Appeals Committee. Disputed situations in tournaments. — Tournament Committee

Егор Коробейников

6/10/2014 12:31 PM UTC

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I have an idea. Let's introduce a yellow timer in the game – a timer that shows how long a player has been thinking and hasn't made a move. For example, I'm playing against Sasha Kuzmin, and during the game, he decides to take a break, but I don't mind. He has a large yellow timer, but I don't report him, and everything is fine. But another player, let's say Vasya Pupkin, doesn't make a move for 5-20 minutes, systematically. And by turn 125 on JDB, I waited a total of 2.5 hours for him to make his move, which I reported with a screenshot. And it turns out that Vasya Pupkin has done this before, and he should be penalized. Because I no longer want to play tournament games with him. You might say that we can agree to play, for example, from 20:00 Moscow time to 00:00. But in reality, after playing for 1.5 hours, he leaves, and the yellow timer doesn't start, but this should also be penalized. And there should be a mandatory time limit for finishing games. I admit that I have also delayed games (I had little time + I didn't want to play when I was very tired)...

icq - 470286448

In reply to Егор Коробейников

Rabe

6/10/2014 12:56 PM UTC

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Yegor Korobeynikov

I have an idea. Introduce a yellow timer in the game – a time during which the player was thinking and didn't make a move.

It would be simpler and would practically preserve the original idea if, in addition to everything else, the game report included a section on "opponent assessment."
You play, write a report, and mutually "express your opinions."

To avoid anything personal and without going into details, just a "3." Otherwise, there will be "post-match analyses," excuses, and clarifications. I think that if a person has this as a system, the assessment will quickly drop to around a "three."

"Одержать сто побед в ста битвах — это не вершина воинского искусства. Повергнуть врага без сражения — вот вершина.
"Сущность войны — обман. Искусный должен изображать неумелость. При готовности атаковать демонстрируй подчинение. Когда ты близок — кажись далёким, но когда ты очень далеко — притворись, будто ты рядом."

Егор Коробейников

6/10/2014 1:05 PM UTC

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A subjective assessment is not a very adequate criterion for banning a player in official tournaments.

icq - 470286448

Niemand

6/10/2014 2:38 PM UTC

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Yegor Korobeynikov

didn't make a move for 5-20 minutes

But is the idea that Vasya is busy with other things during his turn not being considered?

In reply to Niemand

Егор Коробейников

6/10/2014 9:10 PM UTC

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Dagr

Has anyone considered the possibility that Vasya is busy with other things during his opponent's turn?

Personally, I haven't encountered this problem.

Added 5 minutes later
I simply suggested a solution after receiving complaints.

icq - 470286448

In reply to Егор Коробейников

Kilgor

6/11/2014 3:02 AM UTC

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Yegor Korobeynikov

Here's another player, let's say Vasya Pupkin, who consistently took 5-20 minutes per turn.

Remove the checkbox that starts the timer after a turn is taken.

ICQ 245338291
Ник в лоби - Kilgory

In reply to Егор Коробейников

Pit for LM

6/11/2014 5:25 AM UTC

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Rabe

It would be simpler and would require minimal alteration of the original idea to add a section on "opponent assessment" to the game report, in addition to everything else.
We play, write a report, and mutually "express our opinions."

Yeah, I noticed that the forum has been incredibly boring for the past month, with only Lizard keeping things lively. Romantic broke his computer out of boredom, and I even managed to tidy up a couple of threads.

Egor Korobeynikov

Complaints were received, and I suggested a solution.

Did you receive them? Pass it on to someone in the AC, and we'll sort it out.

H2SO4, as a way to satisfy your wish: you can easily get a yellow card; just don't confirm your report in the seasonal league for a couple more weeks and ignore requests from the organizers:
01.06.2014 Graf_Bananov (Blue, Necropolis, Galtran, Galtran) def H2SO4 (Red, Stronghold, Kreg Heg, Kreg Heg) Jebus Cross 133

Подарок от Gomunguls на ДР :)

Осень-Зима 2013-14.

In reply to Pit for LM

Егор Коробейников

6/11/2014 9:52 AM UTC

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Pit for LM

Did you receive it? Pass it on to someone in the AK, and we'll sort it out.
[/B]

- disrespectful attitude towards the opponent, including: deliberate actions that distract the player during their turn, regular delays for the agreed-upon game time, and playing out unfinished games, unjustified interruptions of the game without warning,
^Did you receive it?

icq - 470286448

In reply to Егор Коробейников

Pit for LM

6/11/2014 10:24 AM UTC

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Yegor Korobeynikov

- disrespectful attitude towards the opponent, including: deliberate actions that distract the player during their turn, regular delays in starting the game at the agreed time, and continuing games, unjustified interruptions of the game without warning,
^Did you receive it?

Yegor, the accusation is clear.
Now I would like to clarify personally: in the complaint, there are at least 2 parties: the offended party (I don't understand who is offended: you or someone else?) and the offender. User Vasya Pupkin is not on the forum, and I haven't noticed a similar player among us. Please tell me about your problems in ICQ.
If the situation is hypothetical, let's wait until something unpleasant actually happens, and then we will solve the problems as they arise.

Подарок от Gomunguls на ДР :)

Осень-Зима 2013-14.

Lider1

6/20/2014 7:11 PM UTC

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"ICQ, Skype" are purely personal means of communication that are not directly related to the forum, standing as a separate article in communication.
Linking them to "forum ethics" is simply stupid.

A person must follow the rules of the forum on which they are registered. Since the database system and PM system are physically tied to the forum, it is logical to also censor them. (If one really wants to).

But ICQ and Skype are not physically connected to HeroesWorld in any way. ICQ and Skype numbers can be on hundreds of other forums. Imposing any bans, moderation, or censorship would violate "human rights and freedoms."
If someone gets heated "in a conversation," they can always ignore and delete the person from their contact list. Bringing your smoke here is utter nonsense.

It's the same as if player1 saw player2 somewhere in real life and gave them a smack on the backside. And the second one complained to mommy, i.e., the Administration Council. And the Administration Council started punishing them with points, a card, and some other gibberish. Well, that's nonsense.

The same goes for chats; if someone is arguing somewhere on Twitch, or for example on SC2TV, then how is HeroesWorld involved? Who even tasked HeroesWorld with the mission of maintaining global order and controlling players outside the forum? Who gave you that right? This is nonsense.

There are laws. Of the Russian Federation, Ukraine, international law, etc. There are also relevant authorities that will accept claims for insulting "honor and dignity." They should be the ones dealing with this, not HeroesWorld, the Administration Council, the Disciplinary Council, or anything else.

Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/
За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того

Roger DAltavilla

6/20/2014 7:24 PM UTC

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If someone argues somewhere, I don't care about it. But if players start arguing or one insults the other during a tournament, I am always ready to disqualify them for unsportsmanlike conduct.
Disqualification for violating moral and ethical norms exists in any sport.
Be mutually polite!

Воздам сторицей!

In reply to Lider1

JustObserver

6/20/2014 7:56 PM UTC

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Lider1

There are laws. Those of the Russian Federation, Ukraine, international law, etc. There are also corresponding bodies that will accept claims for insulting "honor and dignity." They should be the ones handling this, not HeroesWorld, AK, DK, or anything else.

Formally, whoever has the authority in a given place establishes the rules there, and HeroesWorld may also make decisions based on sources unrelated to HeroesWorld. The people making decisions on behalf of HeroesWorld in this section are the AK. If someone does not consider this body legitimate, they may conduct a poll, but it seems to me such people will remain in the overwhelming minority.

In reply to JustObserver

Lider1

6/20/2014 8:11 PM UTC

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JustObserver

Formally, whoever has the authority in a given area gets to set the rules there.

Only ICQ, Skype, chats from other resources, and real life fall outside the Arbitration Committee's (AC) jurisdiction.

JustObserver

The people making decisions on behalf of HeroesWorld (HW) in this section are the Arbitration Committee. If someone does not consider this body legitimate, they can conduct a poll, but it seems to me such people will remain in the overwhelming minority.

And as for HeroesWorld, that's beyond dispute—I never questioned that in any way.

JustObserver

HeroesWorld can also make decisions based on sources unrelated to HeroesWorld itself.

No. That's poking one's nose where it doesn't belong.

Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/
За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того

In reply to Lider1

JustObserver

6/20/2014 9:25 PM UTC

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Lider1

only ICQ, Skype, chats from other resources, and real-life interactions are outside the scope of the AK. This is interfering in matters that are not their concern.

These words would be justified if the AK were reading players' correspondence on its own initiative, rather than having it provided to them.

In reply to JustObserver

Lider1

6/20/2014 10:14 PM UTC

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JustObserver

These words would be justified if the AC itself read players' correspondence, rather than having it provided to them.

I want to say that the rules of the HeroesWorld cage apply within the HeroesWorld cage, but not beyond its borders.

Just because you made something up and then collectively approved it doesn't mean that's how it actually is, or should be. HeroesWorld has no right to dictate what a user writes in ICQ or Skype, because what to write there is everyone's personal business, and especially, it's not for HeroesWorld to judge what was written there. I'll leave that matter to the FSB as a last resort, but not to HeroesWorld. Anyone who doesn't like the "tone of communication in ICQ" — everyone has an ignore button.

As it is, it turns into "just provide the copies," and "the AC will sort everything out."
So maybe the AC should go pass a ruling on a cow hit by a car in a village, where the defendant was found innocent in court. Papers can be arranged. Or that the roads aren't being repaired, money is being stolen. Why not? Good deeds. This isn't far off, just a few years of evolution at this pace. For now, these examples sound absurd.

The AC was created to resolve controversial situations: maphacking, cheating, clones, in-game moments. Let it stick to that and not meddle in someone else's garden. Or is there nothing interesting left to do there? Some moral guardians you are, organizing a football match. If I, for example, express some negativity, then in ICQ I express it to someone primarily as a person, a citizen, an individual, but not as a HeroesWorld user.

Сейчас балуюсь этим https://vcmi.eu/download/
За то что нейтралы не бегают за единичкой, для меня это уже стоит того