The eternal question: which heroes are better, mages or warriors? — Polls

Мишель

15 years ago

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Both are good. That’s why, when I play, I develop the hero as both a warrior and a mage. :smile02:

dnaop-wr

15 years ago

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Since I usually play on smaller maps, I prefer Warriors. A spellbook wouldn't hurt them, though. On larger maps, magic is, of course, good, but not on smaller ones. A Warrior's skills are always with him; a not-so-developed Sorcerer is enough to help him. But a Mage without strong spells is weak. For this, he needs a lot of resources to build Guilds, then visit them all (instead of fighting), and then there still might not be the necessary spells... By the time you can develop a more or less strong Mage, you're already finishing the game with a Warrior.

In reply to Ganymed

xSEKTORx

15 years ago

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Ganymed

Here, as everywhere else, better balance is preferable, but... a good mage is stronger than a warrior, even if the warrior is stronger in terms of power and army. I've been convinced of this many times. When you can't take a single step, and before your first powerful warrior can do anything, he's either dead or far from powerful, demoralized, and with a sad red square instead of a green one.

What do you think of this situation: you're playing as mages - "Tower," and I'm playing as warriors - "Humans." We meet, and I have 20-20-10-10, while you have 10-10-20-20. I use tactics to move all my units, cast Haste, and all my 7 units move faster than your fastest unit. With such defense, you'll have almost no one left. And then what? Well, you'll explode someone, blind them, or curse them. But how will you attack further? With each attack, you'll receive much more damage in return. IMO, only warriors or battle mages are effective, depending on the situation.

Zell Dingls

15 years ago

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Well, if you're playing as mages, you need to have a decent army!

Играю только в Heroes 3!!!

In reply to Zell Dingls

dnaop-wr

15 years ago

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Zell Dingls

Well, if you play as a mage, you need to have a decent army!

Well, if you play as a mage, you can get by with just summons. Or with a Berserker. Or with Armageddon. And so on, while having an army that is significantly smaller than the enemy's.

Marmot

15 years ago

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Yes, you can fight as a mage with almost no army, but the question is: at what stage of the game? Who starts with a mage who has high magical power and knowledge and knows powerful spells of levels 4-5? Give me at least one example! Yes, there's Solmyr with Chain Lightning. But for a mage to become a "really tough guy," he needs to spend at least a couple of weeks running around with a pitiful army, fighting local groups of neutral creatures. But will your opponent patiently wait for your mage to gain some experience? I doubt it! This might be possible on some custom single-player map if the author's intention is to focus on combat magic. In other cases, mages can "rule" closer to the end of the game, and even then, only if they manage to learn something "really powerful"!
I prefer to do this: I choose a warrior as the main hero, but I always try to get Wisdom, Earth Magic, and Water Magic, and depending on the situation, also Fire and Air Magic. Again, don't expect to deal a lot of damage with offensive spells: a strong melee unit will almost always deal more damage. It's better to increase Knowledge than Magical Power: you can never have too much mana!

Воскресайте, камінні душі, Розчиняйте серця і чоло, Щоб не сказали Про вас грядущі: їх на землі не було…
(Василь Симоненко. Люди – прекрасні)

dnaop-wr

15 years ago

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Until the mage is somewhat leveled up, he's basically useless.
By the way, when the question was initially raised, were the boundaries between these three categories of heroes defined? Or does everyone decide for themselves?
If a hero has no combat skills, he's a mage; if he has no magical skills, not even a spellbook, he's a warrior. It seems straightforward.
But if he buys a spellbook, does he remain a warrior or transition into a battle mage? What if he learns one of the schools of magic? Or several schools (in any of these three scenarios, magic is not higher than level 2)? What if he gains wisdom? Or if a mage acquires a combat skill that isn't very strong but still exists (and doesn't affect direct damage)?

RiMpel2

15 years ago

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Actually, the heroes were initially divided into categories (druids/rangers, heretics/demons, etc.). Why overcomplicate things?

dnaop-wr

15 years ago

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I think the question isn't about the initial heroes, but about the ones that have been leveled up, where 7-6 other skills are added to the 1-2 initial skills. By the way, initially, warriors differ from mages (except for necromancers) in the absence/presence of wisdom and a spellbook – other skills may be different. By the way, how should we classify warriors who have initial wisdom + literacy or advanced literacy (purely magical skills)? As a warrior, he won't strengthen the army, and as a mage without a spellbook, he won't cast any spells. However, this is not a question, but rather information for consideration.

RiMpel2

15 years ago

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Warriors differ from mages in the probability of specific skills appearing, both primary and secondary. I have never seen a warrior with initial wisdom + literacy.

And in general, this is the first time I've heard that a hero's class is renamed to mage/warrior/cutie because of 1-2 skills.

In reply to RiMpel2

Juristis

15 years ago

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RiMpel2

Warriors differ from mages in the probability of specific skills appearing, both primary and secondary. I have never seen warriors with initial Wisdom + Literacy.

Russia is demonic)

Grond

15 years ago

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I understand that the best combination of "price and quality" is achieved with a good warrior, one expert, and resistance to a suitable element. I don't think such a hero can be called a battle mage; in battle, he will only use 1-2 levels of spells. Such a warrior will almost certainly overwhelm his mage opponent, all other things being equal.
Of course, there can be exceptions, such as a berserker, for example, on the mage's side. But the warrior can also get lucky with a sphere of prohibition, for example, or a cloak of defiance... Or even just with some artifact that provides antimagic or resistance.
Therefore, my unequivocal, subjective verdict is that the warrior will win in most battles! :)

In reply to Grond

corksink

14 years ago

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Grond

As I understand it, the best combination of "price and quality" is achieved with a good Warrior, one expert in a suitable element, and with resistance. I don't think such a hero can be called a Battle Mage; in battle, he will only use spells of level 1 or 2. Such a Warrior will almost certainly overwhelm his Mage opponent, all other things being equal.
Of course, there can be exceptions, such as a Berserker, on the Mage's side. But the Warrior can also get lucky with a Sphere of Suppression, or a Cloak of Negation... or even just some artifact that provides antimagic or resistance.
Therefore, my unequivocal, subjective verdict is that the Warrior will win in most battles! :)

If a Warrior can use magic and does so in battle, then he is a Battle Mage!
Sometimes, without magic, even the strongest Warrior cannot pass a test...

I created a small map for testing, but here's the problem: with "correct" defense, the Mage always dies, and only the Battle Mage wins the game. And with incorrect defense, only the Mage wins the game...

Without the Sphere of Suppression, the Warrior sometimes simply cannot survive...

However, in fast-paced gameplay, when Heroes need to develop, the Warrior can become the only Favorite and Winner!

Conclusion: Heroes of Might and Magic III is very well-balanced!

Map for testing:
http://corksink.narod.ru/all/02game/rargame/Test_HW_CORKSINK.rar

nwcfollowthewhiterabbit

In reply to corksink

dnaop-wr

14 years ago

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corksink

If a Warrior can use magic and does so in battle, then he is a Battle Mage!
Sometimes, without magic, even the strongest Warrior cannot overcome a challenge...

The first statement seems logical, but... considering that 35% of players voted for Warriors, it doesn't quite align with the second statement. I think that out of these 35%, not all of them fight as Warriors without a spellbook, and don't consider it a class change. In this regard, the 26% of supporters of pure magic seem more convincing. After all, there is no guarantee that the spell of imprisonment will be available. And no logistics can replace Teleport or Dimension Door.

Техника в руках индейца мертва.
Справочник по НоММ-4 http://handbookhmm.ru/pamyatka-dlya-heroes-iv.html