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Posts from Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition - Tactical Edition.
Dark Revelation has been moved to Occultism (Dark Elf race).
Nargott
OCCULTISM Mark of the Assassin (sign of the cursed) -> Torturing Strike Dark Ritual -> Fallen Knight (will be renamed) Enhanced Magic (Arcane Wave) -> Sense Elements
Where is Dark Revelation?
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
Removed it as the least interesting perk.
Some players consider it weak, especially those who prefer long games, although taking this perk towards the end of the game seems appealing.
What does Dark Revelation essentially give?
1) Obtaining the perk.
2) Obtaining +1 stat.
3) Obtaining +1 formal hero level.
4) Slowing down subsequent level growth (up to reducing the bonuses from 1-3 to zero in the long run).
Obtaining the perk – we can take it immediately instead of Town. From the point of view of interest, only points 2-4 remain.
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
By the way, regarding retraining for heroes. I might ask a very silly question: Is it just me, or is the retraining button broken and ignoring clicks, or did I simply miss a line somewhere that says retraining doesn't work the same way anymore?
Опали листья кровью окропившись, телами павших устлана земля. В последний раз с противником сразившись, сбежал герой о поражении отчаянно трубя.
Победоносной поступью шагая, над полем брани вырос силуэт. Склонился Серафим собратьев созывая, в последний раз над ним сияет Божий свет.
Победой Ангелов сегодня бой окончен, увы но тем боям конца и края нет. Когда же миром будет люд доволен? Ведь "Не Убий" твердит Святой Завет!
Dark replenishment has been removed (due to a bug that allowed casting spells for free).
Could you provide more details if possible? I haven't encountered this (probably because I rarely upgraded this skill), and is this bug unfixable? P.S. Regarding bugs and their fixes, you mentioned that one of the reasons for removing the education upgrade for Orcs was a bug with the mentor's cooldown – you reset the education, but the stats from the education remain. This can be fixed (I think I mentioned it somewhere before). The problem isn't with the Orc, but with the Orcish education – the duplicate education needs to be removed, and the Orcs should be given a regular education, and then everything will be fine.
Added 2 minutes later If you know of any other buggy perks, please let me know – I need to clean them up as well.
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
By the way, regarding retraining for Humans. I might be asking a very stupid question: Is it just me, or is the retraining button broken and ignoring clicks, or did I simply miss a line somewhere that says retraining now works differently?
Retraining (training) only works for knights (it doesn't work for paladins or temple guards). Unfortunately, this limitation cannot be fixed. That is, if a knight doesn't appear in the tavern during the game, you have to play without retraining (fortunately, the racial unit itself will be strengthened up to double damage or so). SRD
And here, if possible, could you be more specific - I haven't encountered this (probably because I rarely level up this skill), and is this bug unfixable?
I've heard about it myself, but haven't seen it. But the fact that this perk was removed in the multiplayer tournament mode (RTA) is already an indication that the issues with this perk are too severe to leave it in. I'll try this perk sometime, but for now, I consider it dead by default.
The duplicate education perk should be removed and Orcs should be given the regular education perk, and then everything will be fine.
It's been fixed differently: 1) Orcs no longer have the education perk at all 2) There will probably be no mentor on the maps 3) Natural stats for education will not be given (by patching the executable), instead, exactly 2 stats will be given for each skill level via scripts, which will fix the imbalance of the skill in long games
Actually, why does an Orc need education if the perks in it should be magical, and Orcs don't have magic? Just for the stats? That's not a reason. An Orc is a smart warrior. An Orc will not study. An Orc will fight.
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
Retraining works ONLY for knights (it doesn't work for paladins or temple guards). Unfortunately, this limitation cannot be fixed. That is, if a knight doesn't appear in the tavern during the game, you have to play without retraining (fortunately, the racial unit itself will be strengthened up to double the stats or so).
I heard about this myself, but I haven't seen it. But the fact that this perk was removed in the multiplayer tournament mode (RTA) is already an indicator that the flaws in this perk are too severe to leave them in. I will try this perk sometime, but for now, I consider it dead by default.
It has been fixed differently: 1) Orcs no longer have education at all. 2) There will probably be no mentor on the maps. 3) Natural stats for education will not be given (by editing the executable), instead, exactly 2 stats will be given for each skill level via scripts, this will fix the imbalance of the skill in long games.
Actually, why does an orc need education if the perks in it should be magical, and orcs don't have magic? Just for the stats? That's not a reason. An orc is a smart warrior. An orc will not study. An orc will fight.
Why turn education into a magical skill??? - education itself increases stats in accordance with the probability of their appearance for a given class, i.e., there is no connection to specific magic, the only thing that connects education to magic is the perks for witchcraft - I removed them from education, but it is worth leaving the perks for knowledge in education - education and knowledge are logically connected, and mana is also in demand for summons for the orc. Military education has not been canceled.
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
Orc education is like leadership for a necromancer. And what else should education give? It only provides magical skills. In terms of working with summons, orcs have battle cries, in which they can also gain mana efficiency. And in terms of stats, orcs have anti-schools, for which additional stats are now awarded (for example, for anti-light - knowledge). So, I don't see any need for education for an orc at all. Stats in suppressions, cries - in summons.
Now, regarding the perks from education. 1. Diversion is not needed for an orc, as there are more thematic diversions in suppressions. 2. Military Knowledge. If an orc has 4 summons out of 6 from a natural guild, does it need to have all 6 with military knowledge? 3. Intelligence. Not for an orc. 4. Fury of Fire - moved to a racial skill. 5. Endurance - moved to defense for all races.
In general, the main reason why education has been removed for orcs is the shortage of orc-specific perks. There are already 4 suppressions, battle cries, and a racial skill. So, should perks also be allocated to education? And where will they come from? Leave 3-4 perks in each skill? It's better to have all skills fully developed, but without education.
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
I conducted a test of the "Dark Replenishment" perk:
Heroes: Letos vs. Osir
1. Letos: cast "Weakness" spell, target - War Unicorns;
War Unicorns: spell resisted
Result: spell resisted, mana not returned, Letos's next turn starts earlier.
2. Letos: cast "Weakness (mass)" spell, target - entire army (War Unicorns, Ancient Ents, High Druids, Marksmen);
War Unicorns: spell resisted
Ancient Ents: spell resisted
High Druids: spell resisted
Marksmen: spell resisted
Result: spell completely resisted (by the entire army), mana not returned, next turn starts earlier (the reason for the smaller initiative penalty is unclear, and there are two possibilities: either due to the use of the mass version of the spell, or due to the use of the mass version of the spell + the effect of Dark Replenishment).
3. Letos: cast "Weakness (mass)" spell, target - entire army (War Unicorns, Ancient Ents, High Druids, Marksmen);
War Unicorns: spell resisted
Ancient Ents: spell resisted
High Druids: spell took effect
Marksmen: spell took effect
Result: spell partially resisted, mana not returned, next turn starts earlier (the reason for the smaller initiative penalty is unclear, and there are two possibilities: either due to the use of the mass version of the spell, or due to the use of the mass version of the spell + the effect of Dark Replenishment).
In other words, no bugs related to free casting of the perk were found. I assume that it was removed in the Real-Time Tactics version because they consider it overpowered (this is just my guess; I don't think it's overpowered myself).
P.S.: The test was conducted with dueling heroes (1v1 duel mode).
P.P.S.: During the test, I monitored the Attack Rating scale and noticed that the "Bowman's Dream" set also affects the Ballista – just a side note; I hadn't paid attention to this before, but it might be a well-known fact.
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
You're digging in the wrong direction; try summoning spells, various crystals, or mines. You can easily determine the exact ATB value if you have at least one unit with a cast time. For example, if a spell lasts 9.33 turns at the moment of the hero's turn and 8.83 turns at the moment of the hero's second turn, it means that exactly 0.5 ATB has passed.
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
Tried it: indeed, the Crystal of Secrets, Wall of Swords, and Hive are now free! So, we must execute, not pardon!
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
Tried it: indeed, the Secret Crystal, Wall of Swords, and Hive spells became free! So, there's no room for mercy!
In other words, am I understanding the situation correctly: if a hero has the "Dark Replenishment" skill, these spells are cast for free (and 20% faster), regardless of anything (whether or not the opponent has resistance to them)? Is the problem only with these spells?
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
Yes, there is less of a penalty on the initiative scale, and mana is not consumed at all; I checked this with summoning – the test hero ran out of mana :D. Therefore, out of 12 summoning spells, I tested 11 (I didn't have enough mana for the phoenix); all the spells consumed mana except for the wall, the hive, and the crystal.
I suspect that the fire wall also won't consume mana if cast in an empty space.
Added 2 minutes ago
In general, the summoning of the crystal and the wall was near the unicorn – perhaps resistance was triggered (this was not displayed in the log or visually on the battlefield, but mechanically, it is possible that resistance was calculated).
Added 3 minutes ago
I checked everything – the phoenix consumed mana; three casts are free and without any resistances.
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
Okay, so the bug looks like this:
- Spells that deal damage but, for some reason, don't deal damage immediately are considered deflected.
Perhaps it can be fixed by changing the type of the spells themselves? Mines also consume mana, right? Are there any differences in the type compared to mines?
Разработчик Heroes 5.5 WarGame Edition. Сайт проекта - пока неактивен Автор Асимметричных шахмат
Maybe – it’s worth a try, but for now, I’ll just remove it. We could try contacting the authors of the RTA and ask them about this – perhaps they tried to fix this bug, and if they removed the perk, it means they couldn’t fix it.
Added 6 minutes later The first difference is the true line (I think it’s responsible for the spell’s targeting).
This line exists for the mine but not for the crystal and the wall, but it does exist for the hive – so it’s a dead end.
Added 3 minutes later Differences in the line:
For the mine: TARGET_NEUTRAL
For the three spells: TARGET_HOSTILE
Added 2 minutes later Okay, the true line is actually present in all of them, it’s just located differently.
Added 1 minute later I’ll try changing hostility to neutrality.
Added 8 minutes later I tried – it didn’t help – there were no changes at all
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
Nargott, you're quite the instigator (in the best sense of the word, of course :D - you inspire with great ideas) - now I had to rework half of it again (no exaggeration, it's already the tenth time :smile04: )
Added 6 minutes ago Aren't there too few perks left for skills? - I'm all for removing absolute nonsense like the patronage of Askh, but for example, in Attack, there aren't many perks anyway - should we remove Devilish Strike and Stun from there (on the other hand, they are also a bit out of place - Attack as a skill is focused on strengthening the army, not the hero, and accordingly, the perks in Attack should be those that affect the army, not the hero)
Added 20 minutes ago Nargott
Double Rune (Greatest) is questionable, as it is incredibly powerful in the late game (like CA?). Therefore, it is questionable which CA the Dwarf will have left, Double Rune or Absolute Protection.
What if we made it so that Double Rune, while remaining a regular perk (not a CA), would block the path to Absolute Protection when taken, that is, you would have to choose between Absolute Protection and Double Rune. Example: 1) Attacking Warlord -> Rune Harmony 2) Defensive Warlord -> Rune Recall 3) Economical Rune -> Refreshed Rune -> Greatest Rune Absolute Protection = Defensive Warlord + Rune Harmony
... И древний лес, роскошен и печален, Блистает там воздушностью прогалин. Но между кедров, полных тишиной, Расщелина по склону ниспадала. О, никогда под бледною луной Так пышен не был тот уют лесной...
SRD
