Posts from The eternal question: which heroes are better, mages or warriors?

if you know how to play, it doesn't matter which hero you have, whether it's a mage or a warrior. I think you should be both a mage and a warrior, that is, a battlemage.

Still, I tend to favor Attack over Magic Power. Observations show that people are not as good at choosing the right spell as they are at figuring out how to position troops and who to attack first, second, etc. Military stats always work consistently; you can fail with magic. Although... In short, the question is incorrect because it all depends on the player's experience.

In my opinion, it's easier to level up a Warrior's magic skills, while it's harder to teach a Mage how to fight.

I try to develop any hero in both directions. A warrior definitely needs some magic skills, and a mage, on the contrary. Since we almost always play on XL maps, I often had to deal with the Sphere of Inhibition or the Cloak (which blocks magic up to level 3), and it's rare for a mage to do anything in battle. However, I remember a battle when, with the help of an open door and a large mana reserve, I snatched victory from a well-developed warrior. Situations can vary. In general, a reasonable balance is best.

I prefer the warrior class.
And I use magic as a supplementary tool.
When playing as Crag Hack, I level up his:
Attack
Logistics/Pathfinding (whichever comes first)
Ballistics (because it's really annoying without it)
Leadership
Wisdom
Air Magic/Earth Magic
Water Magic
Intelligence (if spellcasting is really weak)/Pathfinding (or Logistics, if it's already learned)/or even better, Tactics.
Earth Magic is very useful for a warrior, mainly due to the Expert Anti-Magic skill, which can neutralize a mage's ability to cast very powerful targeted spells.
Air Magic is no less useful due to Haste (warriors need to get their stacks into battle as quickly as possible), Counterspell, and Disruption Ray. The effects of these spells are largely or completely independent of magic power (which is quite low for warriors), but they enhance the units themselves.
Water Magic is also important for a warrior. First, it can be used to neutralize (again, independently of magic power) various nasty effects like curses. In addition, it can replace high-level combat magic for the warrior. Since the warrior specializes in the strength of monsters, the Clone spell can affect the enemy just as much as an Explosion cast by a powerful mage. Fortunately, this spell is very cheap at the Expert Water level. And there's no need to talk about the usefulness of Prayer – it's a mega-skill. You can even teleport behemoths to enemy archers...
Armageddons, Explosions, Chain Lightnings – these are all child's play:p
Every warrior would benefit from having a Charm of Resistance (so as not to step on a Berserk trap, otherwise the warrior's main weapon will turn against him), as well as an artifact against Blindness... I don't even want to talk about the Sphere of Inhibition.
P.S. A mage doesn't need to level up warrior skills at all; it will only hinder him, as it will consume skill points that could be used to enhance spells. A well-developed mage only needs warriors as cannon fodder to cast as many powerful spells as possible, and at the end of the battle, he can resurrect most of his fallen units...

I enjoy playing as mages, and among the non-magical secondary skills, logistics are essential, and possibly pathfinding as well. The Dragon Mage in the Armageddon's Blade campaign is a good example, where in one of the scenarios, he has to defeat a legion of nagas with a tiny army; a warrior simply couldn't manage that (although there are also situations where the opposite is true). With the right combination of spells, a mage can be very powerful, but, as has already been noted, achieving this is not easy. :)

My respects to the heroes of "Heroes"!

I read all the messages in this thread with pleasure. I realized that many find it more convenient to play as a Warrior hero, but almost no one wanted to be left without magic spells.

HMM3 is a fairly balanced game; there is room for any style. Let me describe mine.

My experience playing HMM3 has led to one style: in 99.9% of cases, I make any of my heroes a Mage (even Craig Hack). I am amused by the ability to manipulate many spells against very strong enemy heroes and neutral monsters and emerge victorious (sometimes with minimal losses). By developing a Mage's ability to move between cities and(or) through space (several moves in one turn!), I easily gather troops for significant battles. I would like to especially emphasize that I value "utility" magic more than combat magic (Chain Lightning, Armageddon, Meteor Shower, etc.)—for example, Berserk, Blind, Slow, Phantom, Forgetfulness, and so on. To make these spells and map movements effective, expert level in Air, Earth, Fire, and Water magics is required. Against a well-developed enemy hero, using only combat magic in battle might not weaken their army of thousands at all. In other words, one must know how to be cunning, to be a calculating Mage-strategist. Sometimes in battle it is easier to wait and not reveal your magic until the last turn of the round; then, if the opponent removes my spell in the next round, it may prove to be too late a reaction...

The presence of artifacts in the game provides limitless opportunities for both the opponent and you. The "Orb of Vulnerability" is the pinnacle of perfection for a Mage: any unit becomes susceptible to magical influence. Or the "Orb of Inhibition"—conversely, the pinnacle of perfection for a Warrior: it prohibits the use of any magic. However, if the "Recanter's Cloak", "Orb of Inhibition", and anti-magic artifacts or abilities are all or partially held by the opponent, the Mage will not find the struggle easy, but there is almost always a way to solve this task as well.

The variety of heroes in HMM3 with specific specializations allows us all to enjoy their capabilities. Travelers will like the combat Mage Dessa; enduring wizards like Elezar, Andra, and Aiden. I really like Deemer and Solmir with their awesome magic at the start of the game, but maps can be quite complex where these guys simply cannot cope, so there is no panacea. There are our preferences and flexibility in using one hero or another.

I will share an example of a contest between my magically developed hero and that guy who had the "Orb of Inhibition":
[M] "River Barrier" (the map may hold a surprise, mentioned below) "corksink00001.h3m" in the archive.
http://corksink.narod.ru/all/02game/rargame/corksink00001.rar

P.S. The first pancake is a lump! I didn't account for everything in this map: it is not entirely correct, but while playing on "Impossible" level, in one of the test runs, I encountered the most wonderful and difficult situation (among many won games on this map). Firstly: on my piece of land, none of the three cities gave me the spells "Summon Boat" or "Water Walking" (let alone "Fly" or "Dimension Door"). However, when my strength and magic grew great, I captured "Dragon Utopia" and received artifacts such as the "Necklace of Sea Guidance" and the "Sea Captain's Hat", which provided the spell "Summon Boat"... But I had not developed Water magic ability... I could not summon a boat... After eight months in the Tavern, I encountered a special enemy Hero: Water magic - level 2. And I specifically bought him in the "Dungeon" city, where he was granted 1000 experience units and, luckily for me, his Water magic ability rose to the third level; he could now summon a boat (with my "Sea Captain's Hat"). Secondly: after a month, I captured all cities on the "Upper Level", but the constructed magic towers still did not provide the spells "Fly" or "Dimension Door". The island in the middle of the country was inaccessible to me... I had to wait for the opponent to appear. Thirdly: another month later, a most worthy computer opponent appeared on the untouched island... Truly: his name is "Darkstorm". His four main stats are as follows: Attack - 29, Defense - 43, Spell Power - 47, Knowledge - 44. And most importantly: Diplomacy ability - expert!!! Most of his soldiers consisted of joined monsters that guarded valuable objects on the island. He came to my lands with the following troops: "Centaurs" - 7000+ (i.e., with a bonus), "Ancient Behemoths" - 156, "Gold Dragons" - 170+, "Phoenixes" - 350+, "Titans" - 60+, "Devils" - 170+, "Obsidian Gargoyles" - 500+... While I had troops that were clearly losing... Moreover: Darkstorm had the artifact "Orb of Inhibition", meaning any magic is powerless! I did not spend all those months of waiting in vain: thanks to my favorite city, "Dungeon", I bought many things: "Golden Bow", artifacts that allowed me to assemble the super-artifact "Cursed Armor", etc. However, after the appearance of the aforementioned opponent, the thought occurred to me that fighting was useless, and yet, I decided to try to be cunning with this newly arrived insolent fellow... With the help of purchased artifacts "Rider's Gloves" and "Speed Boots", my Hero Deemer easily reached cities captured by the opponent from his neighboring ones... The opponent first left guards in the occupied cities: in one "Titans" - 60+ and "Devils" - 170+, in another (after another trip to the island) "Obsidian Gargoyles" - 500+ and "Chaos Hydras" - 50+... My Deemer easily captured these cities, as there were no heroes there, and Deemer easily manipulated his "awesome" magic. Over several weeks, daily, I managed to occupy the same city, leave a tiny defense in it, and buy a hero who would capture a nearby mine and die (the next day) at the hands of Darkstorm (undoubtedly, Deemer did not participate in the city's defense, otherwise he would have easily lost...). With specifically correct actions defending my city, Darkstorm lost 18-19 Phoenixes or Gold Dragons, or both together, every day... Tired of waiting for the maximum destruction of Darkstorm's flying units, I decided, with Deemer's help, to hold the defense of a constantly recaptured city... The defense lasted 3 hours of real time... What was the trick? You must immediately destroy the opponent's "Catapult"... Naturally, Deemer defeated Darkstorm's weakened forces of flying units, though not so easily... However, after another trip to the island, 1037 "Behemoths" surrendered to Darkstorm. Thus, in Darkstorm's attacking army were: "Centaurs" - 6464 (about 600 died during previous attacks on my city), "Ancient Behemoths" - 156, "Gold Dragons" - 96 (about 80 died during previous attacks on my city), "Phoenixes" - 74 (about 275 died during previous attacks on my city), "Behemoths" - 1037 (surrendered to Darkstorm after another trip to the island). In my army were: "Hag Harpies" - 797, "Black Dragons" - 96, "Wizard" - 343 (successfully bought the hero "Dragon"), "Archangels" - 106, "Snipers" - 980 (successfully bought the hero "Jelu"), "Medusa Queen" 650+... My Snipers died quickly and without a single shot, Wizards fought slightly, Hag Harpies also didn't last long... Most importantly: I easily lost the "Ammo Wagon", and after the death of the opponent's Gold Dragons and Phoenixes, my shooters quickly "tired out"; only the city Towers were firing. One hour of real time went into destroying Centaurs and half of the Behemoth army... The rest of the time was spent on the complete extermination of Darkstorm's troops... In the "Dungeon" city, I was once given a chance to buy the artifact "Shackles of War"; I bought it, and therefore, Darkstorm had no opportunity to flee... My expectations were justified: I captured more than 30 artifacts, among which were "Angel Wings"... And what if this artifact hadn't been there? What if Darkstorm flew across my country using magic? In short, I was lucky! Both to fight a super-opponent and to possess the "Angel Wings"! My victory came after 12 months, 3 weeks, and 2 days (game time). Deemer did it! Stubbornness? Yes! Is the impossible possible? Yes!

(If a human had played as Darkstorm, Deemer would not have won this game)

Here is an example where only a Mage should be the Main hero (a Warrior without magic has nothing to do): http://corksink.narod.ru/all/02game/game00001.htm

Interestingly, in "King's Bounty: Armored Princess" on hard level, I managed to win only with the help of a Warrior... The Mage catastrophically lacked leadership, i.e., troops.

Mages are stronger; the main thing is to level them up correctly:
1) You need to choose a hero who is suited for magic (if possible).
2) Level up the following secondary skills:
- all types of magic
- witchcraft
- intelligence
- wisdom
- defense (which I always remember to increase, because it is essential against warriors!).
And then you can live happily ever after!!!
:smile44: :smile44: :smile44: :smile44: :smile44:

To the question of which heroes are stronger, the most accurate answer would probably be: on which map/scenario, and according to what rules are we playing?
That is, mages with a ban list are one thing, mages with restrictions are quite another. Playing on fixed maps is completely different from random maps, etc.

to Artemiy - while you are leveling up all the schools of magic, you will be defeated.

I voted for "battle mages," but to be more precise, I think warriors with magic are the best. I myself am a big fan of the Tower and I really like their warrior class, the "alchemists," and they can handle anything. Their only major drawback is that almost all of them have the "scholar" skill as their basic ability.

In general, in my opinion, a well-rounded hero is better, one who is proficient in both combat skills and magic. Yes, it's not always possible, but with different "upgrades" on the map and using different artifacts, you can still get such a hero! But I absolutely cannot stand a hero without magic or a mage who can't "hold a sword"!
By the way, who has played (and won) on the map "Heroes of the Sword, but not of Magic," where magic is practically excluded? There, of course, brute force decides everything (Crack Hack "in the hands" of the computer is a terrible thing!). But, as it turns out, even a warrior hero really needs magic in battle!
As for mages, even the coolest ones still need an army!
And battle mages are called that because of their initial characteristics: 2-1-1-1, which is much more useful in the early stages of a hero's development than for other mages, who have an attack and defense of 1 or even 0!

Mages are strong at the beginning of the game, up to around level 12-15, but after that, further increases in strength and knowledge characteristics become almost useless. For example, a hero with 12-12-5-5 characteristics will defeat a hero with 5-5-12-12, all other things being equal. The most useful combat spells are those that slow, bless, hasten, dispel, heal, and curse, as they don't require a large amount of mana. And most often, the battle lasts no more than 4 turns. In particular, in my opinion, the best hero is Sir Mullich - a warrior.

DonKihano, I mostly agree! Until the power of magic reaches high values, there's not much point in using "offensive" spells. Modifier spells are more valuable. But you can never have too much mana, because there might be battle after battle, and the well is far away! But besides that, mana is also needed for movement on the map: city portal, flight, dimension door. If you use these spells, mana runs out very quickly!

Mammot, I'll try to refute your arguments in favor of mages. 1. Is mana really that important for movement? I don't think so, because if a hero already has the "town portal" spell, what prevents that hero from spending the night in that city, restoring all their mana, and there's also the additional skill "intelligence" (mana +100%). And there are also wells and magic springs. And who prevents choosing knowledge instead of magic power? 2. You have to agree, the chance of finding the "dimension door" and "flight" spells is negligible. 3. And most importantly, mages are almost never offered such additional skills as tactics!!!, archery!!!, pathfinding, and logistics when leveling up, and instead, sometimes you even have to develop eagle eye, mysticism, and erudition. How can you fight with such skills?!

Mammot, I'll try to refute your arguments in favor of mages.

Actually, I wasn't arguing "in favor of mages." Personally, I prefer warriors. It's just that this follows from my experience: you can never have too much mana! But what to spend it on is another question.
As for restoring mana in cities, wells, and magic sources: depending on the map, there may be few of these objects, and they may be located far from each other and from the place where the hero is now. If you've been traveling somewhere for 2 weeks, you're unlikely to be inspired by the prospect of restoring mana by jumping into your home city and then spending another 2 weeks returning to the same place. Have you played the "Royal Reward" map by Green Drekon? Try it, and you'll understand.