Posts from The war in South Ossetia.

right now, there's a full-blown information war going on between Russia and Georgia, with tons of disinformation. Did you really expect them to tell you the whole truth? For example, Saakashvili said that Georgian air defense shot down 10 planes and damaged 40 tanks... isn't that a lie?

I don't understand the criticism regarding Russia's intervention. At night, the Georgian army began shelling Tskhinvali without warning, using all types of weaponry, firing at homes, hospitals, and schools, as well as our military. They disregarded the civilian population and simply decided to level the city (which they actually succeeded in doing). And what should Russia have done if not intervene? Should they have said, "Well done, Georgian guys, keep it up"? No, diplomacy ended here, and it was time for military action. I remind you that they were firing at our peacekeepers and ordinary citizens, most of whom had Russian passports. The South Ossetian army is not worth criticizing. If Russia hadn't intervened, there would be no one left alive in the republic today.

The information war has already been won by the United States. After all, what have we actually done in the eyes of the whole world? We attacked a country that was defending its interests, a country that was striving to preserve its integrity. And naturally, everything we see and read is not necessarily the pure truth, although, it seems to me that our media is much more frank and closer to the truth than American and Western media.

P.S. Moderators, please rename the topic; the current title is completely meaningless. "The War in South Ossetia" would be much more appropriate and logical.

Omega is absolutely right. It’s quite possible that the situation is far more complex, and we are not as kind and innocent as the radio, television, and other media portray us. Why would they present themselves as monsters to their own country? Right now, there is a fierce information war going on, and nothing can be stated with certainty. All that remains is to hope that everything they tell us is true, and then our country is acting with dignity. But in general, this whole story is a clear provocation. It’s just not very well thought out. Either we refuse to help our allies, or we disrupt the unity of the state. And what should we do? In my opinion, the latter is better.

Omega is absolutely right. It's quite possible that the situation is much more complex, and we are not as kind and innocent as the radio, television, and other media portray us. Why would they portray themselves as monsters to their own country?

Yes. All of this is fabricated. Georgian troops did not fire on civilians in Tskhinvali or our peacekeepers, and Saakashvili did not make public statements about refraining from the use of force, only to later order an attack. Russia, on the other hand, is a monster and a suppressor of democracy, and it also spreads disinformation. All opinions like "maybe we are wrong" are utter nonsense and nothing more.

The fact that Georgia and Saakashvili are pawns on the chessboard of the world arena, controlled by the Americans, is no secret. As soon as I heard about the treacherous invasion and bombing of South Ossetia, I had a feeling that Ukraine would not stand aside and would, together with Georgia, loudly proclaim that Russia is evil! I don't know what the real rulers of the USA and NATO have in mind, but I dare to suggest that they planned it and, it seems, succeeded – to portray Russia as a dangerous state. This will be a small plus in favor of deploying missile defense systems in Eastern Europe. Medvedev is the queen for King Putin. I also don't know what they have in mind, and I don't even want to guess, because I don't understand Russia's interest in local conflicts, especially in the Caucasus. George W. Bush Jr. – as I see it, he and his administration have already taken care of choosing the president of the USA, and they will put in the person who will follow instructions. Otherwise, Bush would not have given the command to "attack" Saakashvili, and he, like a loyal Caucasian shepherd dog, attacked civilians. The prelude to World War III is possible – because remember how World War I began – when the Duke was killed, and how World War II began, when a German detachment, disguised in Polish military uniforms, attacked its own power plant (or something like that). An excuse is easy to find.
What is the way out of the current situation? Georgian troops must be completely driven out of South Ossetia, and the Georgian government must be removed. Pretexts can be found (for example, information has been received that Georgian troops are planning to use weapons of mass destruction in the fight against Russian troops, and if there are none, then it is always possible to plant them, as our brothers in mind – the Americans – did). There is no need to occupy and annex Georgia. Just take control of Tbilisi and the rest of Georgia and hold real democratic elections. And what about NATO? It is nothing. Do you really think that the direct successor to the USSR will be left without any trump cards up its sleeve? All of Siberia is full of missile silos. Missiles are Russia's main weapon. The missiles created back in the 70s and 80s still have no analogues in the world ("Topol"). And every day, Russian scientists are modernizing these missiles.

The only way out of this situation is to completely drive out the Georgian troops from South Ossetia and remove the Georgian government... ...Simply take control of Tbilisi and everything else in Georgia and hold real democratic elections... And what about NATO – it’s nothing. Do you really think that the direct successor to the USSR will be left without any trump cards up its sleeve? The entire Siberia is full of missile silos. Missiles are Russia’s most important weapon. The missiles created in the 70s and 80s still have no analogues in the world ("Topol"). And every single day, Russian scientists are modernizing these missiles.

In my opinion, those who started this are dreaming of Russia taking exactly these actions. And how would it benefit Russia to hold democratic elections in Georgia?
And NATO, yes, well, it’s just a minor thing, a few countries discussing something... :)

Planes bombing military bases near the capital – no matter how you look at it – are absolutely legitimate targets for the air defense of any country. And the Americans will push for a presence on Georgian territory with "independent" peacekeeping forces or NATO troops, and Georgian troops, fueled and supported by America, will move on Ossetia again – with new equipment, weapons, and experience.

George W. Bush – it seems to me that he and his administration have already taken care of choosing the next US president, and they will put forward the person who will follow instructions.

By the way, it is not a given that the Russian situation with the presidential election will repeat itself in America. George Bush does not have the same popularity and level of trust in the United States as Vladimir Putin, and it is quite possible that with his departure, US policy will change somewhat (not radically, of course). At the same time, the conflict in South Ossetia is only beneficial to the presidential candidates; they have the opportunity to demonstrate their diplomatic skills, their ability to criticize Russia beautifully and competently (saying, "how wrong the Russians acted, damn it," etc.).

to remove the Georgian government.

This definitely will not happen. At the UN Security Council, Vitaly Churkin made it clear, unequivocally, that Russia is not going to remove the Georgian government and, in general, is not going to go any further than the border of South Ossetia. "Regime change – isn't that American terminology?" This is a rather strong and bold statement, and Churkin deserves great respect for it. Not to mention that the international community will definitely not approve of this action. Can you imagine how they will distort the essence and portray us as villains in the press?

Do you really think that the direct successor to the USSR will be left without any trump cards up its sleeve? The entire Siberia is packed with missile silos. Missiles are Russia's most important weapon. The missiles created back in the 70s and 80s still have no analogues in the world ("Topol"). And every single day, Russian scientists are modernizing these missiles.

However, using missiles to resolve the situation is not a good idea. If you say that Russia has a lot of missiles, it could destroy the Earth. But there is so much nuclear weapons in the world that it could destroy the Earth 15 times. If you launch more than half of your missiles, the world will face a global catastrophe that will destroy Russia. After all, nuclear winter and nuclear night are concepts that encompass the entire Earth, so missiles today are a powder keg.

yes, without a doubt, this is a provocation. although, it's not entirely humane, is it?

the saddest thing is that many Georgian citizens support Saakashvili's policies. ordinary people, to whom he feeds his "patriotic" slogans, are just as susceptible to them as we are. they are told about the independence of the country and the need to defend its constitutional order.
...I heard that Abkhazia has also declared martial law in the adjacent territories, and that our fleet is currently located near its shores, and that a skirmish occurred between our and Georgian ships, during which one Georgian ship was sunk.
I also heard somewhere that Saakashvili announced to the world the "cessation of hostilities." but I don't really believe it yet.

I heard that the ratings of the US presidential candidates (there are only two) have almost equalized. If McCain becomes president, then the conflict in the Caucasus will only escalate... He doesn't hide his strongly anti-Russian policy.

To confirm Vaishan's words, here are McCain's views on Russia:

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John McCain is known for his negative attitude towards the policies of former Russian President Vladimir Putin. In 2003, he stated that "American foreign policy must reflect the sobering realization that the Russian government, which does not share our most basic values, cannot be a friend or partner and risks, through its own behavior, placing itself in the category of enemies." In his opinion, "the creeping coup against the forces of democracy and market capitalism in Russia threatens the foundations of American-Russian relations and gives rise to the specter of a new era of 'cold war' between Washington and Moscow." Playing on George W. Bush's famous remark about "Putin's soul," after meeting with the Russian president in Slovenia, McCain said: "When I looked into Putin's eyes, I saw three letters: KGB."

In 2005, McCain and Senator Joseph Lieberman introduced a Senate resolution calling for the suspension of Russia's membership in the G8. In the same year, he became one of the initiators of the Senate's adoption of a resolution accusing the Russian authorities of the fact that the trial of Mikhail Khodorkovsky and Platon Lebedev was "politically motivated." McCain also repeatedly called for Russia to be excluded from the G8:

Today, we see Russia, led by a clique of former intelligence officers. They are trying to intimidate their democratic neighbors, such as Georgia, and are trying to exploit Europe's dependence on Russian oil and gas. The West needs to reconsider its view of revanchist Russia. First, the G8 should be expanded to include leading market democracies – Brazil and India – and Russia should be excluded.

McCain's point of view on the processes taking place in the post-Soviet space is also directly opposite to the position of the Kremlin. For example, he actively criticizes the activities of Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko, in connection with which, in 2004, he was banned from entering this country. According to McCain himself, his supporters, and some media outlets hostile to the current Belarusian leadership, this ban was imposed. Belarusian authorities claim that this step was a symmetrical response (not only in relation to McCain, but also to a number of other American officials) to similar measures by the United States against the President of Belarus and other representatives of the Belarusian leadership. In 2005, McCain, together with Senator Hillary Clinton, nominated Mikhail Saakashvili and Viktor Yushchenko for the Nobel Peace Prize. The application stated: "Awarding these two people the Nobel Peace Prize will not only mark their historical role in Georgia and Ukraine, but will also generate hope and inspiration for all those who strive for freedom in other countries where it does not exist."

In 2007, McCain supported a bill to support efforts to bring Georgia and Ukraine into NATO.

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There is much to think about...

I couldn't stay away and not post in this thread. Regarding America: if Obama becomes president, we'll just be lucky, as I highly doubt he'll support Georgia. Regarding Saakashvili: he should be tried in The Hague as a global criminal. What Georgia is doing in Ossetia, in my opinion, is a real genocide. I have nothing more to say.

Georgia's actions in Ossetia could have been portrayed as genocide if our army hadn't intervened. And we intervened, succumbing to an obvious provocation. And it's also unclear whether the Georgians were shelling civilians or not; it could be another instance of disinformation. I'm not defending Georgia, nor am I saying that we are to blame; BOTH sides are to blame. Russia could have threatened them with the same missiles, and that threat alone would have been enough to shut Saakashvili up immediately, but we decided to deploy troops. Why doesn't Georgia want to grant Ossetia independence? Well, think about it: did we grant Chechnya independence at one point? That's all there is to it. No one wants to lose a piece of their own pie. And granting Russian citizenship to the residents of South Ossetia was also a major provocation at the time, but the Georgians didn't fall for it, notice. Hold democratic elections in Georgia? Ha, guys, do you think we had democratic elections? Look for yourselves: Yeltsin may have been elected (I can't say for sure – I was just a kid back then and didn't follow the country's affairs at all), but after that, we elect those whom the current president points to. Yeltsin proposed Putin, so we elected Putin. Putin proposed Medvedev, so we elected Medvedev. And all of this with a huge margin in the votes. I don't quite believe that the elections were fair, so it's unlikely that we would hold democratic elections in Georgia in the event of a forced change of government. Well, that's a digression from the topic.