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I suggest adding control abilities to other schools of fire magic: * Add movement point regeneration to water magic = logistics become even more valuable. * Add army stack teleportation from hero to hero to fire magic = weaker heroes can assist in clearing areas more effectively, intelligence becomes more important, and playing with multiple heroes becomes necessary. I suggest weakening the effect of the red spell: instead of completely disabling magic, it significantly reduces spell power (from -13 to -20) + reduces magic skill (from expert to advanced, from advanced to basic, basic removes the skill).
In reply to Mizari
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Mizari
I suggest adding control to other fire schools:
* add movement point regeneration to water = logistics become even more valuable
* add army stack teleportation from hero to hero to fire = weak heroes can help clear areas more actively, intelligence becomes more valuable, playing with multiple heroes becomes necessary
Please provide a detailed description of the mechanics, including numbers and the dependency on the school's upgrade level.
In reply to Wicc
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Wicc
Please provide a detailed description of the mechanics, including numbers and how it depends on the skill level.
I'm not very good at the game, so my numbers might be way off.

For MP regeneration (level 5), I think it would be better to give a fixed number instead of a percentage, so that the regeneration doesn't depend on logistics. The numbers could be:
* +250 without the Water skill
* +500 basic Water
* +750 advanced
* +1000 expert
The mana cost is similar to other control spells - 20 mana without the skill.

For creature teleportation (level 3), also give a fixed amount in hit points:
* 350 without the Fire skill
* 700 basic
* 1050 advanced
* 1400 expert
Make the mana cost lower so that weaker players can use it a couple of times without needing to regenerate - 12 mana.
In reply to Mizari
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Regarding the first point – in this version, Water becomes stronger than Logistics in the late game; a single movement restoration spell alone justifies taking the school, and the other spells are also enhanced. Plus, the blue hat is enhanced with an additional control spell.

Regarding the second point – it's a very unusual mechanic for Heroes... limiting teleportation based on the number of hit points... it would be better to implement some other restrictions.
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it would be better to introduce some other limitations
In the fifth installment of Heroes, there's a fixed number of creatures per mana unit. However, this isn't the best option. Introducing a coefficient that depends on the level would be a good solution.
For example:
10 creatures of level 1 per 1 mana
7 creatures of level 2 per 1 mana
4 creatures of level 3 per 1 mana
2.5 creatures of level 4 per 1 mana
1.5 creatures of level 5 per 1 mana
1 creature of level 6 per 1 mana
0.5 creatures of level 7 per 1 mana
Alternatively, it could depend on the growth rate, but that might be less aesthetically pleasing.
 

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In reply to Wicc
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Wicc

Secondly, it's a very alien mechanic for Heroes... limiting teleportation by the number of hit points... it would be better to introduce some other limitations.

For example, a very high mana cost and the inability to use it at the basic level of the spell.
In reply to Wicc
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Wicc
Regarding the first point – in this version, Water becomes stronger than Logistics in the late game; just one movement restoration spell alone justifies taking the school, and the other spells are also enhanced. Plus, the blue hat is enhanced with an additional control spell.
Yes, this is naturally the case with 1 restoration per hero, like with Damage Dealing.
Wicc

Regarding the second point – it's a very foreign mechanic for Heroes... limiting teleportation based on the number of hit points... it's better to introduce some other limitations.
I disagree with the idea that it's foreign; demonization is done this way. I tried to make the coefficient a multiple of common creatures (ducks, angels), but since new items were added, Ment's idea of limiting it appeals to me much more:
Ment
In Heroes 5, there's a certain number of creatures per mana unit. However, this isn't the best option; instead, introducing a coefficient that depends on the level would be good.
For example:
10 creatures, level 1, for 1 mana
7 creatures, level 2, for 1 mana
4 creatures, level 3, for 1 mana
2.5 creatures, level 4, for 1 mana
1.5 creatures, level 5, for 1 mana
1 creature, level 6, for 1 mana
0.5 creatures, level 7, for 1 mana
Or, depending on the growth rate, but that might be less elegant.
In reply to Mizari
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If creating a spell for exchanging troops, it would be most logical to base it on Town Portal as the closest analogue. For example, on the base level, exchange with the nearest hero; on the advanced level, exchange with any hero; on the expert level, reduce the cost based on movement points. Variations are possible, such as exchange with a hero/exchange with a castle/exchange with both. In principle, limiting the range of effect (similar to Visions) wouldn't be too out of place. The level should be set no higher than 3 (because Town Portal is much more useful) and no lower than 2 (so that players don't start using it excessively from level 111).
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Wicc

The level should not be higher than 3 (because Teleport is much more useful), and not lower than 2 (so that they don't start using it on level 111).

This spell would be much more useful than Teleport; essentially, it's an improved version of Teleport, and it's quite powerful, so a minimum level of 5 is recommended.
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YaR
This spell would be much more useful than Teleport, it's essentially an improved version of Teleport, and it's quite overpowered, so a minimum level of 5 is necessary.
Teleport is probably better because artifacts can be transferred (for example, the Book of Earth), and another hero can use Teleport after clearing something out. Troop Teleport can only be used when building in a guild (which is quite random). Therefore, level 3 is fine.
Wicc
If you're creating a spell for exchanging troops, it makes the most sense to base it on Teleport as the most similar spell.

For example, the base version could exchange with the nearest hero, the advanced version with any hero, and the expert version could reduce the mana cost.

Variations could include exchanging with a hero/castle/both.

In principle, a range limit wouldn't look too out of place (similar to Visions).

The level should be no higher than 3 (because Teleport is much more useful) and no lower than 2 (so that players don't start exploiting it at level 1).
Restrictions are needed, I agree, because 8 mages with a lot of intelligence can clear the entire map in a couple of turns this way (it could be a fun mod, very fast games).
Exchanging with a castle is not as good; Teleport is better in all respects, so it should only be hero-to-hero.
A range limit... I don't know... It's a very strong restriction. It's better to make the mana cost/number of troops more expensive.
The base-advanced version doesn't look very good either; again, a stronger restriction on the number of troops looks more harmonious, in my opinion.

Added after 3 hours 55 minutes
Mizari

A range limit... I don't know... It's a very strong restriction. It's better to make the mana cost/number of troops more expensive.
The base-advanced version doesn't look very good either; again, a stronger restriction on the number of troops looks more harmonious, in my opinion.
You could also add a restriction based on skill points.
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Mizari
The Teleport spell is probably better because you can transfer artifacts (for example, the Book of Earth), and another hero can use the Teleport spell after clearing something. The troop teleportation spell can only be used when building in a guild (which is quite random). Therefore, level 3 is fine.


I see the possibility of transferring artifacts with this spell as well, because if you can teleport living beings, then logically, you can teleport items too.
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The main advantage of TP over the discussed options is that it teleports the hero. Transferring troops as artifacts is cool for breaking through with mages, but it doesn't really enhance the hero's mobility. Unless it's done according to the scheme: "gave troops - got destroyed - bought back." Therefore, the level is definitely not 4th, it's more like 3rd, which is optimal. It also provides low-level control, which is good in itself. I'd also like to note that this spell doesn't necessarily need to be upgraded for the hero; it's quite possible to manage with having it available for mages. I don't know if that's good or bad. If it's bad, then you could allow teleportation in only one direction on the map (for example, "to yourself"), and require an advanced element for teleportation "from yourself."
In reply to Wicc
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They can't even agree on simple things compared to your latest posts (say, changing some useless skills), and you're coming up with these fantastic suggestions. First, it's all too out of character for the game, and second... you can argue about it endlessly. It's not that hard to get up to 1000 mana + water expert in the game... You banned the hat bug, you should be ashamed....
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In reply to Toganash
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Toganash
They can't even agree on basic things compared to your latest posts (say, changing some useless skills), and here you are suggesting some fantastic ideas. First, it's all too far from the spirit of the game, and second... you can argue about it endlessly. It's not the most difficult thing in the game to get up to 1000 mana + water expert... You banned the hat bug, you should be ashamed....
Yes, new control spells in the Fire-Water faction are definitely needed. But these spells must be adequate – both in terms of game logic and game balance. And it's not easy to come up with. That's why different ideas are being discussed.

There are also discussions about useless skills, but it's also not too easy to come up with an adequate function. Linear increase in numbers, as the experience with Warlords showed, does not solve the situation. They strengthened Sorcery, Mysticism, and Resistance, and added classes with secondary skills, but no one still took them because they are not needed.

That is, you need to approach this more cleverly. For example, make mages playable in themselves – either as starting heroes or as popes for transfer, and only then tune the magical skills to balance them with warrior popes.

And without a clear understanding of what "exactly this function" is needed, it is natural that nothing changes. Editing the standard functionality is generally a rather dangerous undertaking; it should only be done with a clear understanding of the result and with an awareness of its necessity.

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