Discussion about Dungeon (Dark Elves). — Dungeon

vbs

7/24/2006 7:46 PM UTC

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Today, I played a Dungeon map, on the Peninsula, Veteran difficulty. I chose the Necropolis, and my opponent chose Inferno. I went for Hydras, while he went for Lizards. In the sea, I moved to 1.2.3, and the battle took place at 1.3.7. I had 71 Assassins, 25 Furies, and 12 Chaos Hydras. He had 1 Dragon, 35 Assassins, 17 Furies, 7 Minotaurs, 8 Lizards (it seems he lost some in previous battles), and 7 unupgraded Hydras. I won without any problems; he only killed 24 of my Furies. I'm increasingly convinced that going for Hydras is the only viable strategy. It's becoming a rather one-dimensional tactic.

In reply to vbs

Бэк Careless Angel

7/24/2006 8:49 PM UTC

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vbs;21592

Today, I played a Dungeon map on Dungeon difficulty, Veteran level. I was playing as Synithar, and my opponent was playing as Iran. I went for Hydras, while he went for Lizards. In the early game, I focused on expanding to positions 1, 2, and 3, while he expanded to 1, 3, and 7. By the time we met at 1.3.7, I had 71 Assassins, 25 Furies, and 12 Chaos Hydras. He had 1 Dragon, 35 Assassins, 17 Furies, 7 Minotaurs, 8 Lizards, and 7 unupgraded Hydras. I won without any problems. He only managed to kill 24 of my Furies.

You're saying you should go for Hydras? Well, it takes some time to get there... But with Furies and Assassins, plus Lizards... and if you speed up the Minotaurs... that's two attacks per turn, plus the Lizards nearby... and with luck, I don't even need to mention it... Hydras will just lie down and rest. And I don't even want to talk about Matriarchs... they'll chew them up and leave no bones behind....

But you still need to develop to reach the Chaos Dimension....

Горбатого флудераста бан исправит...
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Страдаю аллергией на тупое начальство и идиотов...:cool:

vbs

7/25/2006 6:10 AM UTC

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And who said that hydras fight? They just stand on the battlefield the whole time, while the hero does all the fighting.

In reply to Rean

DungeonDragon

7/25/2006 7:21 AM UTC

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Rean;21570

What about the Furies with their retaliatory attacks and incredibly high initiative? And the Assassins with their poison and attack without penalty in combat? And the Matriarchs with their 16-turn slowdown? And the Riders with their charge attack?

3 out of 7 is too few :)

I didn't have time to write about them; the power went out last night. Dungeon is the best; all its units are cool and strong :) :cool:

In reply to vbs

Supreme

7/25/2006 8:45 AM UTC

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vbs;21445

I have a question here. Which castle and on which map can possibly defeat Dungeon? So far, in games on the Heroes of Might and Magic series, I've lost to Fortress once on the Outlands map against a Human, and that's it... and even then, I made a mistake; it was my 3rd or 4th game against a human.

None! And never! :) If you know how to play, of course :) Regarding the units. I completely agree! All Dungeon units are appropriate! The only thing is that Minotaurs might be a bit weak... if you compare them to the third-tier units.

Supreme
Shadow Master - Clan Leader

Стань лучше и сам пойми, кто ты, прежде чем встретишь нового человека и будешь надеятся, что он тебя поймет. (с)

Элистион - 3-е место в Расовом Вопросе!

Supreme

7/25/2006 10:12 AM UTC

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Snowball;21674

Well, there's a saying about "Never"...

I said it with a bit of humor :) Of course, the result depends primarily on the player, and a number of other minor factors... But still, I haven't been carried through a Dungeon even once yet :)

Supreme
Shadow Master - Clan Leader

Стань лучше и сам пойми, кто ты, прежде чем встретишь нового человека и будешь надеятся, что он тебя поймет. (с)

Элистион - 3-е место в Расовом Вопросе!

vbs

7/25/2006 7:03 PM UTC

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Today, I defeated Dugalu on the Outcasts map, version 1.2.7. He came with 150 archers, but the battle was easy. I had 5 Hydras (one was sacrificed to the Druid) and 20 Furies. I didn't buy any other troops, although I'm not sure they would have helped. The hero was level 8, with 7 spell power and 60 mana, but that didn't save him. Difficulty: Warrior.

Raelag

7/29/2006 7:41 PM UTC

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Dark Elves are definitely the best and take 1st place out of 6! Not only are they the best, but they are also the strongest!
Scouts/Assassins - is this really a 1st-level unit?! They can easily compete with a 2nd-level unit! No penalty in melee combat, and they poison with their attacks - excellent!
Beasts/Furies - upgrading them is a must! They gain the retaliate ability + the ability to return to their original position. Most often, furies/beasts become the target of enemy archers.
Minotaurs - I wouldn't call them useless, but they are too slow for a dungeon. They are used to defend archers.
Dark Riders - they are good because they have a cavalry charge and biting lizards :)! But they are weak in close combat.
Hydras - strong tanks with the ability to retaliate against multiple enemies. However, they are slow.
Shadow Lords - they hit hard and have useful spells. In short, you must take them!
Twilight/Black Dragons - they are definitely the best! Especially with their immunity to magic!
Thus, 4(!) units of the Dark Elves have the retaliate ability. Riders and dragons don't need it, as their attack is decent. And minotaurs are rarely used.
The only drawback of the Dark Elves is their small number, which is compensated for by the sacrificial pit.
In short, THE DUNGEON ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D :D :D

In reply to Raelag

Inquisitor

8/2/2006 5:58 AM UTC

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Well, assassins are very expensive—100 coins!

Furies are useful for biting enemy shooters, no doubt. But heaven forbid they fly into a level 5 or 6 unit!

Minotaurs are very strong thanks to their high HP. They also have a double strike. (But they are just so heavily scarred without the upgrade)

Dark Riders are very useful against enemy fodder. And they're decent against larger creatures too. Only vampires can really compete with them at the same level.

Witches, to be honest, aren't great as shooters. Too few shots. But they can manage using magic. However, if they have an unlimited supply of shots, they can seriously hinder a slow opponent (like Academy).

Black Dragons... The coolest level 7 monsters in the game, immune to magic, and they even breathe across two tiles....

Rean

8/2/2006 6:58 AM UTC

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100 coins, but it fights in melee just as well as a level 2 unit thanks to its poison...

I defeated Pit Lords with Furies and Riders without any losses. Any more questions?

And Minotaurs are the most useless unit... I don't even build them in the early game.

Rean's Ghost :smile24:

In reply to Rean

Inquisitor

8/2/2006 7:40 AM UTC

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I meant to be within melee range to attack (regarding the Fury). As for the rest, the town is strong, and the hero is too.

Werevolka

8/2/2006 8:19 AM UTC

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I think this race is my favorite too. But the Black Dragons... In Heroes IV, they were awesome, so well-designed – you look at them, and you immediately see their power. They breathe heavily, their sides heave. But here, they're just some weaklings. I'm disappointed.

Rean

8/2/2006 9:00 AM UTC

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CD, you guys are awesome here too :) They are better than the Sylvan and Necropolis dragons :)

With skillful play, Furies never get caught in melee attacks... but they die from archers.

Rean's Ghost :smile24:

In reply to Inquisitor

Archer

8/2/2006 10:33 AM UTC

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Sacred inquisition;22950

Dark Riders are very effective against smaller enemy units. They are also quite good against larger creatures. Only vampires can compete with them on this level.

The Riders are especially good against large creatures because they reduce their defense; after their attack, fighting against units of level 5, 6, or 7 becomes simply like beating up babies.