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[...]in the previous tournament, I already answered similar questions... And now I will repeat that in the tournament, I prohibit leveling up a hero by visiting his tomb at the University, School, Arena, Hut, or by taking Altars...
Hmm. Something tells me I missed something. Please point me to where this is.
Because we are simple people, and we read the rules...Lu41k;122455
5.3. Leveling up hero tombs with a Thief. Leveling up hero tombs with a Grandmaster of Stealth. TARGETED leveling up of a tomb in this way is PROHIBITED.
- OK, we won't level up (this is impossible in WoW anyway)Lu41k;122455
5.4. Leveling up a tomb with ordinary units using attack, defense, and speed crystals in combat, increasing magic points. PROHIBITED.
- OK, we won't eat crystalsLu41k;122455
8. EVERYTHING ELSE IS ALLOWED. (unlimited number of heroes on the map, more than eight, and so on).
- OK, we will use everything else as needed. And suddenly, there are such twists!
I am not useless - I can be used as a bad example!
IronAxe, I respect your opinion and even listen to it. Let's do this: let's avoid further questions – for this stage of the tournament, we’ll leave everything as is. I will write out the rules in more detail. And starting with the next tournament, I think that we should all discuss the rules for holding offline tournaments together. Besides, I am sure that you know much more than what is written in the rules, and certainly more than we do. And I hope that you will share this knowledge with us ;) The tournament is already in full swing, and I no longer believe that changing the rules would be acceptable. So let's leave everything as it is, and by the next tournament, we will try to improve the rules; therefore, I will await your suggestions, which we can then discuss. However, I seem to be repeating myself :)
Now regarding Undergrounder's request to "point" to where I said this… Well, I won't point ;) I’ll just show my post: /topic/at/116110/
And finally, I would like to add that I am still new to organizing tournaments; I am only learning. And I really hope for your understanding. Of course, I don't know everything; perhaps I am wrong in many ways. But as they say, one learns from mistakes... So I try to listen to all your comments and suggestions, although I don't accept everything, but I still take them into account.
So, generally speaking, I think that's all for now, so I look forward to your comments, suggestions, and opinions! I will review everything and take it into consideration. But in this tournament, the rules remain the same.
Sincerely, Luchik!
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
IronAxe, I respect your opinion, and moreover, I listen to it. Let's do this: let's avoid any further questions regarding this stage of the tournament – we will leave everything as is. I will write out the rules in more detail. And starting with the next tournament, I think that we should all discuss the rules for offline tournaments together. Besides, I am sure that you know much more than what is written in the rules, and especially more than we do. And I hope that you will share this knowledge with us ;)
I agree. As I said in my previous post, nothing needs to be changed in this tournament, and I suggested that we start discussing the rules now in preparation for the next tournament. What difference does it make when we start discussing them? During this tournament or after it ends; if someone has free time right now, they can discuss it.Lu41k;126115
The tournament is already in full swing, and I no longer believe that changing the rules is acceptable. So let's leave everything as it is, and try to improve the rules for the next tournament, which means I will be waiting for your suggestions, which we will then discuss..
Excellent. Therefore, according to the CURRENT RULES, training a Necropolis in the University is allowed! There is no prohibition of this in the rules on the title page of the tournament. Undergrounder clearly outlined all points of explicit prohibitions. And the logical conclusion he drew is correct. Anything not prohibited is permitted, especially since this is emphasized by the following rule: ----------------- 8. EVERYTHING ELSE IS PERMITTED. (unlimited number of heroes on the map, more than eight, etc.). -----------------Lu41k;126115
Now regarding Undergrounder's request to "point out" where I said this... Well, I won't point it out :) I’ll just show you my post: /topic/at/116110/
In this post, there is absolutely no mention of prohibiting training at the University. Later, this conversation took place during the 9th stage of the Caningham tournament, so adjustments to the rules could have been made before the start of this tournament. Since no adjustments were made, we will strictly adhere to the rules that are stated on the title page of this tournament until the next tournament. I believe this would be fair.Lu41k;126115
And finally, I would like to add that I am a new person in organizing tournaments and am still learning. And I really hope for your understanding. Of course, I don't know everything, maybe I'm wrong about many things.. But
You see, nobody is accusing you of anything; they want to help you organize the tournament and check its results more easily, as well as make it easier for players to understand and navigate the rules. Therefore, I consider even my critical posts to be supportive of the organizers. And I am very glad that you decided to take on such a difficult task as organizing Heroes IV tournaments because it is clear that you are a thoughtful and not stubborn person.Lu41k;126115
as they say, one learns from mistakes... So I try to listen to all your comments and suggestions, although I do not accept everything, but I always keep them in mind..
That’s great. We are always ready to help. I think Undergrounder and other Heroes IV players will support me.Lu41k;126115
So, this is probably all for now, so I look forward to your comments, suggestions, and opinions! I will review everything and take it into account. But in this tournament, the rules remain the same...
THE SAME means the ones that were on the title page of the PREVIOUS tournament and which remained on the title page of the CURRENT tournament. Everything discussed in the posts, including your opinions and the opinions of the players, is not the rules. Moreover, these discussions and the final decision were not recorded on the title page of the rules for this tournament.
IronAxe, yes, you really made me think... :) And you're right, there's no prohibition against it on the tournament's title page. But I'll still introduce a ban on this point, since I've decided to, and I think as an organizer, I have the right to do so, and I'll put it in the rules on the title page! For the next tournament, I'll think carefully and consider this point. I hope you won't be against this change in the rules.
As for your criticism, I take it quite normally and I'm grateful to you for it, because it is in debates that the truth is born. Besides, they provide additional food for thought.
With respect, Luchik!
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
IronAxe, yes, you really made me think... :) And indeed, there are no restrictions on this in the rules of the Tournaments... But I will still introduce a ban on this point, since I have already decided, I think that as an organizer, I have the right to do so, and specifically in the rules on the title page!
I think you have the right to do this, but only for the next Tournaments. Because it has already been discussed on the forum for a long time that it is considered bad form to change the rules in the middle of a Tournaments.Lu41k;126147
For the next Tournaments, I will think carefully and consider this point... I hope you will not be against this change in the rules.
In the next Tournaments, players will start as usual by reading the rules on the title page. Accordingly, if you add any points, players will be obliged to comply with them. Especially if all players actively discuss the new points before they are introduced. I think you won't object to this. And this Tournaments has already passed the halfway point, and changing something on the title page now is not serious.
IronAxe, yes, I made a mistake))) Never mind, it's too late now... I didn't have time to add it to the rules - it's my fault... But everyone is in the same situation, knowing about this bug, so I think the arguments are closed. Let everything remain as it is. The rules are the rules. What is written is written. Since I didn't add it to the rules earlier, what can I do now?
//offtopic: Are you a lawyer by any chance? :)
Sincerely, Luchik.
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
IronAxe, yes, you made a mistake))) Never mind, it's too late now...
That's exactly what I mean – I don't think you made a mistake. The rules are quite suitable, and they are the same as those already on the title screen. Lu41k;126176
I didn't have time to add it to the rules – that's my fault... But everyone is in the same situation, knowing about this bug, so I think the arguments are over. Let everything
Therefore, let everyone try to use this trick with training the Necropolis in the University this time :) Maybe this is the last chance to use this trick on this resource. By the way, I was told that this trick is allowed on Portals. Lu41k;126176
remain as is... The rules are the rules... What is written is written... Since I didn't add it to the rules earlier, what can I do now...
And nothing terrible happened. We still have a lot of work to do on improving the rules ;)Lu41k;126176
//offtopic: Are you a lawyer by any chance? :)
No. It's just that arguments about the rules in the Heroes 4 off-forums have been going on for a long time. And the problems are basically the same. Either there are too many prohibitions, or the prohibitions are not listed, but the excuse is that if you have doubts, ask the host, and otherwise, all bugs are prohibited :) So you have enough work to do before the next tournament if you want to have clear and sensible rules for your tournaments ;)
Yes, thank you. I remember this post, but I wasn't looking for it on the first page. The wording used in this post is acceptable for discussion and debate – i.e., a conference, which is where it was posted. But it is not suitable for inclusion in the Rules, as I wrote later in the same thread. Since I didn't see any changes in the Rules – neither “those” nor “these,” I assumed that the idea had died down. Apparently, I was wrong.
Essentially, the wording: (I combined them. Hopefully, it’s correct.)Lu41k
Now about "grave technologies." [...] From all of this, it was decided to keep only two: 1) 3.3. Using the "spacebar" key is PERMITTED when retrieving a dead hero (grave) from under monsters. 2) 5.5. Units carrying a grave are allowed to visit stables, oases, wells, and other objects that increase movement points. [...]retrieving the coffin using a unit and the spacebar will be permitted, just like quickly moving the coffin to the resurrection site using oases, wells, etc. [...]Let's not forget that this is still a coffin, not a living Hero, and our goal is ONLY to resurrect him!! Everything else should be done by the living Hero HIMSELF!! Isn't that logical? So all other "grave tricks" are PROHIBITED.
I will try to show in more detail why I consider this formula unacceptable. Okay, you can indirectly conclude from here that at least carrying the grave is allowed, and carrying does not fall under “all other ‘grave tricks.’” The same goes for resurrecting the grave; it’s already quite clear :) But according to this formula, the following are prohibited: - picking up the grave without using the "spacebar"; - leaving the grave on the ground; - passing the grave from one army to another; - transferring the grave to a ship; - transferring the grave from a ship; - putting artifacts on the corpse; - taking artifacts off the corpse; - entering into battle with a grave in your army; - visiting various "wells" while having two or more graves in your army; ...shall I continue?
Therefore, I cannot seriously take the wording "everything else."
P.S. I don't even know if anyone on this map will need training on how to use a grave.:D
I am not useless - I can be used as a bad example!
Undergrounder :) Well, that's what I'm saying – the rules need to be clarified, and that's coming, hopefully with your help and support. Because it's too late to change anything now... So, go ahead and share your thoughts. By the way, we should create a separate topic... which I'll take care of. I'm waiting for your suggestions..
Sincerely, Luchik!
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
I will try to explain in more detail why I consider this formula unacceptable. Okay, from this, one can indirectly conclude that at least moving a Tomb is allowed, and moving it does not fall under "all other 'tomb-related' tricks." The same applies to resurrecting a Tomb, and that's a plus. But, according to this formula, the following are prohibited: - raising a Tomb without a "gap"; - leaving a Tomb on the ground; - transferring a Tomb from one army to another; - transferring a Tomb to a ship; - transferring a Tomb from a ship; - equipping artifacts on a corpse; - removing artifacts from a corpse; - entering into battle with a Tomb in the army; - visiting various "wells" while having two or more Tombs in the army; ...shall I continue?
Better continue the list I started of explicit prohibitions that must be included in the rules for Heroes off-line Tournaments. And everything that does not fit into that list (and all your enumerations above :) I suggest including in the item: EVERYTHING ELSE IS ALLOWED. With the right to discuss in the future any tricks that they want to prohibit. But if a trick starts to be discussed in the current Tournament and they decide to prohibit it, then the changes to the rules should still only take effect from the next Tournament. Otherwise, we already have a long "list" of rules on the title page with the existing list of prohibitions. If we start listing in detail everything that is prohibited and allowed, it will be easier not to play in Tournaments so as not to study and figure out for several days the current rules on a dozen pages.Undergrounder;126223
Therefore, I cannot seriously consider the wording "everything else".
But I can :) If there is a small list of explicit prohibitions, and everything else is allowed :) And no one is forbidden to study exclusive features, especially since no one hides them, and no one forbids trying to trick leaders and looking at their saves after the Tournament. And I also think that Luchik is wrong to believe that allowing a full set of features with Tombs will reduce the game to just a cycle around a Tomb from which you can get a Super Tomb. I personally have not seen this in any game. The game will be strongly tied to the use of tomb-related technologies, but for their successful use, you will need to manage additional units and living Heroes.
Greetings to all participants. Lou, please register me.)) I'll try to make time to complete this tournament. General, great map! It's just a bit challenging, at least for me. Unfortunately, I'm not very good at Heroes of Might and Magic IV. With respect, Lord of Vampires.
Тот, кто находит удовольствие в уединении, либо дикий зверь, либо Бог (с) Аристотель
Lord Vampire, you are registered as number 9! I am very glad that you were still able to participate, despite all the problems with your computer!! Good luck and have a great time)) :)
Sincerely, Luchik!
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
Dear tournament organizer, please add me to the list of participants... we'll learn how to play together :) P.S. If no one else signs up, I'll definitely be in the top 10 :D
Alex_R, well done! I've been waiting for your activity in the 4th game for a long time.
I've signed up as number 10! Good luck and have fun playing :)
Sincerely, Luchik!
"Как это странно всегда.. Вроде бы взрослые люди, А в голове ерунда.. Мечтаем как дети о чуде.."
Question regarding the rules, specifically concerning the prohibition of "hiding spots."
Option: "a hiding spot that is difficult to access, partially blocked, and somewhat open":eek:
Is it permissible to generate and use a hiding spot on the battlefield with the following parameters:
- A hero (4x4) can enter;
- A pedestrian monster (6x6) cannot enter;
- Anyone inside is accessible for melee attacks by a pedestrian monster (7x7 or less).
And what if the same applies, but the hero (4x4) cannot enter? - That is, the hiding spot is completely blocked but can be broken through. At least one, and the largest, monster's attack cannot provide shelter within it.
I am not useless - I can be used as a bad example!
Undergrounder
