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Posts from Discussion about Sylvan (Wood Elves). Auto-translated

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#939
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Now, regarding leveling up a pair of heroes – doesn't it bother you that some Warlock or Barbarian might show up just when the first hero has stopped actively leveling up, and the second hasn't gained enough strength yet? And will be much stronger than them, because all the experience was spent on just one, and not divided between two? And since our army is also split in half according to your method – one has dragons, and the other has everything else – you might end up struggling and not being able to afford it...
Yeah, that's true, but the Sylvan faction's starting position isn't very good, so experimenting and originality in the game are always welcome.

Edited: OFF-TOPIC in the message

IMHO, a person is a creature that can find a way out of any situation. (I think I went too far)
In reply to Mdance
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#940
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Mdance;165795
No, it’s actually quite interesting. I just meant that clearing neutral creatures is one thing, and encountering the enemy’s main hero, for which our hero should be “prepared,” is a completely different matter.
For example, Orson, with 4 Vampires, can take Utopia in the first 1-2 weeks, so what?
I’ve also seen how Nura takes out 30+ Cyclops with a couple of Gremlins...
That’s why I’m saying that a replay of a battle with neutral creatures doesn’t necessarily indicate that the hero will be stronger than the enemy.
It’s a strange argument. I’m talking about how to level up quickly, and you’re telling me that it doesn’t guarantee an advantage. Of course, it doesn’t guarantee it; if there were even one factor in the game that gave an a priori advantage regardless of the opponent, that factor would be declared “broken” and banned from tournaments. Besides, Ilfin/Wing get the same skills towards the end of the game, namely: defense, light, education, and so on.
Now, regarding leveling up two heroes – doesn’t it bother you that some Warlock or Orc might show up just when the first hero is no longer actively leveling up, and the second hasn’t gained enough strength yet? And will be much stronger than them because he spent all the experience on himself, instead of splitting it between two? And since our army is also split in half according to your method – one has dragons, and the other has everything else – you might end up in trouble and run out of money...
It doesn’t bother me. First, who said that the first hero isn’t leveling up? They’re just going in different directions. Regarding running out of money – if you’re clearing with one hero, and I’m using two, then I’ll definitely have more money ;)
And, by the way, regarding resistance against casters – they “know” when a spell will be deflected and just attack. Only Pitys and Water Elementals can’t attack, so they still cast. But if there’s an opportunity to attack, they will.
What’s that supposed to mean? At least quote something. Yes, casters don’t always attack with magic. It’s not that they “know,” but there’s a certain resistance threshold at which they’ll stop casting and start attacking. I don’t remember the exact number offhand, but it’s something around 40-50%.
Я в мечеть не за праведным словом пришёл.
Не стремясь приобщиться к основам пришёл.
В прошлый раз утащил я молитвенный коврик,
Он истерся до дыр, - я за новым пришёл.

© О. Хайям

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#941
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oxygen_hl;165906
What's the point of that? At least quote the original text.

I'm referring to this:
oxygen_hl;165906
It's not a good idea to attack powerful spellcasters with weak troops. You can defeat Druids if you have a Ring of Protection from Lightning (which you can often find) and decent resistance. For example, take a couple of Veteran Horned Beasts with you into battle; then the risk won't be so great, and even then, it's only necessary in certain situations (to pass through, for an important artifact).

They'll just start shooting, and they won't stop casting spells, although losses will indeed be reduced. I just wanted to talk about the mechanics of how neutral creatures behave against resistance.
oxygen_hl;165906
Yes, of course, spellcasters don't always use magic. It's not that they "know" it, but there's a certain resistance threshold at which they'll stop casting and start shooting. I don't remember the exact number offhand, but it's something around 40-50%.

No. I specifically tested it in version 2.1, and I don't think the mechanics have changed. With 50 or 75 resistance (I don't remember which option I tried), I attacked Druids with Battle Unicorns, giving them a huge mana reserve. They didn't stop casting. But no spells were deflected until they killed all the Unicorns. They cast spells and shot. Logically, it turns out that the computer is cheating with spell deflection. But the Pit Fiends cast spells because they couldn't attack at range. But in the case of deflection, they cast the cheapest spell. However, when I approached them within melee range, they did the same as the Druids – they cast spells and then attacked in melee.
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...
In reply to Mdance
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#942
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Mdance;165915
They will just start shooting, and they won't stop casting spells either, although the losses will indeed be reduced. I just wanted to say something about the mechanics of neutral creatures' behavior against resistance.
That's true. But their shooting isn't that bad. It's not particularly scary. In this regard, mages are the worst, because they don't care about resistance at all. :)
Mdance;165915
No. I specifically tested it in 2.1, and I don't think anything has changed in the mechanics. With 50 or 75 resistance – I don't remember exactly which option I tried – I attacked Druids with a large mana reserve using Battle Unicorns. They didn't stop casting. But not a single spell was deflected until they killed all the Unicorns. They were casting and shooting alternately. Logically, this suggests that the AI is cheating with spell deflection. But the Pit Fiends were casting because they couldn't attack at range. However, in case of deflection, they cast the cheapest spell. But when I approached them within melee range, they did the same as the Druids – they cast and then attacked in melee.
That's strange. In 3.0, we generated a situation, and it seemed like a threshold was found. *Going to do some testing.*
Я в мечеть не за праведным словом пришёл.
Не стремясь приобщиться к основам пришёл.
В прошлый раз утащил я молитвенный коврик,
Он истерся до дыр, - я за новым пришёл.

© О. Хайям

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#943
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oxygen_hl;165917
That's strange. In 3.0, the situation was generated, and a threshold was identified. *Went to testing.*

Well, right now, I quickly equipped Ossir with Combat skills, Armor, and boots.
Total - 15+30+20+10=75% resistance. 7 units of Supreme Druids from the enemy hero in auto-combat. They either cast spells or shoot. Not a single deviation on 10 Horns.

And Mages - yes, they are more dangerous. I remember they either cast Fireball or Fist.
I mean, the Archmages.
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...
In reply to Mdance
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#944
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Mdance;165940
Well, I quickly equipped Ossir with Combat skills, Armor, and Boots.
Total: 15+30+20+10=75% resistance. 7 units of Supreme Druids on the enemy hero's auto-battle. Sometimes they cast spells, sometimes they shoot. Not a single deviation on 10 Horns.
And Mages - yes, they are more dangerous. I remember they either cast Fireball or use Fist.
I mean, the Archmages.
Funny. I tested it. Indeed, sometimes they shoot, sometimes they cast spells, but still, sometimes they hit the resistance. I saved the replay just in case. In general, it's very strange; on the test server, I saw completely different behavior in the game. And here, it seems like you absolutely need Marbas with 100% resistance so that their spells are grayed out in the spellbook.
Я в мечеть не за праведным словом пришёл.
Не стремясь приобщиться к основам пришёл.
В прошлый раз утащил я молитвенный коврик,
Он истерся до дыр, - я за новым пришёл.

© О. Хайям

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#945
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oxygen_hl;165942
Funny. I tested it. Indeed, sometimes they attack, sometimes they cast spells, but they still occasionally hit the resistance. I saved the replay just in case. Overall, it's very strange; I saw completely different behavior in the test environment. And here, it seems like you absolutely need Marbas with 100% resistance for the spell to even turn gray in their spellbook.

Yeah. I decided to try 50 Unicorns against 7 level 1 units – it was long and tedious. And later, resistances do start to appear. But they don't appear right away... And in 2.1, I never managed to get resistances to work... Some kind of strange AI behavior. It feels like it knows when the resistance will work at the beginning, and then it just ignores that knowledge... :D
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...
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#946
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Moderated: OFF-TOPIC in the message

Mdance;165946
Yeah. I decided to try 50 Unicorns against 7 level 1 units – it was long and tedious. And later, resistances really start to kick in. But there are no resistances at the beginning... And in 2.1, I couldn't get resistances to work... Some strange AI behavior. It feels like it knows when the resistance will work at the beginning, and then it just ignores that knowledge...:D
Maybe it's just a random occurrence... I became curious myself, and now I've checked, and in the end, it didn't lead to anything... it's still the same as with you, in 2.1 there are no resistances... :smile05:
С уважением, Vlad

HeroesWorld: В контакте
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#947
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Moderated: OFF-TOPIC in the message

I have temporarily left my favorite League of Shadows and am actively returning to the faction I started playing Heroes 5 with – the Forest Alliance. Of course, I've played them a bit here and there, but now I want to focus on them.

This raises the question:
On AG, there is currently an active debate: is it better to spend a huge amount of wood and quickly upgrade to Forest Archers to improve your attack power, but risk running out of wood, or build Ents on the 2nd week, but without upgrading the archers?
Personally, I lean towards the first option. After all, Ents are built only 5 days after the archers are upgraded, and a lot can be done in that time...

What are your thoughts on this?

And, by the way, I'm trying to develop Ossir using the "Powerful Archer Stack + Inspiration + Keen Mind + Mass Haste" scheme. It's a deadly combination. The archers attack like a machine gun, destroying almost everything with their armor penetration and luck.
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...
#948
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2 Mdance. I'm certainly not an expert, but I think the first option is more relevant. I don't really use Ents in battles with neutral creatures, and I don't think having 3-4 more or fewer Ents in the final battle will make much of a difference.
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#949
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depending on which week the final is, having 3-4 creatures of level 6 on the third or fourth week is very important. :)
Каждый может быть героем ...
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#950
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The choice depends on many factors. I usually start building upgrades after all the dwellings are available in my town. In principle, if the main hero or the second hero is Ossir, plus there's a dwelling on the map nearby, and the map is rich in resources, you can try upgrading and then run off to find wood. :)
On a small map, I wouldn't sacrifice 4 dwellings – you might simply not have enough of these tanks in a battle.
Белый и Пушистый! Иногда.....
In reply to Snowball
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#952
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Snowball;166949
The choice depends on many factors. I usually start building upgrades after all the dwellings are available in my town. In principle, if the main hero or the second hero is Ossir, plus a dwelling on the map nearby, and the map is rich, you can try to upgrade and then run to find wood. :)
On a small map, I wouldn't sacrifice 4 dwellings – you might simply not have enough tanks in a battle.

Hmm... Here's an example of a small map – Former Friends. You probably know that whoever takes the center first has an 80% chance of winning.
On this map, rushers rule – Orcs, Mechanists, Leto.
And it's almost impossible for an Elf to break through to the center early without upgrading archers. And with the upgrade, I buy a Dragon on day 5 or 6. Why should I wait for Ents?
With the dragon, I clear the surroundings and on day 8, I take the second hero. I wait for the opponent and support my army.
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...
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#953
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The choice depends on many factors. I usually start building upgrades after all the dwellings are available in my town. In principle, if the main hero or the second hero is Ossir, plus a dwelling nearby on the map, and the map is rich, it's quite possible to try upgrading and then go look for wood.
You shouldn't save resources; you should find more of them, and upgrading archers is essential for that. The exception is when key guards cannot be defeated by them.
Hmm... Here's an example of a small map - Former Friends. You probably know that whoever takes the center first has an 80% chance of winning.
On this map, rushers like Orcs, Mechanists, and Letos are dominant.
And it's almost impossible for an Elf to break through to the center early without upgrading archers. With the upgrade, I buy a Dragon on day 5 or 6. Why should I wait for Ents?
Yes, it's a good example of a map where it's really bad without an upgrade, but even with the upgrade, it's not easy for the Elf. On day 5-6, correct me if I'm wrong, you don't always manage to get there (you need a bit of luck with neutrals), starting from the red spawn, and you suffer significant losses after the battles on the bridge, the outpost, and for the nearby artifact, unless you're extremely lucky with the neutrals. But someone like Kaspar can very reliably (from the blue, earth spawn) break through the bridge and the artifact guard by the end of day 3 without losses, because only alternate dogs, archmages, and old druids can theoretically cause him losses. Everything else is defeated without losses, plus gargoyles and, with some risk, gnomes. And if you meet in the center area, the Plague Tent will do its dirty work.
In reply to Fireball
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#954
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Fireball;166966

Yes, this is a good example of a map where it’s really tough without upgrades, but even with upgrades, it’s not easy for the Elf. On days 5-6, correct me if I’m wrong, you don’t always manage to expand (you need a bit of luck with the neutrals).

I tried playing about 10 games in a row. I failed to expand only once.
Fireball;166966
from the red spawn

That’s true. From the red spawn. I’ll try from the others as well. But starting as an Elf on the snow map is masochism.
Fireball;166966
with noticeable losses after battles on the bridge

If you have casters, then yes. Once, playing as Druids, I lost 8 Archers out of 16. :(

Fireball;166966
at the outpost

Single Dryads as cover. Once, I foolishly placed Unicorns – I lost one. I haven’t done that since.

Fireball;166966
for the ranged attack,

No. A Dragon, bought at the Outpost, helps a lot.
Fireball;166966
unless you have incredibly good luck with the neutrals.

If you have incredibly good luck with the neutrals, it’s a breeze. The Ranger crushes them in auto-battle like children.
Fireball;166966
And Kaspar very reliably (from the blue, earth, or spawn) clears the bridge and guards the artifact by the end of day 3 without losses, because in theory, only alternate dogs, archmages, and old druids can cause him losses. Everything else is cleared without losses + gargoyles and, with some risk, gnomes. And if you meet in the center area, the Plague Tent will do its dirty work.

I agree with this. However, Kaspar is often banned.
Я видел, как Небо окутала Тьма, и Небо смирилось с Судьбой,
Горящие реки сходили с ума, пытаясь остаться водой,
Земля пропустила коварный удар, раскрывшись на шаге вперёд,
Взлетел разъярённым драконом Огонь и понял, что тоже умрёт...