The 3rd stage of the annual John Van Caneghem Tournament (2007). — Tournament history (offline)

IronAxe

4/7/2007 9:10 AM UTC

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Kamikaze;80845

I think the thread is starting to go off-topic :smile01:

Nothing like that. I can’t start the tournament walkthrough because I don’t know if this bug is allowed or not. And whether it’s a bug at all. The rules don’t say anything about it, and the organizers are silent – the weekends are wasted!!
P.S. And if you ask why I don’t clarify this in a private message with the organizers? I’ll answer. If this is a bug and it’s prohibited, then I want all participants in the tournament to know about it.

In reply to IronAxe

vbn

4/7/2007 10:53 AM UTC

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I have the version from Buki installed.
The issue with the ballista going into negative health (I consider this a bug) is also present there.

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Клан Homo homini

Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. Charity never faileth...

In reply to vbn

IronAxe

4/7/2007 11:22 AM UTC

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vbn;80872

I have the Buka version installed.
The situation where ballistas go into negative values (which I consider a bug) is present there as well.

I don't play HoMM 3 much. But can long battles lasting more than 24 rounds occur? If possible, then theoretically, a situation could arise where a ballista in such a battle continues to fire automatically and goes into negative values before the battle ends. And it's not a case of slow units on the opponent's side, but rather that you have many troops. Would this situation also fall under the bug? Or would it be an exception?
PS. In other words, we have found out that everyone can use this bug, whether patched or not. Now we just need to wait for the tournament organizers' verdict on whether this ballista trick is allowed or banned, and if there are exceptions based on the type of battle if the trick is banned. Correct?

Mikki

4/7/2007 12:28 PM UTC

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I would gladly participate in the tournament!

Added 34 minutes later
I checked the ballista, and I have the same issue; after the shot, the value goes into the negative!

Alan

4/7/2007 12:55 PM UTC

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The ballista has an unlimited supply of ammunition, and this is not a bug; it’s just how it’s displayed (as far as I remember, it’s a coding glitch). This happens in all versions of the game and is allowed.

P.S. Mikki, you have been accepted.

P.P.S. The organizers also need to take care of their families, and half of Saturday is usually spent at markets/stores. So, you shouldn’t constantly nag that the organizers are unavailable; just wait a little, and we’ll try to respond promptly.

Тьма - это то, что позволяет смертным не забывать, как ярок бывает свет.

In reply to Alan

IronAxe

4/7/2007 1:10 PM UTC

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Alan;80899

The ballista doesn't run out of ammunition, and this isn't a bug; it's just how it's displayed (as far as I remember, it's a glitch in the engine's encoding). This happens in all versions of the game and is allowed.

The ballista's window says it has 24 shots. With each shot, one bullet is deducted, and the count goes down to zero, then into the negatives. What do you mean when you talk about glitches in the engine's encoding? Are you saying that the fact that the ballista's window says it has 24 shots is a glitch in the engine's encoding? Maybe you're confusing the ballista with a catapult? In other versions of the game besides the 3rd and 5th, I don't think there are any siege weapons. Am I wrong, or are you?

Alan;80899

P.S. The organizers also need to take care of their family lives, and half of Saturday is usually spent at markets/stores. So, you shouldn't nag them too often about them not being around... just wait a little; we're trying to respond quickly.

I have nothing against this and I'm not nagging, I'm just saying this in relation to the accuracy of writing the rules and compiling the list of bugs, so that you, the organizers, have more free time later.

In reply to IronAxe

Alan

4/7/2007 1:18 PM UTC

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IronAxe;80902

The ballista window states that it has 24 shots. With each shot, it loses one projectile, and the count goes down to zero, then into the negatives. What do you mean when you talk about encoding bugs in the engine? Is the fact that the ballista window says it has 24 shots a bug in the engine's encoding? Maybe you're confusing the ballista with a catapult? In other versions of the game, besides versions 3 and 5, I don't think there are any other siege weapons? Am I wrong, or are you?

Тьма - это то, что позволяет смертным не забывать, как ярок бывает свет.

In reply to Alan

IronAxe

4/7/2007 1:29 PM UTC

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Alan;80904

I didn't get anything wrong... I meant the ballista that is simply needed in battle, not during a siege. Like any archer, it has an ammunition line, but at the same time, it fires an unlimited number of times. If this were a bug, they would have caught it somehow over two add-ons and five patches...Well, the bug regarding selling artifacts at an inflated price hasn't been caught across all the patches, so maybe this one hasn't either. Players like vbn and Ataman consider this a bug, and I am inclined to do the same. But for the sake of simplifying checks, it could be allowed, although there is such a pitfall as ArtMoney. You wrote to me in chat about a record of 5 hours of battle. (By the way, please clarify if there was an ammunition cart there???) Now then. Did you personally observe this battle live, or was it simply written to you in a letter? Such a battle can be completed in five minutes. Just change the time on the saves at the beginning and end of the fight. I could write to you in a letter that I fought for 12 hours straight. What should we do, boom? How do we check?

In reply to IronAxe

Alan

4/7/2007 1:44 PM UTC

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IronAxe;80905

Well, they haven't fixed the bug where artifacts are sold at inflated prices across all patches, maybe this one too. Players like vbn and Ataman consider it a bug, and I'm inclined to agree. But to simplify checks, you could allow it, although there's a catch: ArtMoney. You wrote to me in chat about a record of a 5-hour battle. (By the way, clarify if there was a supply cart there???) So, did you personally witness this battle live, or was it just written to you in a message? You can complete such a battle in five minutes. You can change the time in the save files at the beginning and end of the battle. Then write in a message that you fought for 12 hours straight. What do you do then? How do you check?

You can only check it one way: by banning the ballista. Because, as you wrote above, if there's no skill, it shoots on its own, and we can't prevent that... In the case of slow units, personal control isn't very important.

You can track the money bug with detailed descriptions and daily saves. If an extra 5-10k is taken, it will be noticeable.

P.S. I witnessed that battle live; I was playing Varik next to it for the last two hours. There was no supply cart (on version 4.0, I personally checked just now that the shots don't run out; if you place a supply cart, the shots stop decreasing, just like with any archer).

P.S.S. Buy one enhanced fairy and spend a week of real time killing 1000 zombies with it... Is that also a bug? And how do you check it? Don't look for more problems; there are already plenty. Leave the ballista alone.

Тьма - это то, что позволяет смертным не забывать, как ярок бывает свет.

In reply to Alan

IronAxe

4/7/2007 1:52 PM UTC

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Alan;80910

Only test it one way, namely, by prohibiting the use of the ballista. ............
Leave the ballista alone.

From your answer, it is clear that using the ballista with infinite shots is allowed because the last sentence in the post is "Leave the ballista alone." Thank you for the timely and specific answer. Now, onward to the third stage!

Kamikaze

4/7/2007 6:02 PM UTC

Удачи, Iron Axe :smile01:

In reply to Kamikaze

IronAxe

4/7/2007 6:28 PM UTC

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Kamikaze;80997

Good luck, Iron Axe :smile01:

Thank you. I'll have to break records for the longest battles. And I'm curious - is there any program that allows you to save a battle in Heroes of Might and Magic III? Because in long battles, I'll have to leave the computer on for several days :(

Мозай

4/7/2007 7:26 PM UTC

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Regarding ballistas... I've played Heroes many times and don't remember them ever running out of ammunition! Does anyone have a version where they do? No! So, enjoy this little perk and use it to your advantage! Spending hours on a single turn! I wouldn't be able to handle it, even for the sake of victory.

In reply to Qwerty

Александр Г.К.

4/7/2007 8:21 PM UTC

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I have a question: I don't have patch 3.2 installed, and it looks like I won't be able to install it; does that mean I can't participate in the tournament? If I can - please add me to the list...
P.S.: my game version is "to put it mildly" much lower.... :( :( :( :(

Whoever knows the answer to my question, please write back via ICQ, MSN or email! :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile49: :smile49: :smile49:

If I make it into that coveted list, I'll try to carve out some time for playing and the Walkthrough, and if I actually do - HOLD ON TIGHT PEOPLE!!!! "THE MEAT GRINDER" RETURNS!!!! :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: .... By the way, should I throw in a map and save for "Breath..."?!
P.S. #2: you can also reply via PM... :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: :smile13: