correctly noted, are rarely used.

A lot has already been said about Tower, and it's all true. Indeed, titans are a failure, and although gremlins shoot, they are very weak. A couple of castle captures, and nothing remains of them.

Inferno is good for rushing:)) - a pun - but in principle, the units of levels 4-5 are quite weak; you have to wait a long time and tediously for devils, and I would say that magogs are a real headache.

Necromancers - well, of their strong units, I can only note black knights and vampires - everything else is just meat and a misunderstanding. Storming a castle leads to huge, almost unrecoverable losses of skeletons; it is not always possible to take advantage of the advantage of liches. Of the useful spells, only raise dead. And it's funny when you cast Prayer on them :) they should disintegrate.
In reply to BlackSerge
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BlackSerge
We'll see which city is better, and the hero's skill isn't important; it's purely objective. For debatable points like whether a magic amplifier or a relic armory is better, we can hold a vote.

In my opinion, the hero's skill and their level of expertise are of paramount importance...

If we don't base it on the hero's skill, then it's generally considered that (from the strongest Castle to the weakest):

1. Necropolis - Conflux;
3. Dungeon;
4. Rampart;
5. Fortress (Swamp);
6. Castle;
7-8. Stronghold (Barbarians) - Tower;
9. Inferno.
С истиной где-то рядом...





Лето 2010.
In reply to Дубровин Павел
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In my personal opinion, this template looks like this:
1) Castle
2) Dungeon
3) Tower
4) Rampart
5) Inferno
6) Fortress
7) Necropolis
8) Castle with hippos

Castle – of course, the archangels are good, and the knights on horseback deal decent damage.
Dungeon – black dragons, immune to all magic; there are heroes with the Meteor Shower spell (very useful); also, there is a portal and a level 5 guild.
Tower – shooting titans of level 7, a guild up to level 5, and heroes with the Chain Lightning spell.
Rampart – I just like the gold dragons.
Inferno – archdevils and magogs; the rest are weak, except maybe the efreets.
Fortress – only the gorgons are strong; the others are mediocre.
Necropolis – annoying vampires and liches, and dark knights.
Barbarian – so-so.
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1) Necropolis: a fast-developing army with vampires (respawn), knights (double damage + curse), ghosts (consume mana from the enemy!), and skeletons – the main striking force, as they say, "I'm not in a hurry to eat, but when I do, I won't let go!"
2) Castle: everyone knows it, but I'll say that the archers simply miss their shots.
3) Tower
4) Dungeon
5) Barbarians
6) Inferno
7) Elven
8) I don't even know who to choose.
Сила не в руках, а в голове
L2: PVP2 , Spawn, Shock.

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