Can Necromancers even be defeated? — Tactics

BlackSerge

17 years ago

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I didn't fully understand how strong this faction is until I tried playing as Necromancers myself!
1. It's a disaster in the beginning; if you start with Galtran, they can already do a lot.
2. In weeks 2-3, you can't rush them because they can rush you too. For example, you might encounter a mine with Trogols around week 3, and they have a skeleton with 600 attack or more.
3. And if you drag it out even a little, it's game over.
How do you even beat them if you don't use black magic?
Even the restrictions imposed by the rules help, but without them, it would be even worse. But even with them, I think Necropolis is unbalanced.

Dirty_Player

17 years ago

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It is very difficult to defeat an opponent whose troops are summoned from the air, all other things being equal. If you don't engage in direct combat, you can try to force him into the Dungeon by repeatedly restarting the game, where he won't receive the bonus from his territory. Dungeons often have obstacles, and there's a chance (albeit small) that he'll be defeated there.

In reply to Dirty_Player

BlackSerge

17 years ago

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well, he also has restarts and blocks, besides ranged attacks; he can easily take down Necropolis. I think there's a small chance in the mid-game, when not every Necromancer has a couple of angels yet, if you manage to find some powerful magic around weeks 2-3, like an explosion.
because it gets worse later, but I think smart Necromancers will eventually figure out how to counter it.
(
maybe limit Necromancy for all heroes to the advanced level? because right now, they're too powerful.

or, as an alternative, ban the Transmute spell, at least; that way, there will be fewer skeletons. I don't think the creators anticipated players converting 1-2 level creatures from all castles into skeletons.

РУХ-ЧУДИЩЕ-ОГР

17 years ago

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Once, my buddy converted all the monsters from every castle into skeletons! Even level 7 ones!!!
But he spared some, of course =)) He kept the vampires for himself.

In reply to РУХ-ЧУДИЩЕ-ОГР

Нэйко

17 years ago

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In general, the strongest Necropolis hero is Sandro, not because he was in the campaign, but because his abilities are excellent. By level 10, his magic will be amazing (if, of course, his Strength is at least leveled up to 5, although it's better to level it up to 10)).
As a counter to the Necromancers, I choose either Dungeon or Fortress.

kcfgogbfalgfl

17 years ago

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Actually, the strongest Necropolis hero is Sandro.

Magic? Not just him.
And in general, the strongest and most overpowered Necropolis heroes are Vidomina and Isra, which is why they were banned from leveling up expert sorcery.

In reply to kcfgogbfalgfl

LeBron

17 years ago

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Sandro might be playable against AI, but in online matches against a human, he clearly doesn't cut it :) Of course, there's Galtran with his hellish skeletons; basically, Isra and Vedomin are decent alternatives to Gosha, but they are quite heavily nerfed in the rules
PS Galtran is the only hero I used to take the Dragon Utopia in SOD online on 121, and almost without losses
as for how to kill him—well, perhaps the only way is to rush on the 1st-2nd week while he hasn't scaled up too much yet—the further you go, the worse it gets because skeletons multiply at terrifying rates—necromancy+converter(and god forbid peasant nicks)

In reply to LeBron

Alex_R

17 years ago

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LeBron

Isra and Vedomina are not bad alternatives to Gosha, but they are quite limited by the rules.
As for how to kill him, the best approach is to rush him in the first or second week, before he gets too strong. The longer you wait, the harder it becomes because the skeletons multiply at an alarming rate – necromancy plus the converter (and God forbid, peasant ambushes).

The converter is forbidden to build on both the Portal and HotA maps, and Isra and Vedomina are weak heroes because they only start producing skeletons at a rate comparable to any other necromancer with expert necromancy after level 10. However, in the first 1-2 weeks, the battle is against numerous but weak units, and you need to immediately produce 30% skeletons, not 21%. Considering the strategy of playing against Necropolis (rush), specializing in Isra or Vedomina simply won't pay off; it's better to use Clavius or Tamika.
One peasant ambush is far from ideal; it's much more useful to have 2-3 secondary dwellings and a few level 1 ambush buildings from the first week, plus heroes in the tavern with either gremlins or troglodytes. Specialists of rank 1 with 3 stacks are also worth their weight in gold (Shakti, Grechin, Ignatius, Dragon).
With half of the described advantages, the production rate is at least 250 skeletons per week.
On HotA, if you can get Galtran at the start, the prospects are always good, but with the Portal rules, the Necropolis is less stable.

In reply to Alex_R

Dirty_Player

17 years ago

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Alex_R

Transmuter is banned from being built both on the Portal and on HeroesWorld

Since when? Don't confuse it with the Amplifier ;)

In reply to Alex_R

LeBron

17 years ago

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Alex_R

It is forbidden to build a Converter both on the Portal and on HotA.

Oh, come on:D since when??

Isra and Vidomina are terrible heroes because they only start recruiting skeletons that are as numerous as any other Necromancer with Expert Necromancy after level 10, but in the first 1-2 weeks, the battle is against numerous but weak units, and you need to immediately recruit 30% skeletons, not 21%. And considering the tactics of playing against Necromancer (rush), Isra's or Vidomina's specialization simply won't have time to pay off; it's better to use Clavius or Tamika.

I agree here – their rules have been significantly reduced.

1 peasant hideout is far from being a stroke of luck; it is much more useful to have 2-3 secondary hideouts and a strong hideout of level 1 from the first week + so that the heroes in the tavern appear either with Goblins or with Trolls, and specialists of rank 1 with 3 stacks are also worth their weight in gold (Shakti, Grechin, Ignatius, Dragon).

Who's arguing? :) But recently, I had 3 peasant hideouts – that's 150 skeletons per week for sure.

With half of the described advantages, the rate is at least 250 skeletons per week. On HotA, if you can take Galthran at the start, the prospects are always good, but according to the Portal rules, the Necromancer is less stable...

Yes, the Necromancer clearly lacks stability on the Portal – things are a little better on World and even better on Bay in this regard

In reply to LeBron

Demon26-I

17 years ago

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To be honest, I never really liked Necromancers. I only like Vampires and Liches in that faction. I usually play as Haven or Dungeon; I like them more. As for whether it's possible to defeat a Necromancer, my friend really likes them, but when he plays against me, he almost always loses.

kcfgogbfalgfl

17 years ago

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Isra and Vidomina are weak heroes because they only start recruiting skeletons at a rate comparable to other necromancers with expert necromancy after level 10. However, during the first 1-2 weeks, the game involves fighting numerous but weak units, and you need to immediately recruit 30% skeletons instead of 21%. Considering the common strategy against necromancers (a rush), specializing in Isra or Vidomina simply won't pay off in time; it's better to choose Clavius or Tamika.

I was talking about them without any nerfs;
Because I don't like your restrictions. :)

To be honest, I've never liked necromancers; I only like vampires and liches. I usually play as humans or the Underworld faction; I like them more. Regarding whether it's possible to defeat a necromancer, my friend really likes them, but when he plays against me, he almost always loses.

Hmm, is the appearance of the monsters not important to you? :D
You can lose to 100 archangels against one peasant if... how should I put it... you play poorly.
P.S. I'm not claiming to be a great player. :D

However, Galtran is indeed powerful.

In reply to kcfgogbfalgfl

Lider1

17 years ago

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Maggot

Because I don't like these restrictions you have. :)

You can love them or not, but without them, Necropolis becomes too overpowered. :)

Featon

17 years ago

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What’s the point of banning the black magic amplifier and buffing vampires? And banning strong heroes? Maybe it would be better to ban this discussion altogether? :-) We can add other cities to the list of bans! :-) For example: treasury, stables, wall of knowledge, Valhalla temple, etc. :-)

In reply to Featon

КостяN

17 years ago

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Featon

What's the point of banning the black magic amplifier and buffing vampires? And banning strong heroes? Maybe it would be better to ban this discussion altogether?:-) You could also add other cities to the list of bans! :-) for example: treasury, stables, wall of knowledge, Valhalla temple, etc. :-)

Dear Sir, what you wrote is just "lol":D ... No offense. For some reason, Necropolis still wins more often than it loses - even with these restrictions. "Treasury" - I doubt it's built often, what's the point if the game usually ends in 2-3-4 weeks? "Stables" - what about horses? Without stables, you won't be able to build horses, and who will take humans then if the template isn't Jebus:smile50: ? "Wall of Knowledge" and "Valhalla Temple" - that was just ridiculous, no comments:rolleyes: ...

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