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Posts from Balanced Units - A minimal balance mod for units

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9 years ago
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Balanced Units - Balanced Units

Balanced Units is a balance mini-mod that fixes serious creature balance errors that lead to an absolute lack of choice between one upgrade or another. Differences from other balance mods:
1) absence of penny-ante tweaks, only significant and fundamental changes in pairs where there are obvious imbalances; the goal is practical alignment of upgrades, not ideal
2) absence of controversial or voluminous complex changes; the goal is balance via minimal, pinpoint edits
3) absence of radical creature redesigns and other creativity adding new abilities (with the exception of rakshasas with agility), only balance tweaks.

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HUMANS
1. Crossbowmen: armor-piercing radius = 4 hexes (was 3)
2. Marksmen: damage 2-6 (was 2-8)

MAGICIANS
3. Rakshasa Rajas: initiative 10 (was 8), +agility

ELVES
4. Death Dancers: damage 4-6 (was 3-5), 100% dance (was 50%)
5. Bowmasters: initiative 11 (was 10)
6. Forest Rangers: damage 6-6 (was 8-9)

DWARVES
7. Mountain Guards: damage 2-2 (was 1-2)
8. Berserkers: health 30 (was 25)
9. Arcat's Dragons: liquid flame damage 20 (was 10)

DEMONS
10. Fire Demons: health 16 (was 13), explosion 3 times stronger
11. Demonesses: damage 9-13 (was 6-13)
12. Hell Horses: aura damage 7 (was 10)

UNDEAD
13. Higher Vampires: damage 9-13 (was 7-11), Vampire Lords: stun chance reduced by approximately half (factor 1 instead of 3)

DARK ELVES
14. Stalkers, Night Mistresses: invisibility 2 rounds (instead of 3)
15. Nimble Riders: 100% drive-by attack (was 25%)
16. Shadow Mistresses: damage 20-30 (was 17-27)
17. Red Dragons: 200% burn (was 150%)

ORCS
18. Nomad Centaurs: damage 4-6 (was 3-6), initiative 11 (was 10)
19. Orc Warriors: health 14 (was 12)
20. Daughters of the Sky: mana 16 (was 12)

NEUTRALS
21. Wolves: Power doubled (guard strength reduced)

BUILDINGS
22. Dragon Cemetery, Dragon Tomb: 10 mercury each (instead of 20 and 15), Dragon Gravestone: 5 mercury (instead of 10).















Explanations of reasons:
1. Crossbowmen: armor-piercing radius = 4 hexes (was 3)
2. Marksmen: damage 2-6 (was 2-8)
Original:
Crossbowmen: 4/4, 2-8, 10, s4, i8; shooting, armor-piercing shot
Marksmen: 5/4, 2-8, 10, s4, i8; shooting, penalty-free shooting

In terms of stats, the advantage of marksmen is minimal (+1 attack), however, penalty-free shooting is significantly stronger than armor-piercing shot. The most balanced move is to strengthen crossbowmen (most conveniently via ability) while simultaneously weakening marksmen. Crossbowmen cannot be strengthened in damage because they are already incredibly strong at piercing large melee units, and increasing the armor-piercing radius is primarily aimed at keeping them relevant in the endgame.
3. Rakshasa Rajas: initiative 10 (was 8), +agility
Original:
Rakshasa Rajas: 25/20, 23-30, 140, s6, i8; charge, no retaliation
Rakshasa Kshatriyas: 27/20, 25-35, 135, s7, i8; charge, whirlwind

In terms of stats, kshatriyas deal 20% more damage and have +1 speed, but 3% less health. This can be compensated by increasing the rajas' initiative by 25%. Regarding abilities, whirlwind significantly surpasses no retaliation because it allows for multiplying dealt damage several times (attack on multiple targets), while no retaliation is far more situational; a similar effect can be achieved simply by focusing attacks. It would be logical to compensate via defense, but adding agility increases defense in a more interesting way, giving rajas special rush-resistance, but only until charge is applied (during charge, rakshasas stay put and the agility bonus disappears).
4. Death Dancers: damage 4-6 (was 3-5), 100% dance (was 50%)
Original:
Death Dancers: 5/3, 3-5, 12, s6, i15; battle dance
Wind Dancers: 6/6, 4-6, 12, s7, i15; agility

In terms of stats, wind dancers deal 25% more damage and have 10% more survivability (due to defense), as well as +1 speed, while abilities are roughly equal (50% dance vs agility). The gap in stats is very large; simply strengthening the dance to 100% damage is clearly not enough; compensation requires increasing damage. Speed cannot be increased because it would create too strong a unit for rushing (under the "Speed Aura" perk), and health or defense should also not be increased as this is not a defensive upgrade.
5. Bowmasters: initiative 11 (was 10)
6. Forest Rangers: damage 6-6 (was 8-9)
Original:
Bowmasters: 5/4, 5-8, 14, s5, i10; shooting, double shot, stopping arrows
Forest Rangers: 6/5, 8-9, 14, s5, i11; shooting, penalty-free shooting, enhanced arrow

In terms of stats, rangers deal 35% more damage and have 10% higher initiative. Regarding abilities, penalty-free shooting is inferior to double shot, however, the enhanced arrow surpasses stopping arrows due to ignoring 50% defense, which also works in melee; overall, rangers are slightly stronger in abilities and significantly superior in stats. Initiative and damage must be leveled. Since bowmasters are already excessively strong, they should not be strengthened significantly, limiting it to only +1 initiative.
7. Mountain Guards: damage 2-2 (was 1-2)
Original:
Warriors: 1/5, 1-2, 12, s4, i9; big shield, rage, armor, shield wall
Mountain Guards: 2/6, 1-2, 12, s4, i8; big shield, rage, armor, defensive position, no step back

In terms of stats, the upgrades are roughly equal, but in abilities, warriors are significantly stronger because shield wall can reduce enemy damage several times. The guards' defensive position is hard to apply as it requires specific strategies like Armageddon, and at the same time, they cannot be strengthened too much (the strategy of playing via Armageddon for dwarves is already strong). Therefore, it is necessary to strengthen guards in stats as a combat unit. And if warriors are focused on high survivability, it is logical to raise damage for the guards.
8. Berserkers: health 30 (was 25)
Original:
Berserkers: 7/7, 3-8, 25, s5, i12; berserker rage
Arcat's Warriors: 7/7, 3-7, 30, s5, i11; battle rage, stun, giant slayer

In terms of stats, berserkers have 10% more damage and initiative, but 20% less health. However, berserker rage is significantly inferior to the combination of Arcat's warriors' abilities. Compensation in stats is necessary. Berserkers' damage cannot be raised because it already becomes high when berserker rage activates; for the same reason, attack or defense (which converts to attack) cannot be raised. The only option is to level the upgrades by health.
9. Arcat's Dragons: liquid flame damage 20 (was 10)
Original:
Lava Dragons: 30/40, 40-50, 280, s5, i9; large size, dragon breath, lava shield
Magmatic Dragons: 30/35, 44-55, 275, s5, i9; large size, liquid flame

In terms of stats, lava dragons have 20% more survivability but 10% less damage. Regarding abilities, liquid flame is an enhanced version of dragon breath, however, the trail does not deal such significant damage. At the same time, lava shield is quite strong. Magmatic dragons lose both in abilities and stats. It is logical to strengthen liquid flame, as it was obviously intended to be stronger than lava shield.
10. Fire Demons: health 16 (was 13), explosion 3 times stronger
Original:
Fire Demons: 3/4, 1-4, 13, s5, i8; rage, explosion
Greater Demons: 3/1, 1-4, 13, s4, i9; rage, jump

In terms of stats, fire demons have 10% more survivability and speed is higher by 1, however, initiative is 11% lower. Regarding abilities, explosion only causes laughter, while jump is very serious, allowing both speed and damage to be nearly doubled. To make the explosion relevant, a significant strengthening is necessary; it must deal significantly more damage than a direct attack from place, otherwise it poses no serious danger to the opponent. But this is still not enough to compensate for the powerful jump, as explosion is applicable only in limited cases. It needs compensation via stats, specifically survivability.
11. Demonesses: damage 9-13 (was 6-13)
Original:
Demonesses: 6/6, 6-13, 30, s4, i10; shooting, return fire, chain shot
Temptresses: 6/6, 6-13, 32, s4, i9; shooting, return fire, seduce

In terms of stats, temptresses have almost 10% more health but 10% less initiative, which is a big minus for shooters. Regarding abilities, chain shot is strong, but incomparable to seduction, as it is essentially an enhanced version of subjugation—the strongest spell in the game—and it is not penalized by initiative. The fact that temptresses skip turns themselves is unimportant since their main weapon has already been activated. Compensation for demonesses via damage or lowering initiative for temptresses is necessary.
12. Hell Horses: aura damage 7 (was 10)
Original:
Nightmares: 18/18, 8-16, 66, s8, i16; large size, fear attack, aura of terror
Hell Horses: 18/17, 10-17, 66, s8, i15; large size, fear attack, withering aura

In terms of stats, the upgrades are roughly equal; nightmares' slight superiority in initiative and defense is compensated by lower damage. But abilities are not equal: withering aura is too strong, often dealing damage higher than the horses' direct attack. Moreover, it is area-of-effect, requires no activation, and always works. It definitely needs to be weakened.
13. Higher Vampires: damage 9-13 (was 7-11), Vampire Lords: stun chance reduced by approximately half (factor 1 instead of 3)
Original:
Higher Vampires: 9/9, 7-11, 35, s7, i11; flight, vampirism, no retaliation
Vampire Lords: 9/9, 5-13, 40, s8, i11; flight, vampirism, stun

In terms of stats, lords are 14% stronger in health and speed. Stun is an absolute imbalance compared to mediocre no retaliation; with the current trigger factor, the chance for stun is very high, around 70% with equal units. It is necessary to weaken stun to 30%; it is a very strong ability that should not work too often. Nevertheless, higher vampires still lose in stats, so it is logical to compensate the gap via damage.
14. Stalkers, Night Mistresses: invisibility 2 rounds (instead of 3)
Reducing the duration of invisibility is necessary to weaken the Warlock, who is extremely imbalanced in piercing by using these creatures' invisibility. Since while creatures are invisible they are invulnerable, and the hero can calmly cast their powerful spells.
15. Nimble Riders: 100% drive-by attack (was 25%)
Original:
Dark Riders: 10/9, 7-14, 60, s8, i11; large size, lizard bite, charge strike
Nimble Riders: 12/9, 7-12, 60, s8, i12; large size, lizard bite, drive-by attack

In terms of stats, nimble riders have initiative 9% higher, however their "drive-by attack" ability is hardly relevant at 25% damage, unlike charge strike, which often ignores 100% defense. Strengthening the drive-by attack to 100% damage is necessary, as it was intended that this ability should be almost as strong as charge strike.
16. Shadow Mistresses: damage 20-30 (was 17-27)
Original:
Twilight Witches: 20/20, 17-27, 90, s4, i10; caster, whip strike, shooting
Shadow Mistresses: 20/20, 20-30, 100, s5, i11; caster, whip strike, invisibility

The primary function of both units is casting; they have identical spells, but mistresses have 10% more initiative and 10% more survivability. Thus, in this role, they are definitely stronger. The secondary function is a combat unit—invisible melee fighters with increased speed, initiative, and damage against shooters (with a penalty in close combat). It is necessary to ensure the superiority of twilight witches in this role, and since they are shooters, it is logical to raise their damage.
17. Red Dragons: 200% burn (was 150%)
Original:
Black Dragons: 30/30, 45-70, 240, s9, i10; large size, flight, dragon breath, magic immunity
Red Dragons: 30/30, 45-60, 235, s9, i11; large size, flight, dragon breath, burn

In terms of stats, red dragons are 10% inferior in damage and 2% in health, but superior by 10% in initiative, thus roughly equal. However, the burn ability is quite situational and not strong enough, increasing damage from place only to 150%. In contrast to anti-magic, which is strong in almost all endgames and when piercing casters. Burn must be strengthened for compensation. Actually, one could have made damage and health like Black Dragons; it's highly doubtful they were intended to be lower. However, that would be an extra change and not as fundamental a point as the enhanced ability. Within the framework of minimalism, this is not mandatory.
18. Nomad Centaurs: damage 4-6 (was 3-6), initiative 11 (was 10)
Original:
Nomad Centaurs: 4/2, 3-6, 9, s5, i10; large size, shooting, maneuver
Battle Centaurs: 4/4, 3-5, 10, s6, i10; large size, shooting, penalty-free melee

In terms of stats, nomad centaurs' damage is 10% higher, but survivability is 10% lower. However, battle centaurs have the quite useful ability to have no penalties in close combat. At the same time, the maneuver of nomad centaurs often works against them if they run into the center of the field and expose themselves to enemy attacks. It is logical to compensate for the weakness in melee with stats, increasing damage and initiative for nomad centaurs (initiative as per non-upgrade).
19. Orc Warriors: health 14 (was 12)
Original:
Orc Warriors: 6/4, 4-6, 12, s5, i11; rage, assault
Warmongers: 4/6, 3-5, 20, s4, i9; rage, fierce retribution, bully

In terms of stats, warriors' damage is 30% higher, speed 25% higher, and initiative 22% higher, but warmongers' survivability is 80% greater, which compensates. Warmongers' abilities are slightly stronger; they are a sturdy and reliable unit. Warriors, however, are extremely vulnerable; it is logical to raise their health slightly, compensating for the gap in abilities.
20. Daughters of the Sky: mana 16 (was 12)
Original:
Daughters of the Sky: 7/9, 6-9, 35, s4, i12; caster (12 mana), sacrifice
Daughters of the Earth: 10/7, 7-11, 35, s5, i12; caster (8 mana), sacrifice, spell strike, swift attack

It is pointless to compare daughters' stats because in close combat, due to spell strike alone, daughters of the earth significantly surpass daughters of the sky. In the role of casters, daughters of the sky do not have enough advantages: 3 casts vs 2 is not something that can provide a fundamental win. Yes, they have chain lightning, but it costs 16 mana and requires using sacrifice on the first turn, which is quite costly, and neutrals cannot do this at all for lack of goblins. It is logical to give daughters of the sky the ability to cast chain lightning immediately; this immediately opens up many options for their use.
21. Wolves: Power doubled (guard strength reduced)
The Power stat, according to which guard numbers are generated, is inadequate for the real strength of many creatures. But in the case of wolves, this is felt especially strongly because howl is extremely strong and dangerous but not considered when calculating Power. Howl effectively means that there could be twice as many wolves, and thanks to pack hunting, this numerical superiority is felt from the very first attack.
22. Dragon Cemetery, Dragon Tomb: 10 mercury each (instead of 20 and 15), Dragon Gravestone: 5 mercury (instead of 10).
The weakest level 7 creatures with the most expensive build-up, considering Necropolis's record need for mercury. To make it worthwhile even trying to build them, they must be made more accessible by significantly reducing all mercury prices.
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9 years ago
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This section is for threads containing only links to finished mods. This thread should be moved to the section above. Will the link be available within the next 3 days?
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9 years ago
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Yes, because the proposed changes are very easy to implement.
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9 years ago
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MAGIC
Rakshasa Rajah: initiative 10 (was 8), +agility
Hmm, Rajahs, in my opinion, are already no worse than Kshatriyas. Although I don't remember the stats, maybe I'm wrong, but just because of that, but retaliatory strike ~= mass attack. Giving agility is too much.
Forest Archers: without enhanced arrow
Archers: damage 2-6 (was 2-8)
In my humble opinion, if you make such "minimal" changes, you shouldn't touch the overall faction balance. That is, strengthening a weak tier >> weakening a strong one, the overall balance changes slightly.
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9 years ago
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Regarding the Rakshasa: - For Rajahs: attack 25, damage 23-30, health 135, speed 6, initiative 8. - For Kshatriyas: attack 27, damage 25-35, health 140, speed 7, initiative 8. Based on the stats, we see a significant advantage for Kshatriyas, and the mass attack is noticeably stronger than Retaliation, because Whirlwind multiplies the damage dealt, while Retaliation does not multiply survivability (it only protects against retaliatory and melee attacks, which are already weakened or can be removed). Regarding the Human Archers: it's not a good idea to upgrade them to the level of the Alt Archers, because this indirectly strengthens the Humans anyway (due to the choice). From this point of view, it makes more sense to buff some and nerf others simultaneously. The Arbalesters are generally fine; they are a normal unit that doesn't need to be buffed (perhaps the Armor Piercer is already too strong), which cannot be said about the Alt Archers, who are overpowered. If there is any weakening of the Humans here, it is not significant enough to take into account. Regarding the Elven Archers, it's similar to the Humans, plus the Dancers are also buffed, which also indirectly strengthens the Elves (compensates for the weakening). If my arguments are not convincing enough, please write: as I said above, controversial changes that some players consider unnecessary will not be implemented.
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9 years ago
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Regarding archers: it’s impossible to increase their level to the level of higher-tier units, because this indirectly strengthens humans anyway (due to the choice). From a balance perspective, it would be more logical to buff some and nerf others simultaneously.
Okay, then a slight nerf is needed. In the case of archers, it’s more or less acceptable. With forest creatures, it’s not very good. Then, it’s necessary to reduce their initiative by 1 or something like that, but removing a major ability is not a good idea. The increase in strength from variability is not that significant.
Regarding Rakshasas:
Rajas have 25 attack, 23-30 damage, 135 health, 6 speed, and 8 initiative.
Kshatriyas have 27 attack, 25-35 damage, 140 health, 7 speed, and 8 initiative.
Based on the stats, we see a significant advantage for Kshatriyas, and the area attack is noticeably stronger than retaliation.
Yes, I see it in the stats. Then, increase the initiative for Rajas.
I don’t consider the area attack to be significantly stronger than retaliation; I’ve said this many times. Even neutral creatures can move in such a way that they don’t have their units stand too close to each other for most of the time; this rarely works against a human player.
In reply to Ment
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9 years ago
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Generally, it was difficult for me to find a way to counter a specific skill against enhanced arrows – burning away 50% of the defense makes taking archer masters pointless, especially in the late game, but I don’t want to remove this ability from them at all (for me, it’s like a Dark Knight without magic immunity) – maybe we could make archer masters more durable than snipers or more proactive?
9 years ago
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Increasing the range of the armor-piercing attack is definitely a good idea, but there's no point in nerfing the archers; they're already a fragile unit.
The enhanced arrow ability should definitely not be reduced. There's also no need to nerf the flame strike, or the burning aura – they're not particularly strong abilities anyway. In point 12, it would be more logical to buff the demoness.
Vampire princes are already not very popular due to their large stat spread, unreliable attack, and rarely triggered ability. Reducing the duration of invisibility? And what would that achieve?
And why nerf the werewolf? Is it really such an overpowered and frequently encountered unit?
I have no questions about the remaining changes.
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9 years ago
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"Ment"
Not great with the Sylvan ones. In that case, we'd need to reduce their initiative by 1 or something like that, but taking away a major ability isn't cool. The power gain from variability isn't that significant.
The nerf to Sylvan units is stronger, but variability now appears starting from 2 stacks instead of 1. The point of removing the enhanced arrow specifically is that this ability also works in melee, so Sylvan archers deal far more damage in melee than armored units, and I consider this a violation of game logic.
"serovoy"
But there's no point in cutting the archers; they're already glass cannons.
Their damage is cut in all tournament mods. The logic here is simple: even before the introduction of alt upgrades, I could push through with ordinary crossbowmen and set up very strong guards as early as week 1 (up to level 6); accordingly, there is no reason to buff these wonderful archers. Therefore, if the alt is even more OP, the alt must be cut.

I don't know about the archers and Sylvan archers—if these alts were excluded entirely (hypothetically), would anyone say that crossbowmen or bow masters are outsiders in need of a significant buff?
There's also no need to cut Flame Strike, nor the Burning Aura—they aren't all that powerful abilities anyway.
Not a powerful ability—an unblockable shot without penalty at any target with 120% damage and ignite? Under the Dragon Form rune? With this ability, you can wipe out a full stack of Furies in 1 turn.
Regarding the horses, the aura at 10 deals damage almost stronger than a direct attack. For example, against Emerald Dragons, a direct attack results in about 9 from each horse.
The reduction to 7 is an idea from TE.
Vampire Lords are already not very popular because of the huge "variance," the uncontested attack, and a rarely triggering ability.
Is 70% of cases "rare"? The huge variance actually synergizes with this ability, as it deals maximum damage to stunned units.
Their popularity might be low simply because not everyone has tried them and doesn't know how often the ability triggers.
The grade is completely mediocre and won't stand against superior enemy forces; no uncontested attack makes a difference here, while the alt is capable of holding 2-3 stacks simultaneously if the stun isn't nerfed.
Reduce the duration of invisibility? And what will that achieve?
1.5 times less time for the warlock to cast while breaking through OP trappers.
And why touch the wolves? Are they some kind of impenetrable and frequently encountered unit?
The wolves have inadequate Power that doesn't correspond to their real strength and danger. This Power simply ignores abilities for duplicates and pack attacks. You can easily attack a "light guard" and get wiped if you don't have enough archers or if morale triggers.

For now, the following changes remain undisputed:
HUMANS
1. Crossbowmen: armor-piercing range = 4 tiles (was 3)

ELVES
4. Death Dancers: 100% PA (was 50%)

DWARVES
7. Mountain Guards: damage 2-2 (was 1-2)
8. Berserkers: health 30 (was 25)
10. Dragons of Arkat: liquid flame damage 20 (was 10)

DEMONS
11. Fire Demons: health 16 (was 13), explosion 3 times stronger
12. Demonesses: damage 9-13 (was 6-13) or Tempters: initiative 8 (was 9)

UNDEAD
14. Bone Archers: damage 2-2 (was 1-2)

DARK ELVES
17. Nimble Riders: 100% opportunistic strike (was 25%), +agility
18. Shadow Mistresses: initiative 11 (was 10)
19. Red Dragons: 200% burning (was 150%)

ORCS
20. Nomad Centaurs: damage 4-6 (was 3-6), initiative 11 (was 10)
21. Orc Warriors: health 14 (was 12)
22. Daughters of the Sky: mana 16 (was 12)

BUILDINGS
24. Dragon Cemetery, Dragon Tomb: 10 mercury each (instead of 20 and 15), Dragon Gravestone: 5 mercury (instead of 10).
In reply to Nargott
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9 years ago
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Nargott
The point of having an enhanced arrow skill is that this ability also works in melee combat, so forest archers deal significantly more damage in melee than armored units, and I think this violates the game's logic.
Damn... and it's true, dealing damage in melee with armor penetration is a bit strange; I completely forgot that this skill affects not only ranged attacks but also melee combat. Then maybe like this:

..............................attack....defense....damage....HP.....initiative...abilities

elven archer....4.......3........5-8......15......10......Stopping Arrow
...................................................................................................

master archer...............5.......4........5-8......15......10......Stopping Arrow
...............................................................................Double Shot

forest archer...........6......5.........8-9......15......11......Stopping Arrow
................................................................................max. range
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9 years ago
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Here's some illustrative statistics: 14 Harpooners versus 12 Archers (weekly growth):

1) A volley from 14 Harpooners (initiative 9) against Archers kills 2-3 Archers, or 20% of the stack.
2) Then, a volley from 9-10 Archers (initiative 8) against Harpooners kills 2-8 Harpooners, or 35% of the stack.

So, who is the "glass cannon" here, the Harpooners or the Archers?

Next trio:
1) 7 Forest Archers (1 weekly growth) shoot at Emerald Dragons, dealing 41-46 damage (without Enhanced Shot, 27-30).
2) 7 Master Archers shoot at Emerald Dragons, dealing 16-26 damage (32-52 at medium range).
3) 1 Titan shoots at Emerald Dragons, dealing 26-40 damage (52-80 at close and medium range).
The cost of 7 Elves is 1330; the cost of 1 Titan is 3300 and 2 gems.
Damn... and it's true that melee attacks with armor penetration are a bit strange; I completely forgot that this skill affects not only ranged attacks but also melee combat. So, maybe it should be like this:
Why do Blue Archers need slowing arrows if the reason for taking them is specifically for the slowing effect? Moreover, in terms of damage, 8-9 without a penalty significantly exceeds double 5-8 with a penalty, both at long and close (melee) range.
Furthermore, it's unclear why the basic Archers need to be changed; after all, this isn't a UNITS mod; balance is needed here, not creativity.
In reply to Nargott
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9 years ago
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if done this way,
...
5. Master Archers: initiative 11 (was 10)
6. Forest Archers: without enhanced arrow
...
then it probably isn't worth increasing the initiative of the Master Archers, as we have:
- Master Archers are stronger at half the range, Forest Archers at maximum range;
- Master Archers push back based on ATK, Forest Archers are more initiative-based

and by the way, how exactly does the pushback work? - with one arrow, 20% each, so if it works on both shots, it's a total of 40%, or just 20%?
9 years ago
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Archers weren't considered underpowered, at least not in 3.1, where the Sylvan archers were significantly nerfed. As for crossbowmen, they weren't always a popular choice even before alt-upgrades were introduced.
Regarding the Wolf Riders, I apologize: I never paid much attention to the Power stat.
Overall, your edited changelog looks much more reasonable.
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9 years ago
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The nerf affects the Forest Archers more, but it also introduces more variety with 2 stacks instead of 1. The point of taking the enhanced arrow skill is that it also works in melee combat, so Forest Archers deal significantly more damage in melee than Armored Archers, and I think this breaks the game's logic.
I agree, but removing a skill that is the main "feature" of a creature is even worse, in my opinion. You could reduce their defense, and then the chances of surviving until melee combat become even lower than usual (and they aren't high to begin with).
Or, you should change the concept of the creature and, presumably, the entire line of Elven Archers. You could give the first tier damage (keep the double shot, + something else for damage, maybe even a direct arrow, and remove the stun), and give the second tier control (stun, knockback, increase initiative, remove direct shot and armor penetration). But this is already more than just minor changes.
Archers are not outsiders anyway, at least in 3.1, where Forest Archers were seriously nerfed.
They are.
Moreover, in terms of damage, 8-9 without a penalty is significantly better than double 5-8 with a penalty, both at long and close (melee) range.
That statement is unclear. At long range, 8-9 versus 5-8, at medium range, 8-9 versus 10-16. 8.5 versus 6.5 -- 13. It turns out to be quite balanced, except that in the first case, we have much more stable damage, which gives a tactical advantage. But the second one, combined with "Blessing," will be dominant, and we will lose a little at long range (-1/9 damage), and we will get the damage we need at medium range (almost twice as much damage).
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9 years ago
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in 3.1, where the Sylvan archers were significantly nerfed
How so? They were actually buffed: the chance of their ability triggering was increased.

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