Manuals for playing as Dungeon — Dungeon

antonag07

15 years ago

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Igor111

Against all factions. I usually play on a large map with 5 companions.

Reached level 23. As a rule, I can't level up higher than that.
But if I could dream...)
Then something like this:
Summon Expert - Master of Spells - Fire Warriors
Would be level 29. But I don't know what map would allow me to develop that far. So far, I haven't managed to go above level 23.

...

You could try, for example, the map "Zandragars Stratagem's Modern" - its possibilities, despite its relatively small size, allow you to reach level 30 and higher without much difficulty (it also has 4 huts and 4 trees to help).

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In reply to Igor111

Саня Изи

15 years ago

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Igor111

I managed to reach level 23. As a rule, it's difficult to level up further than that.
But if we're dreaming...
Then it could be:
Summon Expert - Master of Spells - Fire Warriors
That would be level 29. But I don't know what map would allow for such development. So far, I haven't managed to go above level 23.

What I like about the Sanitizer is that he has better mana than other Warlocks. And yet, they really need Education...

Why does a Warlock necessarily need to level up to high levels? After all, they are strong enough on any map even without that. As a rule, Sufficient Attack and Education are enough to make a strong hero. Besides, leveling up is quite straightforward and suitable for different maps and game types. Well, logistics – to taste, but it's probably worth taking Summon only if you have good spells.

In reply to Саня Изи

Igor111

15 years ago

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Lordesat

As a rule, sufficient skills and education are enough to create a quite strong hero.

I am skeptical about the super-skill. It can only be realistically obtained with a mentor. Since it is not always given, and not always what is needed. And for the Tribes of the East, it's not very good.

Education is a good thing! But you have to sacrifice something... Do you think it should be summoning?
But then the opponent can increase their luck and gain magic resistance, and there are quite a few such artifacts. Chaos will be semi-useless, and that's it.
I think a Warlock simply needs two schools of magic.
And there isn't enough space for education, so I take Healer.

antonag07

15 years ago

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Chaos - Sorcery - Logistics - Education, and for the fifth skill, either Luck (with an eye towards a Super Skill) or Summoning.

Added after 59 seconds
Chaos will never be useless for a Warlock – remember the racial Unstoppable skill!

In reply to antonag07

Igor111

15 years ago

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antonag07

Chaos - Sorcery - Logistics - Education, and for the fifth skill, either Luck (aiming for the Super Skill) or Summoning.

Added after 59 seconds
Chaos will never be useless for a Warlock - remember the racial Unstoppable!

Why wouldn't it be?!
It definitely will be. If magical resistance works, the chaos spell will be deflected. And that's it - a wasted turn, wasted mana, possibly a defeat.
But summoning a phoenix is very helpful. I personally think that the prospect of summoning a phoenix and phantoms is more useful for a Warlock than the Education skill.

In reply to Igor111

KillAndAction

15 years ago

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There is a 15 percent chance that the spoken spell will be reflected... in my opinion, this is not a very high probability.
As for Summoning, take it only if the desired spells are available; if not, I would take an attack with magic speed.

Ereb

15 years ago

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A Warlock is quite effective in the mid-game with summons! That's where the relevance of Chaos gradually shifts! With our magic + the Ring of Elements, the Academy can take a break! Here's why I think so: 1. Chaos isn't that hard to counter in principle. You just need artifacts against the elements, which are easily found on almost every map. 2. If we go for summons, we don't sacrifice our awesome magic; instead, we implement it in a more promising way. The problem is that we'll have to avoid leveling up the racial skill! Cooldown + instant Phantom + terror! Hydras + Celestial Shield + teleport! Levels around 21-25 – that's a good mid-game stage!

In reply to Igor111

Mdance

15 years ago

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Igor111

Once magical resistance kicks in, the chaos spell will be deflected. And that's it – a turn is lost, mana is lost, and possibly a unit is defeated.

If it's not a secret, where have you seen a Warlock's attack spell being deflected? :eek:
The special feature of Irresistible is that it always deals damage, bypassing all immunities and resistances. With a Skilled Irresistible, 50% of the damage is guaranteed to any unit with any resistance or immunity (excluding Obsidian Golems), and with the Amulet of Mastery, it's 75%.
For your information, the Warlock's Hornet Swarm spell even affects undead, bypassing their immunity to this spell. ;)

PINOCHET911

15 years ago

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Yes, that's nonsense about the Tech Tree deviation! The Elf needs to take the Summoning skill, sacrificing Education!

In reply to VIRU$

PINOCHET911

15 years ago

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You know, when you use Fury or Megara to deal 40+30 damage to Bear Riders thanks to the Elemental skill, you feel a sense of calm regarding those pointy-eared creatures.

In reply to Rean

dark_elf

15 years ago

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I summoned a phoenix. Health: 1260 Damage: 320 - 480. This is what a phoenix is.

MararV

15 years ago

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How many did your hero have?

Proff.X

13 years ago

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Will the guide be updated to include information about the second upgrade path for units?
I recently decided to start with the second upgrade for Assassins, and I'm generally not disappointed. They're very helpful in the early game, preventing unnecessary losses of Harpies (Furies). But once you have a small stack of upgraded Furies in your army (starting around week 2), keeping melee Assassins around loses its purpose. (Sorry, I found this topic on a forum.)

And is Summoning Magic really worth learning? I've always thought it's better to use Chaos magic for extra damage or max out another useful skill. I'd like to ask those who actively use Summoning: please share how and in what situations you use it. Approximate spell costs would be appreciated.

Oh, and I almost forgot. I mainly play 1v1 with a friend, without AI, on maximum difficulty, and I prefer large maps. And it seems to me that the main priorities in this case are a fast start: capturing adjacent territories (mines/dwellings if available), killing monsters to find chests/resources for a good economy and castle development.

In general, the small number of units and their high purchase cost in the early game often have a significant negative impact, and to make matters worse, there's the issue with starting heroes. I used to always take Sinistar and win thanks to his ranged attack, but his specialization becomes a problem in the late game.

Sorry for the long post; I have too many thoughts and no one to discuss them with

Ment

13 years ago

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The English original of the guide hasn't been updated, so there's no point in updating this one either. Moreover, many of the things written there are quite ambiguous.

But with a small stack of upgraded Furies appearing in your army (starting around week 2), keeping melee Assassins around loses its meaning.

I disagree; ranged Assassins are very ineffective due to the penalty for ranged attacks, resulting in damage being only a quarter of what it should be in most cases. When I tried playing with them at the beginning of the game, it always came down to pressing "Ctrl" and engaging in melee combat; otherwise, the losses are simply terrible. Hunters are better in this regard; they only know one thing, and they do it better than Assassins.

And is Summoning Magic really worth learning? It always seemed to me that it's better to use Chaos to deal damage or max out another useful skill. A request to those who actively use Summoning: please write how and in what situations you use it. Approximate spell costs are welcome.

Chaos is good at the beginning of the game, while Summoning is better towards the end. Dark Elves are excellent summoners due to their high magic stat. Summoning consumes a lot of mana. Elementals cost ~15 mana (I don't remember the exact numbers), and a Phoenix costs 20 and a bit. But firstly, specific skills from the Sorcery branch, which are easily obtained by Warlocks, will significantly reduce this number. Secondly, not every battle requires frequent use of summoning spells; it's possible that summoning a Phoenix and Elementals once will be enough, even if the battle is difficult. In general, I am a supporter of this school of magic.

I used to always take Sinithar and win by using his ranged attack, but his late-game specialization is disappointing.

In reality, you can take Sinithar for a quick start, but then switch to someone more promising (level them up in parallel).

In reply to Ment

Proff.X

13 years ago

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Ment

I disagree; ranged assassins are very poorly designed due to the penalty for shooting, resulting in them dealing only a quarter of the damage they should. When I tried to play with them at the beginning of the game, it still came down to pressing "Ctrl" and engaging in melee combat, otherwise the losses are simply terrible. Hunters are better in this regard; they can only do one thing, and they do it better than assassins.

Well, they are becoming more like support units that apply debuffs, and the main damage comes from Fury units. Still, it seems better to debuff with poison using ranged attacks than to expose an already small army to unnecessary risk.

Ment

Chaos is good at the beginning of the game, summoning is good at the end. Dark Elves are excellent summoners due to their high magic skill. Summoning consumes a lot of mana. Elementals cost ~15 mana (I don't remember the exact numbers), and a phoenix costs 20-something. But firstly, the specific skills from the sorcery skill tree, which are so easily obtained by necromancers, significantly reduce this number. Secondly, not every battle requires frequent use of summoning spells; it is quite possible that summoning a phoenix and elementals once will be enough, even if the battle is difficult. In general, I am a supporter of this school.

As far as I remember, fire elementals are ranged units? How is their initiative? And if a neutral creature has a choice between an elemental and any other native unit of the hero, will it prefer the simple units?