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Posts from What would you change in Heroes of Might and Magic IV?

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In reply to CTPAHHuK
15 years ago
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CTPAHHuK
But how can you not attack simultaneously? Here, there are ten Phoenixes, waiting for the gnomes to attack them, and only then do they respond? :) It's absurd, isn't it? We stand there on the battlefield, watching as a crowd runs up to us, attacks, and only then do we decide to respond – we play the most fair game, until we are provoked, we won't attack. :)
No, but are they hitting in the face simultaneously? :) Well, I understand, tigers, nomads, and all that, dragon golems with a first-strike bonus. This is well done, it's really cool. But for the rest, simultaneously...
Just imagine, a similarly organized wall is running towards you. How will you stop it? It will first destroy or at least push back something in the front. And in general, if we're going to indulge in such a vivid imagination, they could have bypassed it from the rear or the side during the battle, while the phoenix was flying to attack others on the hero's command. Or they could simply throw an axe at their heads from 5 meters away while running, so they wouldn't resist :D
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15 years ago
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The third game is more well-thought-out as a game; it's easier to predict its further development. The fourth game has its own quirks, for example, the number of enemies increases 4.5 times depending on the difficulty level, compared to 2 times in the third game, which sometimes slows down the start significantly. But this is more of an imbalance than a flaw. Imagine a real situation – cavalry attacks infantry, and they form a tight formation and raise spears – some of the cavalry will cut down the infantry, and some will be impaled on the spears – that's simultaneous attack! You need to change tactics – in the third game, an archer had no protection from other archers, but here, if you cover them with infantry, the infantry will take simultaneous fire from both archers and mages.
I successfully completed the Dangerous Thicket using a Tactician and a Priest. Take a look at the small maps here: http://www.heroesleague.ru/homm4/maps/small/, here: http://www.klubcentres.ru/heroes4/maps.html, and here: http://heroes.ag.ru/maps/.
In reply to нонстоп
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15 years ago
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nonstop
No, but are they hitting at the same time? :)
I assume we're not talking about the moment of impact. Any war won't wait for the opponent to take out half of their unit with one hit or even kill us. The first strike, as a property, looks better. It's a strong tool in battle in itself.
Heroes of might and magic 4 on-line World Championships
In reply to dnaop-wr
15 years ago
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dnaop-wr
The third game is more well-thought-out as a game; it's easier to predict its further development. The fourth game has its own quirks, for example, the number of enemies increases 4.5 times depending on the difficulty level, compared to 2 times in the third game, which sometimes slows down the start very much. But this is more of an imbalance than a flaw. Imagine a real situation - cavalry attacks infantry, and they form a tight formation and raise spears - some of the cavalry will cut down the infantry, and some will be impaled on the spears - that's simultaneous attack!
I agree, but this only applies to cavalry and spearmen... Thanks for the links, I'll take a look.

Added after 13 minutes
CTPAHHuK
I think we're not talking about the moment of the attack. In any war, they won't wait for the opponent to deal half damage to a unit or even kill it with one blow. The first strike, as a property, looks better. In itself, it is a powerful tool in combat.
The first strike as a property would look just as good, even without simultaneous attacks.

And still, I can't agree with you.
I suggest we end the argument.
I would fix it, but you wouldn't.
Since I don't know how to do it, and there probably isn't a mod for it, I hope that some like-minded person will still do it. Heroes 4 is a very interesting game, but unfortunately, I just don't understand this combat system. And I'm not the only one.
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15 years ago
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cavalry and pikemen... another example is a duel where two archers simultaneously draw their pistols and shoot each other to the death. If one is faster, it means "first strike." You don't need to understand this; just accept it as a fact, and after some time, you'll understand how to avoid this (simultaneous strike).
In reply to dnaop-wr
15 years ago
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dnaop-wr
cavalry and pikemen... another example - in a duel, 2 archers simultaneously draw their pistols and shoot each other to death. And if one is faster, it means "first strike." You don't need to understand this, just accept it as a fact - then after some time you will understand how to avoid this (simultaneous strike).
By the way, if a pikeman raises his spear, he essentially goes into defense. What is the percentage of duelists hitting each other simultaneously?
Still, the simultaneous strike system isn't for me.
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15 years ago
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Yes, simultaneous attacks were introduced to add more tactical depth to battles! And that was a good decision! What do real-life situations – duels, etc. – have to do with it? This is a game, and there are many unrealistic elements in it.
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15 years ago
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...And they did the right thing! ...But try to explain it to a person in a way that they understand and accept it. I think that after receiving a real, tangible blow to the hand, a person will understand its essence much faster than by defeating thousands of unreal monsters.
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15 years ago
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What’s there to misunderstand? Two stacks converge in an attack (or rather, one attacks the other). All regular creatures behave like creatures – they clash swords and strike each other. But there are unusual creatures that prefer to strike first; they are very swift, and their attack cannot be blocked, so regular creatures can only retaliate. And if two stacks of swift creatures meet, they attack each other simultaneously. It’s simple. The classic “strike-retaliate” system, on the other hand, seems more unnatural. This was definitely an improvement.
In reply to dnaop-wr
14 years ago
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dnaop-wr
... And they did the right thing! ... .
So right that it wasn't included in subsequent parts.

Added 1 minute ago
vpatachek
What's there to understand? Two stacks converge in an attack (or rather, one attacks the other). All regular creatures, as creatures, clash swords and strike each other.
Yes, they strike with a flag, "one, two, three." They probably rehearsed with each other at home.

Added 12 minutes ago
vpatachek
Yes, they introduced simultaneous attacks to add more tactics to the battle!
What tactics, if they die like flies from it?
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14 years ago
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It's so right that it's absent in the subsequent parts.
This is by no means an indicator. Parts 5 and 6 are aimed at the masses and are mostly infantile and silly. Are 4 resources really an expansion of tactics? O_o
Simultaneous attack makes the game more complex on one hand, and on the other hand, it reduces, say, the importance of speed.
Yes, with a flag wave "one, two, three," they probably rehearsed at home with each other.
It's strange, but with the dwarf and phoenixes, the imagination kicked in, but not in the opposite direction. Simultaneously means that both attack, not necessarily perfectly synchronously, but that's it. This is generally the case in any battle (for example, with infantry and cavalry). But it's definitely not about realism, but rather about new tactical variations.
What kind of tactics are we talking about if they die like flies from this?
This only characterizes your ability to manage troops. Although, in essence, in part 3, for example, tactics such as "taking" the hit with a left or "sacrificial" unit, or even with single units, are also used. So, you don't necessarily need to come up with anything radically new. It's just that before, it was probably necessary to "take the hit" less often.


Барон
"Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!



In reply to Zybr
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14 years ago
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Zybr
... This highlights your exceptional ability to command troops. ...
:smile54:
If you want, you can figure everything out and learn everything, as long as you don't consider yourself the pinnacle of perfection (and everyone else, of course, to be idiots).
In reply to dnaop-wr
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14 years ago
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dnaop-wr
:smile54:
If you really want to, you can figure everything out and learn anything, as long as you don't consider yourself the pinnacle of perfection (and everyone else, of course, to be idiots).
It reminds me of a quote by a famous person in some way. IMHO.
,,Моё имя будет записано в историю, ибо я великий Амадон,, - Амадон.
In reply to Zybr
14 years ago
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Zybr
This is by no means an indicator. The 5th and 6th installments are aimed at the masses, and for the most part, they are immature and foolish. Is 4 resources really an expansion of tactics? O_o
.
Actually, 4 resources don't affect the battle. I would attribute this to strategy.
In some games, there is only one resource. And this does not prevent them from having truly HUGE tactical and strategic diversity.
But still, this shouldn't apply to Heroes, of course. You are right, it's not a good idea to reduce their number in this game. But in the 4th installment, isn't the market very cheap, which allows you to ignore some shortages?
Zybr
This characterizes only your ability to manage troops. Although, in essence, in the 3rd installment, for example, tactics such as "removing" the response with a left or "sacrificial" unit, or even with single units, are also used. So, you don't need to come up with anything radically new. You just didn't need to remove the response as often before.
That's the point. You can't get enough single units.
Zybr
But in any case, it's not about realism, but about new variations of tactics.
Great variations – spending 20 minutes in battle. Deliberately slowing things down, throwing arrows and magic. Although you could have finished it in 2 minutes with infantry, and without losing anything.
And in general, the meaning of the first strike (not an ability) is completely lost.
+ to that, it forces you to carry a mage with you.

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