Tactics in BATTLES — Tactics

Ley

19 years ago

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ewgeniy;108584

Okay, let's slow down...
Let's outline the conditions more specifically. And what will "expert ballistics" give if the catapult is destroyed?

It's hard to argue with that, BUT the catapult moves first, and with "expert ballistics," it has a fairly high chance of breaking down the gates even before the opponent's turn...

ewgeniy;108584

Cyclops... yes... but the computer often, instead of breaking down the wall, starts shooting (just saying:D)

Zhenya, I can't agree with you again. Quite the opposite: the computer shoots cyclops at the walls even when it could finish off the enemy instead ;)

ewgeniy;108584

Describe what's in one army and what's in the other, what skills, spells, etc.
And look at who has what strategy:smile02: :smile02:

Well, briefly:
Of course, all of the above also applies to this example; I'll just add:
1) Defend the Castle Tower (we're just talking about this).
2) Make sure ALL monsters in the "defense" are flying, except for the Titan.
3) The hero should have a specific type of magic, i.e., put destructive magic, for example, only one with damage, say 249, acceleration is a must, and slow (these secondary skills are not necessary).
4) The hero must have "expert artillery."
5) Magic power and knowledge skills should be excellent.
---------------------------------------------
1) The attacker must be MUCH stronger than the opponent.
2) Expert ballistics - of course, plus expert intellect.
3) Archers, as I already wrote, and "runners" - no flying units.
4) Acceleration with "expert air."
5) Let him have mages, or even better, archmages.
6) Attack and defense - about 50, knowledge 12, for example (not very important).

Well, I'm just saying, experiment yourself - create a tactically complex battle that you know how to win, - teach those who are really interested, and explain your own combat tactics, good luck!

P.S. remember: you're not doing this because of your own principles and motives, or even worse, because of an argument, but for the fans of this wonderful game. I will, of course, support any such ideas and try to explain what, how, and why more accurately and objectively

In reply to Ley

ewgeniy

19 years ago

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I could certainly do something similar, but I don't feel like it...
If the question is whether it's possible, of course, it is. I was talking about a specific case, on the map "Very Many Golems," where I was defending a tower with relatively small forces (I remember the details – the computer had ballistics expertise, and I had a rain spell of 500+, which I used to destroy the catapult with some unknown autosave load). The point isn't about flying units, or cyclops, which weren't there; it's that I killed everything except the golems (about 700 of them) and started running around the map with the remaining troops until all the golems died. This battle took at least half an hour...

And I also recommend!
To practice tactics and strategy, play the map "Day of the Hurricane" (in WoG 3.52, before it was cluttered with all sorts of experience, and the creatures and generals don't have any special abilities...).
I played this map twice...
The first time, 2.5 years ago, the second time, 4.5 months ago.
I practiced both tactics and strategy very well on it. It would be great to include it in some offline mode;)
TO Ley: Let's see what the others say, because it seems like this topic is just for the two of us. And in general, it's starting to feel like an off-topic discussion:smile28:

gamer-kirill

19 years ago

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Also, a berserker can be very helpful during a castle siege. If you block the gate with a level 1 unit to prevent anyone from exiting and cast a spell (if you have a fire magic expert), which I always try to develop, on half of the enemy troops, then the warriors that arrive (1-2 squads) will face your entire army, except for the units holding the door. However, in this case, it would be good to have a controllable catapult, as there is little space in the castle, and it is difficult for the enemy units to disperse from the fire magic expert berserker.

In reply to gamer-kirill

ewgeniy

19 years ago

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In general, I really enjoy the tactic of taking down a bunch of Azure Dragons on a complex map with several dozen Archons, while having a good amount of mana, Counterspell, and Clone with Expert Water magic... Berserk works very well if the opponent doesn't have Dragons or Phoenixes.... It's great to attack a powerful enemy army with just one Phoenix, casting Armageddon. The main thing is not to get caught in Shackles:rolleyes: And in general, speed is key! The main rule: Have a faster army, and you can strategically defeat a stronger opponent.

In reply to gamer-kirill

AmberSoler

19 years ago

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gamer-kirill;108840

those warriors that arrive (1-2 squads) will face your entire army, except for the units holding the door.

If not all seven slots in the army are occupied, the gate can be held by only one or two units, separated from the main stack (as long as they have enough health to reach the gate). The point is that a fallen unit of the attacker still continues to block the enemy's gate – it's like Alexander Matrosov... :) And the main stack can engage in a full-fledged melee battle.

In reply to AmberSoler

gamer-kirill

18 years ago

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AmberSoler;109042

If not all seven slots in the army are occupied, the gate can be held by just one or two units, separated from the main stack (as long as they have enough health to reach the gate). The point is that a fallen unit of the attacker still continues to block the enemy's gate – it's like Alexander Matrosov... :) And the main stack can engage in a full-fledged melee.

I completely agree! By the way, if it's the computer, it usually doesn't kill the unit at the gate and generally starts behaving very strangely. Sometimes it will break through the castle wall and stand with its army in front of the moat. A human also doesn't need to waste time on a unit holding the gate.

Added 1 minute ago
I misspoke; when I mentioned the strange behavior of the computer, I meant the situation when the computer is attacking a castle.

In reply to gamer-kirill

St.all.in

18 years ago

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I usually play as the Tower faction, and Might and Magic is my forte, so I often use the following method to fight an opponent who vastly outnumbers me in strength. You need to choose a Castle, preferably one captured from the enemy, and wait for the main enemy force inside it. When they are within range, gather a small army (a very small one, for example, 7 Djinns spread across all slots) and attack. At the same time, have one or two spells ready to cast, such as an explosion or a meteor shower (depending on what you have available), and then retreat. You recall your hero and repeat the process, but don't overdo it; you also need to have time to teleport to a friendly Castle, and you can simply burn the enemy Castle:rolleyes:, and soon after, recapture it and do everything again. It takes a lot of effort, but your army remains intact, while the enemy's dwindles. You should complete all these maneuvers by the end of the week and then engage in a battle where only one side remains.

When attacking a Tower Castle, you can use the "Dispel" spell at the Expert level and use mines extensively.

If you don't want to lose your valuable flying units during a Castle assault, try blinding the archers or using the "Forgetfulness" spell. The troops will come out of hiding on their own, and someone will definitely open the gates for you.

Use the "Mirror Image" spell right during the turn of the desired unit; the damage often turns out to be greater than when using a combat spell. It's best to clone units that either don't retaliate on attack or archers (although sometimes the circumstances require a different approach).

Slowing down the enemy is often what brings victory

Vanechka

18 years ago

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I hardly play online at all. As for playing against the computer, it seems to me that the tactics of casting Meteor Shower and repeatedly using Escape, sending a "Matrosov" to the enemy gates, practically negate the computer's already slim chances of winning... In general, I try to cast Restoration as little as possible and practically never cast Portal, Flight, or Dimension Door. Why, after making an elegant move with a hero and one Phoenix, and wiping out the entire enemy army with magic, practically without any suspense, end the map completion?... That's not very sporting :)

In reply to St.all.in

Ley

18 years ago

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St.all.in;109365

I usually play as Tower, and magic is my bread and butter, so I often use the following method to fight an opponent who vastly outnumbers me in strength. You need to choose a Castle, preferably one captured from the enemy, and wait for the main enemy in it. When he is within range, gather a small army (a very small one, for example, 7 Djinns spread across all slots) and attack. At the same time, you have one or two spells for summoning, such as Explosion or Meteor Shower (depending on what you have), and then you retreat. You buy back your hero and repeat the process, but you shouldn't overdo it; you also need to have time to teleport to a friendly Castle, and you can simply burn the enemy Castle:rolleyes:, and soon after, recapture it and do everything again. It takes a lot of effort, but your army remains, while the enemy's dwindles.

+1, this is exactly what I wrote about in earlier posts – everything is in order and clearly explained, but there's no save file :(, why is that?

St.all.in;109365

All these maneuvers should be completed by the end of the week, and a battle should be fought in which only one remains.

Why by the end of the week? If you're talking about the heroes in the tavern changing, you're wrong; the hero you fled with will still be waiting for you in the tavern 7 days later.
And in general, I personally rarely sit "at home" and wait: "when will they attack me...", I usually develop a secondary hero, give him knowledge and magic power, say, to 5 (this is usually enough), wisdom, and artillery, and only then do I use this tactic: attack, retreat, and attack again...:)

When attacking a Tower Castle, you can use the Expert-level spell removal and mines to great effect.

St.all.in;109365

Use the Mirror Image spell right during the turn of the desired unit; the damage often turns out to be greater than when using a combat spell.

Let's talk about this aspect in more detail...

In reply to Ley

St.all.in

18 years ago

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FOR Ley

Indeed, my apologies. I meant "clone," not "mirror." Now, it should be clearer that on maps like XL, the damage from combat spells usually doesn't exceed ten thousand, but a cloned creature, and with a good setup, can deal much more damage, even twice as much.
I might be wrong, but mid-level heroes are significantly more useful for exploring territories while the main hero is away, and they need a decent-sized army to complete their assigned tasks. Their skills are limited, their level isn't high enough, and they aren't found in every location, and their artifacts aren't top-tier. You could, of course, have Gremlins attack Titans, but what's the point? We'll only give the enemy experience and lose a lot of money.
Moreover, I'm not suggesting that the main hero should stay in the Castle. As a necessary condition, they should have teleportation to a level-expert city, and I consider the absence of this condition on XL maps to be like losing a queen in chess. And when capturing any Castle that can be lost, I buy back the entire army to leave nothing for the enemy. If a Castle needs to be surrendered, but we don't want to lose the army, the troops are withdrawn, and only 7 of the cheapest units are left. This will allow the towers to harass the enemy for 1-2 turns. It's a small thing, but it's nice.

I want to remind you that, although the computer is a terrible strategist, it consistently buys back its army. And starting all over again is pointless. Its army without a hero practically means nothing. Therefore, it's better to finish off a strong enemy either in a Castle (but not a Barbarian one, as they will escape through a secret passage) or with shackles. Although you can also try that, but it's more complicated because the computer will run away for hours, even with a significant army, if there's a chance of losing the hero. Blind them and surrender, sometimes it works.

In reply to St.all.in

Ley

18 years ago

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St.all.in;109563

FOR Ley
I might be wrong, but mid-tier heroes are much more useful for exploring territories while the main hero is away, and they need a decent-sized army to accomplish their tasks. Their skills are weak, their level isn't high, and they aren't present in every location, and their artifacts aren't top-notch. You can, of course, have Goblins attack Titans, but what's the point? We'll just give the enemy experience and lose a lot of money.

Well, everyone has their own opinion ;). You can use a hero with just one Harpy to explore the territory, for example. And regarding the hero guarding the Castle, which I wrote about, there's definitely a chance of winning! And it's not about the skills at all. But I disagree about the computer gaining experience – we attack, use an attack spell, and retreat :) and so on. What experience are you talking about? Zero? :D

St.all.in;109563

Moreover, I'm not suggesting that the main hero should stay in the Castle; as a necessary condition, he should have a teleport to a level Expert city, and I consider the absence of this condition on XL maps as a loss of a queen in chess. And when capturing any Castle that can be lost, I buy back the entire army so that the enemy doesn't get anything. If the Castle needs to be abandoned, but we don't want to lose the army, then the troops are withdrawn, and only 7 of the cheapest units are left. This will allow the Towers to harass the enemy for 1-2 turns. It's a small thing, but it's nice :)

Town Portal is definitely a good thing, but what do you do if you're in a rich area with valuable artifacts that you need to bring back to the Castle? It's much simpler to have the main hero run around with a secondary hero for a while, level him up a bit, and that's it. What's the point of such a pointless plot?
But if the main hero arrives, then, of course, he can say, "Go back..." :)

St.all.in;109563

Although, you can do it that way, but it's more complicated because the computer will run away even with a significant army if there's a chance of losing the hero. Blind and retreat, sometimes it works.

I disagree again – the computer never runs away if it has a superior army, never! It can't anticipate, but as soon as its army's power is significantly reduced in battle, it will naturally "make a run for it" :D

In reply to Ley

St.all.in

18 years ago

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For Ley

It’s quite difficult to argue about tactics and strategy without a specific situation and task. But we shouldn’t forget that the goal is not to collect more artifacts, but to defeat the enemy (although collecting artifacts also contributes to this). Victory over the main hero (no matter how it is achieved) is already half the battle. Moreover, the option I proposed is used against very strong enemies, whom you simply cannot defeat on the battlefield. And this plan is implemented quite quickly.

In my understanding, middle-tier heroes don’t engage in collecting; they defend the areas that haven’t been captured yet. And, of course, they collect those with only one harpy:D

Just for fun, take a look at my map posted on this site. There are plenty of enemies to fight there;)

In reply to St.all.in

Ley

18 years ago

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St.all.in;109835

It's quite difficult to argue about tactics and strategy without a specific situation and task.

So, what's the problem? Just upload a save file with one of those tasks, and we'll see...

St.all.in;109835

But don't forget that the goal is not to collect more artifacts, but to defeat the enemy (although collecting artifacts also helps with that).

Well, it depends on the victory conditions. I don't think I need to tell you that I've won scenarios many times without even seeing the enemy's main hero... :)

St.all.in;109835

Defeating the main hero (no matter how) is already half the battle. Moreover, the method I suggested is used against very strong enemies that simply cannot be defeated on the battlefield. And this plan is implemented quite quickly.

How quickly? The goal is to wait and eliminate the main hero from the enemy's forces, and then quickly run through the "remaining" ones? Is that what you mean? - I don't see the point at all! I just find him and eliminate him; that's all that works for me ;) - only in this case can we talk about the speed of completing the map.

St.all.in;109835

In my understanding, medium-level heroes don't focus on collecting; they defend the areas that haven't been captured yet. And, of course, they collect from those with only one harpy:D

Well, my medium-level heroes are comparable to those with one harpy; usually, these are the enemy heroes and one of mine.

St.all.in;109835

Just for fun, take a look at my map uploaded on this site. There are plenty of enemies to fight there;)

I'll take a look, but then be prepared to hear some criticism :D

Kyle

18 years ago

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Dear Ley asked to post this save file.
He will tell you why. ;)

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In reply to Kyle

Ley

18 years ago

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Kyle;109996

Dear Ley, he asked to post this save file.
Why? He will tell you everything. ;)

Everything is correct, thank you Kyle!

In this save file, you can easily see one of the types of tactics in this game...
The save was made on a map in the "War of the Strongest" tournament. The task is simple: defeat about 300 Naga Kings. I believe that this task is not easy for beginners! And even our Masters will have to think about how to win this battle...
Anyone who wants to challenge my statement is welcome to, but first, win... ;)
I see 2 possible ways to win in this save...

P.S. I will be sincerely glad for any discussions about this, maybe I will learn something myself :), but the main goal is to convey to our forum users the Art of Fighting against a completely different contingent of people!

I would like to wish everyone (regardless of their skill level) good luck!

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