Connection ErrorBad RequestSession ExpiredSign in requiredForbiddenNot FoundToo Many RequestsServer ErrorBad GatewayService UnavailableGateway TimeoutHTTP Version Not Supported
Session Expired
Your session has expired. Please log in to continue.
Sign in required
You need an account to do that. Sign in or create one — it only takes a minute.
Request Failed
We encountered an issue while processing your request.
Please check your internet connection and try again.
That's not true. Equi is clearly more balanced. And I don't really know any cards "specifically for Equi." I know a set of good, multi-faction cards that are played. And they weren't designed specifically for Equi. For example, Circle of Life.
And I didn't say that the cards were DESIGNED for Equi, only that there is a suitable set for it. Although they seem a bit strange (I'm not too lazy, I browse them a little), the game starts to resemble a pure RPG, when you walk around with a party of characters (+ a sidekick), and each has specific functions, but that's a matter of taste. If people like it, let them play (maybe it's really more interesting?). And the logic behind this imbalance is clear: since the fourth game is so different from the previous ones, we will exaggerate this difference as much as possible.
And the infamous "problem" of GM Necromancer is a well-known story. In general, don't mislead people.
And I'm not misleading anyone. Any imbalance is balanced by cards, and, in extreme cases, by banning castles. There was a problem with GM Necromancer. It was solved. But something seems to be wrong with Death, at least in the standard settings and, in my humble opinion, I might be wrong. But it's scary to play against Life. In my opinion, there was an imbalance in one direction, and now it's in the other, and we need to balance it again with cards.
I don't see any "nuance" in this particular case. If you've ever organized tournaments, you should know that you have to fight for fair play. And the "close circle of fathers" is essentially those who organize tournaments and are responsible for what happens in them.
Can the "fathers" use their "knowledge"? Theoretically, yes. But you see, what makes the "fathers" "good"? For the most part, they are quite well-known people in the Heroes world. And often they are also personally acquainted.
"Good"? Although they are really good for you, but normally - they are very bad. They use their "knowledge" and personal connections to benefit themselves, time and time again, sometimes a little, and sometimes seriously. There is a very big difference between a single organizer and a representative of a Jazz band, in whose crystal honesty you can never be sure.
Note that I have nothing against Equi, but if official tournaments are held on it, I suggest opening a thread in the Third game at the same time about transferring official tournaments to TE.
2Catch
Golden words and a very accurate comparison.
shnurov_hl
Auto-translated
I never said that the maps were DESIGNED for Equilibris; I just said that there is a suitable set for it.
That's where the balance was achieved. They took old World of Warcraft maps – and, bam, nothing needs to be changed – it's a perfect set for Equilibris. You can play with all the Castles with relatively equal chances. (although the map has a huge impact, and I don't think I'll argue about that)
Although they are somewhat strange (I'm not lazy, I browse them a little), the game starts to resemble a pure RPG, when you walk around with a party of heroes (+ a bonus), and each has its own specific functions, but that's a matter of taste. If people like it, let them play (maybe it's really more interesting?). And the logic behind this bias is clear: since the fourth game is so different from the previous ones, we will exaggerate this difference as much as possible.
Are you talking about the fourth game in general, or how strong online players play it? :smile07:
And I'm not introducing it. Any imbalance is balanced by the map and, in extreme cases, by banning Castles. There was a problem with the GM Necromancer. It was solved. But something seems to be wrong with Death, at least on the standard maps and, in my humble opinion, I might be wrong. But against Life, it becomes scary. In my opinion, there was an imbalance in one direction, and now it has become in the other, and we need to balance it again with the map.
How did you solve it? By banning it? It doesn't always work, to put it mildly. In Equilibris, the Necromancer Castle didn't become a weak Castle. I like to play with them. I can even say that I'm quite good at it. A quick "canceler" and a stack of Devils often decide the outcome. :)
"Good"? Although it's really good for you, but in reality, it's very bad. They use their "knowledge" and personal connections to benefit themselves, time and time again, sometimes a little, and sometimes seriously. There is a very big difference between a single organizer and a representative of a Jazz band, in whose crystal honesty you can never be sure.
In what "way" do they benefit themselves? Usually, these people don't have time to play themselves. They are involved in organizing the process for others. And they rarely get a simple "thank you" in return. That's the "benefit".
2Catch Golden words and a very accurate comparison.
The comparison is inaccurate and incorrect. As far as I know from conversations with Horn, new entities (the same classes, for example) have been introduced in the Tales of the Empire, which basically means that Tales of the Empire is a modified third game. Equilibris is a balanced fourth game. The difference is fundamental. The "loms" have been removed, bugs have been fixed, the AI has been slightly improved, and the creatures and spells have been balanced.
Catch, the point is clear. Let's organize races with cheap units. What's wrong with that? It's more accessible and closer to the people. Regarding the 90% – where did you get that statistic? Or maybe it's from social surveys? ;)
What does "serious tournaments" mean?
The seriousness of a tournament is determined not by the venue, but by the organization. It's strange to hear such questions, honestly. Since the premise is incorrect, it's pointless to answer further.
But recently, Death seemed quite weak, at least in standard battles, and in my humble opinion, I might be wrong. But facing Life, it becomes scary. In my opinion, there was an imbalance in one direction, and now it's shifted to the other, and we have to balance it again with a map.
That's what there's nothing to argue about. For reference: in most cases, after a "death" spell, life remains, but death does not. Maybe you just don't know how to cast it properly? ;)
That's where the argument ends. For reference: in most cases, life remains after a black mark, but death does not. Maybe you just don't know how to prepare it?
It's very possible that I don't. But did you notice the phrase "at least on the standard settings," not on the generally accepted ones for avid online chatterboxes? Maybe you just don't know how to read carefully? ;)
Are you talking about the fourth game in general, or how strong online players play it?
Not about the ordinary fourth game, because for the vast majority of ordinary users, 2 heroes is the limit. But you yourself described how wonderful it is to control 4-5 heroes (which is like an RPG party), while 1-2 levels are simply ignored.
oxygen_hl
Auto-translated
It’s very possible that you just don’t know how. You only noticed “at least on the standard ones” in the quote, and not on the generally accepted ones for hardcore online players. Maybe you just can’t read carefully?
Standard maps, standard heels on women’s shoes, standard strings on a musical instrument, standard tires on a car – all these things are united by only one characteristic – poor quality. In addition, I can confidently say that there are far fewer balance issues in Equilibris, even on standard maps. How long can this go on? You yourself admit that you don’t know Equilibris, so how can you evaluate it?
Well, not about the ordinary fourth game, for the vast majority of ordinary users, 2 heroes is the limit. And you yourself described how wonderfully it is to control 4-5 heroes (what’s wrong with an RPG party?), but 1-2 levels are strictly out of the question.
This limit is due to inexperience. Before Equilibris was released, strong players in WoW also used the full set. Because the result turns out to be significantly better. What does Equilibris have to do with it?
Well, it's not about the average fourth game, as for the vast majority of ordinary users, 2 heroes is the limit. But you yourself described how wonderful it is to control 4-5 heroes (which is like an RPG party), while 1-2 levels are simply ignored.
The vast majority of players also control 3 heroes in the third game. So what now? :)
Catch, I understand your point. So, let's organize races with limited resources. What's wrong with that? It's more accessible and closer to the people. Where did you get the 90% figure from? Or maybe it's based on social surveys? ;)
Well, races are also organized with limited resources, and they are popular. Not everyone can get a pilot's seat in Formula 1, right? 90% is based on experience. A typical player will choose the path of least resistance. If it takes them half an hour to install an add-on and two hours to roughly learn it just to play in a tournament, they will prefer to spend a minute going to another tournament page on a different resource where they won't have to do any of that.
The seriousness of a tournament is not determined by the location, but by the organization. It's strange to hear such questions, honestly. Since the premise is incorrect, it's pointless to answer further.
And what? Does that mean that only perfectly organized offline tournaments are held on Equilibris? Are there no places where they are held on Vortices? It's strange to hear that, honestly.
oxygen_hl
Auto-translated
90% is based on experience.
I don't want to compare. That's not true.
Isn't there a single place where they could be used on Whirlwinds? It's strange to hear that, honestly.
There's really no need to compare, it's incomparable. On the League, there are players who only have one thought in their heads – victory. On the Portal, it's different; 90% of them prioritize enjoyment, and only then victory. These 90% will be eliminated.
Make up your mind, what determines seriousness, the organization, as in the previous post, or the "straightforwardness" of the version.
shnurov_hl
Auto-translated
90% is based on experience. A typical player will choose the path of least resistance. If it takes them half an hour to install an add-on, two hours to roughly learn it just to play in a tournament, they will prefer to spend that minute going to another tournament page on a different resource, where they won't have to do any of that.
I have a different experience. Back in the day, when I spent almost all my time on GameSpy, ALL the new players (mostly Russian-speaking) would first suggest playing, and after hearing that people only play on Equilibr, they would ask for a link, download, and install it without any problems.
I have a different experience. Back in the day, when I spent almost all my time on GameSpace, ALL the new players (mostly Russian-speaking) would first offer to play, and after hearing that everyone here only plays on Equilibr, they would ask for a link, download, and install it without any problems.
Are we talking about online or offline games? It seems like the topic is about the transition of offline tournaments to Equilibr. If it's about online games, then what am I even doing here?
I have a different experience. Back in the day, when I spent almost all my time on GameSpace, ALL the new players (mostly Russian-speaking) would first offer to play, and after hearing that everyone here only plays on Equi, they would ask for a link, download, and install it without any problems.
That's a bad example. One thing is a tournament for everyone, and another is a tournament for the select few.
If a player doesn't have another opportunity to play against someone, like on GameSpace, and they are told that games here are only played on Equi, they will naturally download it. Another option is a forum, like ours. As Catch rightly pointed out, in 90% or more of cases, a newcomer will simply give up on such a tournament and find something more familiar. This is true both for offline and online, because when there is a choice, it's easier to choose what is already familiar. Well, if you really want to impose conditions...
Отдай свои прошлые сны, В сомненьях себя обрети, В бешеном танце душа кружится! Не думай, что будет потом, Здесь и сейчас мы живем, Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!
shnurov_hl
Auto-translated
In my example, it wasn't that important – newcomers just came to "play around." They asked for a specific version, and we installed it. No problems. No one said, "I'll only play on Whirlwind." Well, actually, there were a couple of people who did. But it was over a couple of years.
I repeat: if you participate in a TOURNAMENT – any tournament, even a local one or an intergalactic one – spending half an hour installing it and an hour carefully reading the changes (if you're all so talented that you don't need to practice) is not difficult and is perfectly normal. But when it's just "let's play," then yes, laziness and unwillingness come into play. But this is a tournament. A competition. This is perfectly normal, even if you don't plan to win any prizes.
If you're not aiming for top placements, just playing is enough. But if you want to perform well, you'll need about half an hour for installation and then an hour to read... maybe a super-talented player can manage with that, but usually, more time is needed for practical learning and getting used to it; often, it takes more than an hour or two.
Отдай свои прошлые сны, В сомненьях себя обрети, В бешеном танце душа кружится! Не думай, что будет потом, Здесь и сейчас мы живем, Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!
shnurov_hl
Auto-translated
Well, if you insist on imposing conditions...
I don't want to impose anything on anyone.
If someone wants to learn how to play, they should do it on the standard version. This is normal, understandable, and obvious to me.
Studying the intricacies of heroes on the "Whirlwind" difficulty is a sad pursuit, as someone here mentioned. Because these intricacies lie in the clunky tactics that have been removed in "Equilibrium." And you should switch to "Equilibrium" as soon as possible to avoid breaking bad habits later. This is also clear to me.
If a beginner is too lazy to download and install a normal version of the game, then the idea that they will improve their skills after playing in a tournament on "Whirlwind" raises serious doubts. If they're lazy, then they're just lazy.
What else... Ah, here's something. The question of switching was raised not by me, but by people who have tried and enjoyed the mod. My words are clear to them.
Mass appeal? That's a good thing. Play however you like.
I probably don't understand something... But, in my opinion, a tournament with 5 strong professionals who will share their strategies is much more interesting and useful for a beginner than playing with 50 other beginners with minimal effort...
Because if a person wants to learn, they will. And you are trying to drag as many people as possible into it, hoping that something will come of it later.
