Posts from "Fathers and Sons" Auto-translated

I generated about 50 maps and once again confirmed that red units perform better on grass. Combined with an open map, this is a huge advantage. If you also give them a fast-moving Kirr, I'm afraid they will immediately kill the blue units and won't have time to learn anything :)

But seriously, I would also like to see how experienced online players upgrade (or DON'T upgrade) elves, because I always end up with some absurd movements.

I want to participate!! 285757198

I generated about 50 maps and once again became convinced that red units perform better on grass. Combined with an open map, this is a huge advantage. If you also give them a fast-moving Kirra, I'm afraid they will immediately kill the blue units and won't have time to learn anything. :)

In exchange for a blue Necropolis or Dungeon hero (a swamp map is also fine), I'll give you anyone, whether from an open or closed map. Come and fight:smile01:

in exchange for a Sinigeo Necropolis or Dungeon (a Swamp will also do), I'll give you anyone, with either an open or closed map. --come and get killed:smile01:

And I'm waiting for you and Spirit to have an interesting match - make arrangements already!

There are no more news for now, except that Entomb - invisible is slightly delayed, they might play tomorrow. I'll upload an archive with maps tonight.

Aldegir(blue, Rampart, Kyrre, Kyrre) def AYMAN(red, Castle, Valeska, Valeska)2sm4d(3), 133
Educational and entertainment event
"fathers and children"
1... Ayman took the first rest at 111.. even though I had an external dwelling of elves visible and with Kyrre 3 elves came...
2... Ayman took the second rest without even letting me take a turn :(
3... The next rest was mine -111 - roads are slow.. and oh how I dislike them...
4...
111- Dragon Utopia near the castle.. 60 Centaurs and 7 elves from the building freed a Necromancer from prison.. Kyrre takes a crypt for 2000.. result 6 heroes and 5000 left.. didn't buy more heroes because there was no point yet...
112- Mephala scouted the GO and passed the troops back to Kyrre and she in turn broke through a passage to the Inferno secondary hero.. (19 Dendroids became and due to morale 23 Centaurs died from 3 stacks :( ) found a Griffin Conservatory for 1 angel on the Cinder lands...
113- upgraded the elves and bought Pegasi + bought another hero who passed these lads to Kyrre... Kyrre ran deep into the Cinder but still no sign of the secondary hero
114- Kyrre, after running a bit more, saw an obstacle in the form of up to 50 Lizardmen which can be broken but it will hurt so we take +1 attack and turn around hoping to approach the secondary hero from the other side which Mephala started scouting...
115- there was no more passage to the Inferno secondary hero... so Kyrre, having broken a chest, runs to capture the second secondary hero - the grassy one but guarded by up to 50 Nomads...
116- Kyrre broke through a passage to the underground - Necromancer secondary hero and treasure zone
117- Kyrre broke a chest and +1 to attack.. gave earth magic... result 1-6 in the castle.. Valeska ran out of the darkness on the Cinder and killed my Mephala
121- Kyrre bought a spell book and went to beat the Nomads
122- Kyrre upgraded earth magic to expert + freed Vidomina from prison.. who in turn captured Conflux (undefended).. + scouted a Conservatory for 3-4 angels
123- upgraded the unicorns and took +1 angel
124- Kyrre sat in the castle to replenish mana and assault the maximum Conservatory...
125- +3 angels.. lost 1 Dendroid :( + scout hero took a Medusa shrine for 30 Medusas
126- replenished mana at the well and headed towards the red castle through the Cinder land
127- Set up a chain for passing growth and Kyrre rushes at full speed towards the enemy
131- Bought all the growth and Kyrre breaks through a passage to the red lands and is 2-3 tiles short of reaching Valeska who was sped up on horses
132- open the view and see that again we are 1 tile short of reaching Valeska who didn't enter the castle.. we capture a Cloak 1-3 magic and stand near 2 Pandora's Boxes..
133- Valeska, having bought growth, captures one Pandora's Box and stands near the other.. Kyrre breaks the second Pandora's Box and there are 25 Swordsmen... We attack Valeska...
Kyrre 8-8-4-(15 mana) expert earth magic, archery, logistics, luck + advanced tactics
35 elves+16 Dendroids+47 Centaurs+25 Swordsmen+10 Unicorns+21 Pegasi+4 angels
Valeska 5-11-2-3 archery+leadership+wisdom
48 Archers+28 Crusaders+9 Champions+17 Griffins+98 Skeletons+9 Monks
Mass Slow and kill the Archers.. then the Monks and 3 Champions and red surrenders...
Thanks for the game...
But only after the game did my opponent notice that Vidomina had expert necromancy (I didn't even look...) and she should have been dismissed on turn 127.. even though I didn't use her in battle, rules are rules
so it should be like this:
Aldegir(blue, Rampart, Kyrre, Kyrre) lose AYMAN(red, Castle, Valeska, Valeska)2sm4d(3), 127

That's exactly how it was. Thank you very much, Oleg, for the game and the experience. I was satisfied and suggest that we organize similar events more often, of course, if our respected FOUNDERS of our beloved game have the desire and opportunity!!!!

Aldegir (blue, Rampart, Kirr, Kirr) def AYMAN (red, Castle, Valeska, Valeska) 2sm4d(3), 133

Congratulations to the "fathers" team on their first victory, and to the "children" team on gaining some experience. If we were to nitpick the rules (Vidomina), AYMAN violated them first – by attacking on turn 117. Let's consider it as if there were no violations, and the victory was fair. 1 : 0

If anyone wants to and has the opportunity to work with the save files and analyze the game, feel free – I and the guys would be happy to.

P.S. I didn't upload the archive for the pair Entomb - invisible because I was making and sending them one by one in online mode. They chose their heroes and are playing.

Well, what's up?! Who wants to join my training session? Are there any volunteers?;)

Asked the esteemed Neoandy to comment on the game Aldegir - AYMAN
I think comments will be available soon

Added 14 minutes later

Entomb - invisible - postponed
gen - Decontaminator - scratched out

SpiriTT - LeBron,
Unikorn - Blacpoint - how are you doing?

Asked esteemed Neoandy to comment on the game Aldegir - AYMAN

I think comments will be coming soon

111.
Blue is essentially playing standardly according to the circumstances, scouts are bought, the necromancer is sent with his army to collect reinforcements, which often provides a significant bonus when taking conservatories or even Dragon Utopias. Dendroids are not upgraded, 10-19, most likely on the Inferno respawn, but it's probably not worth risking - if there's grass and morale, then there will be losses of centaurs with unupgraded elves. We have a central respawn - this rarely pleases me, but blue color and rest on 111. Kirya has 3 movement squares left on 111, but it's hard to determine where ГО is - behind the lizards at the top or to the right, and then it's worth ending moves towards the dendroids.
Red, for some reason, doesn't visit the stable on the first turn.
112.
Blue - loses centaurs on the dendroids, which turned out not to be on grass. I take 7 basic elves into the army, although I prefer to upgrade either them or the centaurs, a stack of centaurs and single imps and break through all the dendroids with many morale procs on the latter, losing only the single imps.
Saving and upgrading centaurs with dendroid construction might allow taking a minimal conservatory on the first week. Kirya spends the night with dwarves and gogs.
113. Kirya continues, with pegasi, gr. elves and centaurs available - to run around with dwarves and gogs that are not used in battles. Loks also spend the night on whatever they have, I would have transferred everyone onto pegasi, especially since no battles with shooters that could be blocked by pegasi were foreseen.
114. Having made a long journey, Kirya did not dare to attack the lizards, having 5 pegasi, 4 gogs, 8 dwarves, 30 centaurs and 7 elves in the army. Three dozen lizards (50 cannot guard 2 resources) yielded the path at the cost of only 4 gogs. + I would have scouted the dwarf dwelling for 20+ thugs, who aren't particularly afraid of morale. And the dwarf dwelling turned out to have 15 dwarves each, also possible and necessary to take, especially if all 56 centaurs were available.
115. Cleaning the Inferno respawn where possible, the secondary hero hasn't been taken yet, Kirya was running around as a scout and is still level 4.
116. Apparently realizing the delay, Kirya hits a horde of dwarves on grass - this is where I would have hesitated whether it was worth it. By the way, important template knowledge elements - the cave on the home respawn is a passage to the opponent's secondary hero, but not at all to a treasury. Passages to treasuries are only from secondary hero towns.
117. It remains to wait for the horses to break through the lizards already along the road and lose no one. The revealed map bonuses bring Valeska where she shouldn't be. Running in deep off-road when the wolf horde at the entrance to the basement hasn't been cleared - a loss of tempo.
121 - here there's no alternative - capturing the conflux. The save, by the way, is missing.
122 - I would have sent Monere to take the minimal conservatory (with 6 horses + threw something in for distraction - elves don't need to be risked, although there's no risk), and replenished Kirya's mana and took the naga bank + conservatory.
123 - the naga bank hasn't even been scouted. Kirya is stuck with 1 angel on Inferno.
124 - the naga bank still hasn't been scouted.
125 - took a tier 3 conservatory, a correct move taking the medusa dwelling with a lok on 4 angels. If Kirya now walks past the bank - I wash my hands of it :).
126 - walked past it and headed towards the well, for some unknown reason, towards the griffins of already scouted secondary hero towns, when there's a teleport on the conflux to the treasury.
127 - the plan is clear - to go finish off the opponent without angels, although on 127 this is no longer done, instead the bonus from the logistician specialty is used to grab all the treasuries faster. But here the rush option is probably more suitable.
131 - I would have taken the dwarf dwelling with such an army, at least with a lok.
Well, further there's no point in commenting, on one respawn with 4 angels and 35 griffins, Kirya will corner even Valeska.

Summing up, I would note that more attention needs to be paid to hero movements in order to optimize the game's tempo.

112.
Blue loses Centaurs on Dendroid Guards that turned out not to be on grass. I take 7 basic Elves into the army, although I prefer to upgrade either them or the Centaurs, a stack of Centaurs and single Imps, and clear all Dendroid Guards with many morale procs on the latter, losing only the single Imps.
Saving and upgrading the Centaurs along with building Dendroid Guards might allow taking a minimal Griffin Conservatory in the first week. Kyrre camps with Dwarves and Gogs.

The loss of Centaurs was caused by Dendroid Guard morale on late turns when some of the survivors finally reached the Elves... I almost never upgrade Centaurs (maybe that's wrong) but I don't see the point... At most, upgrade the Elves and go for Castle on week 1-6... otherwise there's no time... Sometimes it's better to build a Marketplace to exchange resources when you're short on Castle or units.

Added after 1 minute

113. Kyrre continues, having Pegasi, upgraded Elves and Centaurs - to run around with Dwarves and Gogs that aren't used in battles. The scout heroes also camp wherever, I would have moved everyone to Pegasi, especially since no fights with shooters that could be blocked by Pegasi were expected.

Honestly, I relaxed a bit and set up the hero chain incorrectly, so they were always a full turn late... That's definitely a gross mistake...

Added after 3 minutes

114. After a long journey, Kyrre didn't commit against the Lizardmen, having 5 Pegasi, 4 Gogs, 8 Dwarves, 30 Centaurs, and 7 Elves in the army. Three dozen Lizardmen (50 can't guard 2 resources) yielded the path with a loss of only 4 Gogs. + I would have scouted the Dwarf Cottage for 20+ thugs, who aren't very afraid of morale. And the Dwarf Cottage turned out to have 15 Dwarves each, also takable and necessary, especially if I had all 56 Centaurs.

I don't know the theory well regarding how many Lizardmen there could have been.. But I've already lost several times by underestimating the troop count.. I could have attacked and expected to lose about 2-4 Elves + Gogs and a few Centaurs... Wrong decision...

Added after 1 minute

115. Cleaning up the Inferno respawn where possible, the secondary hero still hasn't been picked up, Kyrre ran around as a scout and is still level 4.

Yes, there are too many mistakes... :) because of those Lizardmen, I ended up not achieving much..

Added after 2 minutes

116. Apparently realizing the delay, Kyrre hits a horde of Dwarves on grass - here I would have thought twice whether it's worth it. By the way, important template knowledge elements - the cave on your home respawn is a passage to the opponent's secondary, not to the treasury. Passages to the treasury are only from secondaries.

Well, that's debatable.. I usually go to the treasure zone through the underground like that, and there's usually a guard right there, which the reveal showed (that's why I wrote treasure zone)

Added after 2 minutes

122 - I would have sent Monere to take the minimal Griffin Conservatory (with 6 horses + throw something for distraction - no need to risk Elves, though there's no risk), and topped up Kyrre's mana and took the Naga Bank + Griffin Conservatory.

I didn't check how Monere or another scout hero would take it, but I figured there might be some losses, even if small, and Kyrre needs some leveling up too

Added after 4 minutes

123 - the Naga Bank isn't even scouted. Kyrre is stuck with 1 Angel on Inferno.

I wasn't playing against you, for example, and the plan was 100% clear - take the Angels and go for a rush.. especially since the opponent had already lost 3 times and they were reloading autosaves.. If I were playing against a strong opponent.. I would have taken the Naga Bank for the gold.. for development or maybe a ransom, but here I didn't even look its way. Kyrre is stuck on Inferno - warming up on the ashes :) - she's just returning after picking up that 1 Angel.. that is, a conclusion from the previous "mistake"

Added after 59 seconds

124 - the Naga Bank still hasn't been scouted.

see above :)

Added after 49 seconds

125 - took a tier-3 Griffin Conservatory, a correct move to take the Medusa Hovel with a scout hero on 4 Angels. If Kyrre now passes by the bank - I wash my hands of it :).

see above :)

Added after 3 minutes

126 - passed by it and headed to a well for no reason, towards the border of already scouted secondaries, when there's a Conflux teleport to the treasure zone.

The plan was to go for a late-game rush, and regarding the teleport to the treasure zone, the passage to the right was also scouted into the treasure zone.. where there's a University +2 to everything, and a Utopia is visible, and Pandora's Boxes, and... And if I had done as you say... I would have given the opponent a chance to win... The reveal showed that he had a passage to a normal treasure zone with Hives and artifacts. Here it was 100% necessary to go on the attack....

Added after 3 minutes
;)

Summing up, I would note that more attention needs to be paid to hero movements in order to optimize the game's pace.

If I had a normal connection with you, I would have suggested a small tournament with you, best of 3, you in the role of "father" but without a revealed map.. and we'd see if I could snatch even 1 victory with my primitive playstyle and clumsy hero movements :)))

I completely agree with NeonDi, 100%. I've played with him and asked for his advice...
Optimizing the pace of the game is what's important for improving your skills and aiming for a turn 126 rush. It should become a habit because the game is all about playing ahead in everything (scouting territories, leveling up heroes, building up your castle, etc.)...

Regarding Aldehir, it's a primitive and debatable strategy, IMHO...
NeonDi explained in detail how he would act in a similar situation, and I'm very grateful to him for that (I read it twice)...

Overall, everything is very well done, thank you for the information, we're looking forward to the match between Lebron and Spirit (I'm rooting for you, Tyomich)...

and go to the treasure on turn 126; this should become a habit, because the game is all about playing ahead in every aspect.

Who's arguing? I could also go for the treasure... but what's the point? Wasting time and giving the opponent the same time to look for their chance... It was already clear that the strategy was to attack, and no treasure hunt was needed!

I hope there are no hard feelings here, and the discussion is friendly. Therefore, I will answer.

1. I didn't say that Aldegir is a bad player – we played on the same team at one time ;) , I was just asked to comment on where and how the game could be improved.
2. Regarding the 126 to the opponent – I added later that in that situation, it was the right decision. But in a game against high-level players, this is no longer a rush, especially since Aldegir didn't manage to reach the Castle by the end of the second week, i.e., 131 is no longer a rush at all, but rather a negative move – I have been convinced of this many times. So, you arrive at 131. And the opponent buys a creature on week 3 and takes it in a chain to the Castle, which already has a creature with 125 in the Treasury. What will you do? Chase after them – that's stupid; you'll be in the role of a supporting character in clearing the Treasury. Guard the Castles until week 4? Then they can return with 20+ units and parameters on week 137 and give you a hard time. Capture the Castle and return to your own Treasury? – this is a clear loss of tempo, as the Castle will still be returned on week 137. If no one has proven this to you in practice yet, believe me, it's still ahead.
3. Let's avoid arguments! - pit for lm

:smile17: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile15: :smile45: :smile08: :smile08: Neoandy, thank you for your comments on our game with Oleg. I would actually like to hear more comments directed towards me. I know I'm not playing very well, but I need to learn, and I have the desire to do so, although unfortunately, I don't have much time. Thanks again.