Discussion of level 4 monsters. — General

Lu41k

18 years ago

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1) I agree, I was wrong – it’s immunity. :) Let’s just say I didn’t express myself clearly. :)
2) And what if these mages have resistance buffed? :) And it’s not that difficult to buff resistance. ;) Or do they have a cloak? :) And also a Nature’s Ward cast? :)

Although I agree that without archers or attacking mages, a Dread Knight is preferable, although, if the druid can summon valkyries, then it’s not so bad. :) You can even manage without dragons.
And you have to agree that 2 Phoenixes under a Tactician are still better than 2 Dread Knights. ;)
But in general, you have to look at the situation, as they say, on the spot. Different situations – different tactics. :)

In reply to General ZeT

Byk

18 years ago

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General ZeT;174142

If anyone has questions about Minotaur vs. Black Dragons, look for it in one of the topics in section 4. Somewhere there, our Iron Champion explains how to defeat the Minotaur. And even if you don't find it, you'll learn a lot from IronAxe's posts, just like I did. :)

If it's not too much trouble, could you provide a link? I think I understand that it's all about luck. If luck is on your side, the Minotaur will win against the Black Dragon, but that's the case in any game. You need to consider the odds. The Minotaur needs to block the attack 20 times in a row, and the most it has blocked in a row for me is 3-4 times.

Added 11 minutes ago

ZYbr;191239

Champions? Should I replace fast Angels with a numerous but short-lived stack?
Besides their speed, Angels give the hero a second chance or replenish their losses in battle with neutrals, and they also look very good under buffs, unlike Champions. The same regeneration and Guardian Angel are more effective when the stack has more hit points. But Champions will attack a more or less strong and durable enemy unit, and they can be defeated, and no speed boost will save them. Moreover, the speed boost is only effective on the first turn; then, the Champions simply won't be allowed to gain momentum.
Regarding Hydras, unfortunately, the same applies. The unit is very strong, and it can also be buffed, but when the choice comes down to them and Black Dragons, there is no chance for the Hydra. In 4, speed is one of the most important guarantees of victory. With Black Dragons, the army will be very fast (and no other monsters are needed in the army). And in battle, Black Dragons are good because they can eliminate enemy mages and archers much more quickly, when the heroes are still weak (battles with neutrals), and the Hydra still needs to be buffed, which costs mana that the Chaos Knight needs to save, otherwise, it will run out at the most crucial moment.

I don't know why you decided that Angels look better than Champions under buffs; you can always use the speed boost when they are close to you, even if you outrun the enemy and attack from behind. Champions are almost as fast as Angels, maybe a little slower. Champions have a first strike, and with the speed boost, they will most likely defeat the enemy unit without taking damage or severely damage it, so the counterattack will be very weak. I agree that Angels are better in terms of regeneration, but if you consider all the pros and cons, Champions are better for me, and Angels might be better for you. This means that there should be a balance between these two units, which is a good thing. :) Regarding Hydras, I just see what's available in the guild. If there are buffs, I make Hydras and buff them. If not, I use Black Dragons. You can also cast a level 2 hero spell to increase the Hydra's speed, so it will reach the enemy in 2 turns. It would benefit from a blessing, hmm. :) The damage difference is too high.

Added 7 minutes ago

Lu41k;191256

Black Dragons are not just very strong. They have 100% magic resistance, which is undoubtedly a plus and sometimes a guarantee of victory, although this is sometimes a disadvantage because you can't cast protective or blessing spells, and you can't heal or regenerate... Oh well. But there must be some disadvantages. ;) And also... they are not cheap; they cost a lot of gold, and it's difficult to buy them back, and they are rare. But otherwise, they are just super units. They are much better than slow Hydras. Magic Dragons (by the way, specifically Magic Dragons) are also good, but... they have little hit points, they are weak in melee combat, and they are useless against resistance. If you play against mages, then Phoenixes are better; they are strong, they fly, and they have fire resistance. They attack 2-3 at a time (if they are in a group), and most importantly, they can be reborn if their mana is not stolen. Recently, when playing as Nature, I prefer them, although it depends on the opponent. Well, that's just my opinion. :)

You need to compare the number of units, that is, take Hydras into account twice as much, since the increase and price are the same. I didn't know that someone uses Magic Dragons in melee combat. They are mages, and their damage comes from spells. They have less protection and hit points for the same reason. However, it is an interesting unit. It is the only mage (in terms of damage) among the last units from the cities. It is easy to use it correctly, and that is another plus.

Zybr

18 years ago

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Angels appear stronger under buffs because they are inherently stronger. An angel with the Prayer buff has almost 300 HP, and if there's also a druid with high power in the army, that's an additional 25% to damage and HP, resulting in stats close to those of a Champion. Then, try to defeat angels protected by a Guardian with 5-6 charges.
And then, with the same set of champions.
By the way, if the terrain on the battlefield isn't favorable, their effectiveness will drop significantly.
Champions seem to have a speed of 26, while angels have either 30 or 35.

P.S. The War Drum is used in melee combat when its mana runs out.

CTPAHHuK

18 years ago

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I like Devils the most. With teleportation, it's easy to capture castles, defeat heroes, and attack monsters from a distance. You can also cast spells on Devils, and they can summon demons themselves.

Lu41k

18 years ago

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If it's not too much trouble, could you provide a link? I think I understand that it's all about randomness. If it's on your side, the Minotaur will defeat the Champion, but that's the case in any game. You need to consider the odds. The Minotaur needs to block the attack much more than 20 times in a row. The most I've seen him block is 3-4 attacks in a row.

It's all about save/load here. You catch the morale, luck, and even without them, you can defeat the Champion. Save before each attack, and that's it. Your Minotaur always deflects the Champion's attacks, and he attacks too. Eventually, after a certain number of attempts, he'll defeat him. Didn't manage to deflect? No problem, just load the save and try again. These things work in offline mode, but it's impossible in online mode. Although, in essence, it's cheating. However, it's difficult to catch... But if you want, it's possible. Daily save file checks.

In reply to Lu41k

Dr Motor

17 years ago

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Lu41k;191463

It's all about saving and loading here! You catch the morale and luck bonuses, and even without them, you can defeat the Champion. Save before each attack, and that's it! Your minotaur constantly deflects the Champion's attacks, but it still deals damage. Eventually, after a certain number of attempts, it will defeat him. If it fails to deflect, no problem – just reload and try again. This works in offline mode, but it's impossible in online mode. Although, technically, it's cheating... But it's hard to catch. However, if you really want to, it's possible. Daily save file checks.

With this method, you can defeat any non-magical opponent!
But is it worth it? I never use save/load during battles. If I lose, I either accept a victory with heavy losses or just replay the entire battle.

In reply to Dr Motor

Zybr

17 years ago

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Dr Motor;193124

This way, you can defeat any non-magical opponent!
But is it worth it? I never use save/load during a battle. If I lose, I either accept a victory with heavy losses or simply replay the entire battle.

This is offline. It has its own rules. Sometimes they may be incorrect, illogical, or unheroic, but that's just how it is – the harsh reality.

In reply to Zybr

Dr Motor

17 years ago

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ZYbr;193128

This is offline. It has its own rules. Sometimes they might be incorrect, illogical, or unheroic, but that's just how it is – a harsh reality.

Yeah... and I thought it could be tracked. I've never played in online or offline tournaments. I just downloaded a tournament save for Ice and Flame and want to try it out:o

In reply to Dr Motor

Полосатая

17 years ago

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By race:
Devil - Skeleton:
If you compare hit points and damage, the devil looks weak. But if it comes to speed... it's especially interesting when fighting non-ranged and not-too-fast neutral creatures. Demons take care of things while the devil himself sits in the corners of the battlefield using teleport. At the same time, he can also deal damage (don't forget about freezing!).
Fairy - Phoenix:
It's complicated. Very complicated. Resurrection or mirror image? Spells or speed? Besides, many resources are needed for the forest, but not in very large quantities, while a lot of mercury is needed for the stronghold, which is much harder to accumulate. But then the mantis comes into play... the portal itself is relatively cheap, and there are many other creatures in it, and there clearly won't be enough money for the mantis and someone else from this pair (But the mantis can bind, and considering that you need to stop the troops on their way to the druid... By the way, if I have to choose, I prefer phoenixes.
Golem - Titan:
As much as I love dragons, I have to say goodbye to them here. Even considering the first strike and the fact that it's a mechanical unit... Someone said that there will be too many ranged units? Golems and illusions can hold back enemies.
Angel - Champion:
I don't have any ideas here, because when playing as Life, I usually don't get this far. But when I do, I'll prefer angels according to my favorite principle: "Better to have a few crocodiles than many mice."
The same goes for the dragon-hydra pair. Although the hydra attacks everyone and without retaliation, the dragon has immunity, breath, and many other abilities. And it looks great!
What did I forget... hippogryphs-thunderbirds: birds are clearly faster and don't slow down the hero on the map. And they will deal with ranged units like those of the Order. The behemoths are, of course, more powerful, but they barely crawl to the battlefield. And just their appearance...
Well, who is the strongest... mega-dragons and fish are not available, unfortunately. But even super-duper black dragons had to share the spot with insects. Because of the cost and the ability to bind

Lord Vampire

17 years ago

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Each creature is good in its own way :) and suitable for certain tactics :) personally, I think that Chaos Devils are more useful due to their antimagic ability. But I rarely use them :) I almost never take Manticores, except if there are dwellings nearby where I can hire them. Well, I prefer Chaos Devils anyway :)

In reply to Полосатая

CTPAHHuK

17 years ago

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Kitty;194244

hippopotamus-thunderers: birds are clearly faster and don't slow down the hero on the map. And they will deal with units like those from Haven. Monsters are, of course, bigger, but they barely make it to the battlefield. And just looking at them...

Hmm, am I the only one who likes bears? They are better at protecting against cyclops, which are definitely preferable to ogres.

In reply to CTPAHHuK

General ZeT

17 years ago

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CTPAHHuK;194246

Hmm, am I the only one who likes bears? They are better at defending against cyclops, which are definitely preferable to ogres.

These so-called monsters are terribly scary, but only at first glance. If we compare them to the original Heroes 4 without any expansions, there's no arguing that they are powerful in their essence, but the catch is that the creators of the expansions, Storm of Magic and Armageddon's Blade, made the "new generation" creatures too powerful, such as the King, the Bull, etc. And this pushed most of the 4th-level creatures back. But still, if these monsters reach the battlefield:rolleyes: ... how many casualties will there be... :)
Who to build depends on the map, the opponent, and the hero himself. The enemy hero and the type of creatures in their army are also important.

snaiper133

17 years ago

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I voted for the mantis because I think it's the most useful among the level 4 creatures. It's great that after the "Creature of the Day" event, two level 4 creatures from the nature castle are leading, and the phoenix, like the others, received 2 votes. Nature generally has the best level 4 creatures, and the poll results confirm this. This is due to their good stats and a large number of special abilities (they have almost all special ability slots filled).