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Posts from Balance in Heroes 5.

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How would you rate the balance in Heroes of Might and Magic 5?
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18 years ago
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I take experience on the hero, and that's enough. Dungeon is easier because you can defeat many enemies with almost no losses, especially in the early stages.
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18 years ago
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2Shogun
1. The key phrase is that you got a little lucky at the start.

Yesterday, in 6 out of 7 dungeon runs, I took gold, sulfur, and crystal mines, and a dragon lair on days 7-8. Once, I got them on day 5 (I was lucky that golems were guarding the crystals, and I took them with a hero with one Fury).
By "a little lucky," I mean getting a decent 3rd hero with good stats, nothing more.
You won't be able to defeat 7 stacks of 7-15 Alt Golems before the hero's turn.
And after the hero's turn (Armageddon), all the golems are alive again, and at least 1-2 stacks will survive until their turn.
They will be taken out in stacks. Judging by the number of golems, it's around week 4-5 of the game, and therefore, there will be enough damage to deal 200 HP to each stack (10 golems). The spell will be survived, and before their turn, the golems can be finished off. And you don't necessarily have to stand in the central cell. Also, don't forget about the ballista and the hero, who may have Summon and can take out 10 golems with a simple Fist. And if the archer or swift flyer also has morale? I won't even mention shackles.
Of course, Golemodon is strong, but not invincible. But for Razazak with Battle to the Last, it definitely makes sense.
If you don't attack the golems before the hero's turn:
a) before attacking the golems, you get a gem before your turn, and if you're lucky
b) with Expert Enchantment, you can get a second gem, and at least one of the two will be lucky. In total, about 3,000 damage per stack, and the golems are still in full force. You can even defeat the main hero with his entire army this way.
You're quite the storyteller.
1. Even with Enchantment, the hero won't go twice before the initiative troops. And those troops may also have artifacts.
2. Half of the golems may be gone even before the hero's turn.
3. 1000 damage from Armageddon without luck = 32 spell power. It's hard to believe.
In reply to Fireball
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18 years ago
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Fireball;139299
2Shogun

By "a bit lucky," I meant a decent 3rd-tier hero with reasonable stats, nothing more.

They'll be taking out stacks. Judging by the number of golems, it's around week 4-5 of the game, which means there will be damage available to deal 200 HP to a stack (10 golems). The spell can be cast, and by the time it's their turn, the golems might already be finished off. And you don't necessarily have to position yourself in the central square. Also, don't forget about the ballista and the hero who might have Summon and can take out 10 golems with a simple Fist attack. And what if the archer or swift flyer also has morale? I won't even mention Shackles.
Of course, the Golem Lord is strong, but not invincible. But it definitely makes sense for Razazak with the Battle to the Last ability.

You're quite the storyteller.
1. Even with Spellpower, the hero won't cast twice before the initiative troops. And those troops might already have artifacts.
2. Half of the golems might be gone before the hero's turn.
3. 1000 damage from Armageddon without luck = 32 spell points. That's hard to believe.

Well, you still need to find/buy Shackles.
Thanks for the idea about Razazak:smile54: I'll test it out when I have time.

Now, about the stories:
1. Why twice?:eek: Once is enough. By the way, artifacts will also be on the golems.
If the opponent attacks with high initiative troops, they'll take out the golems immediately, and then the Stone Skin spell will revive them, and some of the stack will survive until their turn. If they're defeated, it's their own fault. And if the heroine is a specialist in fast spellcasting (like Oara, I think), she'll have great initiative after casting on level 20.

2. You'll have to limit yourself to one cast, but that's not a given.

3. It's not that unrealistic. On level 20, with artifacts, it's not that difficult for an archmage to have 20 spell points. So, with the Phoenix Amulet, it's around 3000 HP, and without it, it's around 2000 HP. Of course, you still need to find/buy the amulet. So, you're right - let's take 2000 HP damage from 2 Stone Skin spells as the base.

Added 29 minutes ago
P.S. The presence/absence of Shackles can be easily checked with an auxiliary hero.

P.P.S. Of course, for any tricky nut, sooner or later, a screw with a tricky thread will be found. The question is only - when:confused: In fact, to speed up this process, I raised this issue.

Added 42 minutes ago
Vayshan;139193
Shogun: where in my post does it say that I consider the AI as an opponent? I didn't say that. The AI sometimes makes such stupid moves that... Well, everyone knows that. I was actually talking about which difficulty level is the most balanced. And Veteran is the closest to playing against a human. And I have to play against the AI because there are terrible glitches online. And why is the Dungeon easier on the hero level than the others? They need a lot of resources for the city, including gold. On Veteran, I always only take gold from all the chests, and even then, it's not enough.

Sorry if I offended you:smile41: You just described the difficulty levels from the point of view of playing against the AI.

The Dungeon is the easiest because it generates money and resources and artifacts the fastest. And in the army, I often buy only imps and stalkers for the first two weeks, which is a significant saving. Thanks to this, most of the chests are used for experience. As a result, there is an advantage in the development of both the city and the hero.
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18 years ago
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By the way, artifacts will also be placed on golems.
That's not a given. After all, you have to return to the city to upgrade them, and then go back.
If the opponent attacks with high-initiative troops first, the stone will revive all the golems, and some of them will survive until their turn. If they are weakened, it will be worse for them.
Golems will be eliminated in stacks, and the dead ones won't be resurrected. So, "all alive and well" doesn't work.
And if the heroine is a specialist in fast spellcasting (like Orah, I think), at level 20, she will have very high initiative after casting.
Yes, but her initiative is not 10, but 11. Her advantage is not in the speed of casting, but in the fact that she goes before the enemy hero, which can be important.
2. But after the hero's turn, they will be back in full force.
They will eliminate at least 3-4 stacks. Situation: an elf with tactics and a speed aura (or boots). Before the mage or golems go, the following go:
nymphs (-2 stacks), dancing winds (-1), forest archers (-1), dragons (-1-2, and if they are alt-dragons, then even more). At least 5 stacks are lost, and in general, 1 morale and the loss of the main hero, and the mage hasn't even cast a spell. It's better not to engage in a battle to the Last without preparation.
It's not that unrealistic. At level 20, with the help of artifacts, it's not that difficult for an academic to have 20 SP. So, with a Phoenix cloak, it's about 3000 HP, without it - about 2000 HP. Of course, you need to find/buy the cloak. So, you are right - let's take 2000 HP of damage from the stone as the base.
Okay, let's clarify right away. With 20 SP and a cloak (which, by the way, is quite rare), the base damage is 945 with a cast from an expert, and there may not be a second one (most likely, there won't be). We won't go into the central square, there's another 420 damage there. Pyrokinesis, if it happens, won't be able to deal much damage either, but the Fire Lord will remove half of the golems' defense, and then they're definitely done for. Where did you get 2000 and 3000 from?
And also, if you sense that they will use Armageddon, you can take a perk from the Light faction that reduces fire damage by 2 times.
P.S. The presence/absence of shackles can be easily checked with an auxiliary hero.
If you attack the main hero on the same day, which is not always feasible.
Thanks for the idea with Razazak, I'll test it at my leisure.
You're welcome. This idea occurred to many on the very first day after buying the add-on. It's just that there was information before that Armageddon would hit alt-golems, and then this happened. But personally, I think that in 3.1, at least 3 things need to be adjusted:
1. Orcish Rage, so that, while absorbing damage, it doesn't go into the negative. And also, rebalance it so that, all other things being equal, more rage is spent on this absorption, about one and a half times more.
2. Something needs to be done about the stalkers' invisibility. It's too much for level 1.
3. Armageddon should hit golems, because even the stone in the center heals them with PHYSICAL damage.
In reply to Fireball
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18 years ago
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Fireball;139524

1. Give Orcs Fury so that, by absorbing damage, it doesn't go into negative values.
Doesn't it already work that way? As far as I know, it doesn't decrease during an attack, only during waiting/defense.
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18 years ago
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When attacking in reverse, it adds...
In reply to Fireball
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18 years ago
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Fireball;139524
Not necessarily. Because for this, you need to return to the city and then go back.

Of course, it's not a certainty, but it's not impossible either.
They will remove the golems in stacks, and the undead piles will not be resurrected. So, "everyone is alive and well" won't work.

I agree.

Yes, it's not 10, but 11. Its advantage is not in the speed of casting, but in the fact that it goes before the enemy hero, which can be important.

Not 11, but 14. No one has canceled the "Expert Sorcery" skill, and everyone hires him as an "Academic."

They will remove at least 3-4 stacks from you. Situation: an elf with tactics and a speed aura (or boots). Before the mage or golems go, the
nymphs (-2 stacks), dancing winds (-1), forest archers (-1), and dragons (-1-2, and if they are high dragons, then even more) go. At least 5 stacks are lost, and in general, 1 morale and the loss of the main hero, and the mage hasn't even cast a spell. It's better not to engage in a "Battle to the Last" without a fight.

And with a "Battle to the Last":D

Okay, let's clarify right away. With 20 spell power and a cloak (which, by the way, is quite rare), the base damage is 945 with an expert cast, and there may not be a second one (most likely, there won't be). We won't go into the central square; there's another 420 damage. Pyrokinesis, if it happens, won't have time to deal much damage, but the "Lord of Fire" will remove half of the defense from the golems, and then they're definitely done for. Where did you get 2000 and 3000 from?
And also, if you sense that they will use "Armageddon," you can take a perk from the "Light" skill that reduces fire damage by 2 times.

a) I calculated for TWO stones.
b) one standard and one with luck - we get 2835 with a cloak, 1890 without it, of course, not counting resistances.

If you attack the main hero on the same day, which is not always feasible.


Logical.

Please. This idea occurred to many on the very first day after purchasing the add-on. It's just that there was information earlier that "Armageddon" would hit high golems, and here's this gift. But personally, I tend to think that in 3.1, at least 3 things need to be adjusted:
1. "Rage" for orcs, so that, while absorbing damage, it doesn't go into the negative. And also, rebalance it so that, all other things being equal, more rage is spent on this absorption, about one and a half times more.
2. Something needs to be done about the stalkers' invisibility. For level 1, it's too much.
3. "Armageddon" should hit golems, because even the stone in the center heals them with PHYSICAL damage.

1. I agree.
2. I think you can simply reduce the duration of the stalkers' invisibility to 2 turns.
3. I agree. Because "Golemo-geddon" + "Battle to the Last" is a big problem (I tested it yesterday)
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18 years ago
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Not 11, but 14. No one has canceled the Expert Sorcery skill yet, and everyone wants the Academic skill.
Of course, 11 without Sorcery, I just wanted to emphasize that the strength isn't only in the "Ory" skill. But it's not 14 either, because Sorcery only increases effective initiative by a factor of
(10/7) within the limit of an infinite number of casts. In the case of two casts, and it's definitely not worth counting on more (if there are more, that's great, death to the enemy), the effective initiative is equal to (Ory level 20) (22/1.7) = 12.94 < 14. Don't forget about this.
Because Golemageddon + fighting to the last is a great evil (tested yesterday)
It is evil. You can only effectively counter it with an Elf and a Demon, if you have Apsukubs that can chain-fire and quickly deal with units with low HP. And also with an Orc, before they nerfed the ability to reduce rage into negative values when absorbing damage.
I think you can simply reduce the duration of Stalkers' invisibility to 2 turns.
Even with Lethos, this might still be too much, although I can't say for sure. But 2 turns is definitely closer to the truth than 3.
In reply to Fireball
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18 years ago
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Fireball;139755

Evil. You can only effectively defend against it with Elves and Demons, provided you have Apsuccubi, who can chain-fire and quickly eliminate units with low HP. And also with Orcs, before they nerfed the ability to gain Rage by absorbing damage.
.

1. With Light Elves, you can not only defend but also defeat the enemy's main hero – long live high initiative, developed leadership, and Wingrael.
2. Demons:confused: I don't understand :( Can you elaborate?
3. Orcs - the same as Demons:D
Fireball;139755
With Letos, this might even be too much, although I can't say for sure. But 2 turns is definitely closer to the truth than 3.

No, 2 is fine. Whether with Letos or with other heroes, 39 Stalkers won't be able to defeat 36 Druids (at least not without unacceptable losses).
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18 years ago
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I would like to express my opinion regarding everything mentioned above. Of course, it depends on the person, but for almost everyone (maybe not quite everyone), there is a faction that disrupts the game's balance. I used to think that Stronghold was overpowered, but now I don't think so anymore. I practiced, practiced, and found a solution to my problem! Therefore, balance WAS, IS, and WILL BE... IMHO.
In reply to Gunslinger
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18 years ago
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In my opinion, with the introduction of the Stronghold, the game balance has shifted downwards. Before that, I was satisfied with everything. My friend and I (we have the same level of experience) practiced many times in Heroes of Might and Magic III, and we came to the conclusion that it is very difficult to defeat the Stronghold. The only option is to use Sylvan with expert defense, but if the Stronghold also has the same defense, it's useless. They have an advantage in initiative and a large army... of course, it's not just about defense, but still, I didn't notice such an imbalance before. And also, fire arrows play a very big role, and they are too easily accessible. I am against it.
In reply to Xodyn
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18 years ago
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I wouldn't criticize the game balance! In my opinion, it has only improved since Tribes of the East! And I think many will agree with me!:smile01:
In reply to 3DogMZA
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18 years ago
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I agree, almost. There is a way to counter Orcs, and not just one. I would only change the abilities of some heroes. But overall, it's excellent. :smile54:
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18 years ago
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I remember our last battle, Storm! Sylvan versus Orcs – your victory!
The game balance is good. Is it true that the Orcs were or will be nerfed?
In reply to Draga Musa Welli
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18 years ago
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Yes, all factions have both weak and strong points. In my opinion, the balance is good.

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