Posts from Inferno tactics.

If the map isn't hopelessly resource-scarce, I quite often build Ifrits in the first week, about 200%. You don't need that many resources; for example, compare: 1) how much wood you need to build Riders – 35, 2) how many resources you need to build Unicorns – 15 wood + 10 crystals + 10 gems. Try gathering and building them. And sometimes it works. Ifrits are probably the easiest of all level 6 creatures to build. In the second week, you buy 4 Ifrits (or 5, if you've also built a Stronghold), gather meat (Imps + Gogs), and easily clear the entire territory, and by the end of the second week, you manage to build a Castle, Dogs, and Demons (possibly Broodlings). At the beginning of the third week, you have a Capitol + Warehouse; by the end of the week, you have Devils. ________________________________________ For example, yesterday we played on a resource-scarce map. And on the 7th day of the second week, the following situation arose: we had built a Town Hall + Stronghold + the first 4 levels of monsters. We faced a difficult choice: build Ifrits so that we would have 5 of them on the 1st day of the third week, or build a Castle (so as not to have to wait another week for the Capitol). On the advice of my opponent (Ewgeniy ;)), I built Ifrits, although I was leaning towards building a Castle, since there was almost no money on the map. And I didn't regret listening to him: by using the 5 Ifrits I bought on the 2nd day to defeat 15 Diamond Golems, I gained access to a rich territory, and as a result, I managed to build a Castle, a Capitol, and Devils this week. Conclusion: if I had built a Castle on the 7th day, I would have spent another 5 days in the Castle waiting for the Capitol, then I would have built Ifrits (but it would have been too late for Devils), I wouldn't have leveled up my hero in that time, and I wouldn't have discovered a new respawn point or Castle.

Yes, that's how I play here. And many others do too. No municipality, no prefecture, just access to troops.

No, I don't feel sorry for the demons. But I do feel sorry for the Archdemons with their tiny hells and the ifrits. Because after leaving Dragon Utopia, you need something to fight with. And demons are too slow.

Yes, it was a good match. :D

As practice has shown, ifrits really are powerful, and although in the final battle against KoR, badping won, remaining with his main castle and approximately fifty Evil Eyes, he was so scared of the return of the main enemy hero that he immediately agreed to a draw. :D
(although, perhaps he could have won if there had been more time and desire :rolleyes: )

Just so it's clear what badping is writing about :)

I've read the messages in this thread, and I started feeling kind of sorry for Inferno. I agree that the race isn't simple and requires skill to play, but nonetheless, it has its own special charm.

High mobility, an excellent choice of heroes—perhaps not the most noble, but superb—and the low cost of building make the race capable of surviving in almost any conditions.

Among the magical races, Inferno is the cheapest to build up.

...which is why I left a message:
"Ready to play as Inferno against Stronghold (Barbarians) or Fortress (Swamp) on a map no smaller than M+Dungeon. ICQ 478-082-545, on weekends" :smile19:
The message didn't stay here long, and the moderator moved it to the thread "Arranging to play HoMM3 online"...

Strangely enough, only badping responded; apparently, there were no other volunteers to defend barbarian honor. And as it turned out, badping hadn't played much as Barbarians or Swamp dwellers either :smile32:

Therefore, we played Inferno against Dungeon. My starting hero was Octavia, and Badping chose Dimir.

Since the topic is dedicated to Inferno, I'll focus more on describing the features of the game from that specific point of view. We played on 160% difficulty on an L map with a dungeon and 4 computers to boot.

I spawned underground. Many consider this a minus, but in reality, it's a matter of taste... Having played Dungeon and Inferno a lot, I've grown accustomed to life in the dim light of the dungeon and found a special attraction in it. There are very few paths; you just have to pick a direction, draw your sword, and fight your way through to the enemy... Besides, smashing scout freaks along the narrow corridors of a dungeon is much more pleasant than chasing them while crawling through snow and swamps... :smile24: ...and badping will agree with me :))

The second misconception is that Inferno has no good heroes, but that's not true. And you don't necessarily have to pick a native hero; after all, you can buy a "guest worker."
Demons are one of the best classes among fighters, and Fiona, Octavia, and Pyra are just wonderful girls.
Inferno's mages are also superb. Aiden, Xyron, Axis, Zidar, and Xarfax. Of course, they aren't Solmyras or Dimirs, but they are quite capable guys :)

Development was standard: by day 5, Efreeti were up; by day 7, all military buildings were built except for Pit Lords and Devils, as well as the Citadel and the Mage Guild. And yet, I would call my starting location poor. I began the 2nd week with 5 Efreeti.
This pleasure cost only 4500, half of which, by the way, was hauled in by Octavia :) Actually, it's unclear where she gets the money, but apparently, it's somehow related to devilish feminine charm :smile36:

But Aiden became the main hero after all.
Almost simultaneously, we both got a second castle. I got a Stronghold, and Badping got a Tower.

Throughout the game, I got lucky only once—there was an Efreeti dwelling near the castle, where I consistently bought the growth. The main hero found some boots somewhere and dashed around with just Efreetis, tearing the arrogant computer to shreds. :smile13:

Octavia was killed somewhere along the way, and there wasn't enough money for the ransom... poor little demon... :smile34: Apparently, that's where the problems actually started :) Betrayal is not forgiven, even in a devilish environment :smile18:

First, I made a mistake—spending 10,000 on the Capitol, even though it was clear that things were coming to an end and it wouldn't have time to pay off. :smile35: Then I got carried away searching for resources to upgrade the Mage Guild and missed the appearance of an enemy hero, who suddenly popped out of a portal right in front of the castle. The opponent decided to return the favor and, in turn, made a mistake by not attacking the castle immediately :)
On the next turn, I sold everything down to the last crumb and used secret paths to move the army out of the castle, into which the enemy invader—a real tough guy named Dimon—immediately settled.

Once again rejoicing in his new boots, Aiden, with Efreeti under his arm, rushed to the walls of his home city, and after taking reinforcements, immediately scaled the walls.

Apparently, badping was shocked by the amount of mana that came with Aiden, but there were no decent spells, so the potential wasn't fully realized. Expert Anti-Magic made the Efreeti immune to magic, and Earth Cloak made the use of Meteor Shower inefficient. The Efreeti thinned the enemy ranks with raids, breaking through to the Beholders, while the others didn't waste time either and courageously took Lightning bolts straight to the head, which Dimir was generously scattering.

After a bloody battle, Aiden eventually retreated, leaving the enemy with 35 Beholders and menacingly promising: I’ll be back :)

My completely crazed hero, bald and pointy-eared, apparently struck fear into the enemy, and in the end, we concluded a peace agreement and agreed on a draw :smile15:

Although in reality, badping won; I had no money, and he had 3 built-up castles: his native one, the Tower captured from the enemy, and my own home! And my barbarian shack was truly of no use...

By an irony of fate, Aiden, who struck terror into the hearts of enemies, ended his life in new boots and with a pair of Efreeti in the castle of those he did not respect—the Barbarians..

Awesome! I hope there will still be plenty of players when I finally have time to play in early January. I'll be playing as Inferno with Aydan, as usual. What about you?

So, another battle for Inferno.

VVV (Tower, Daremyth, Daremyth) def KoR (Inferno, Octavia, Ayden) 2.2.4
Size: M
Underground: no
Computers: no
Monsters: strong
Difficulty: 160%, 2 min/turn

To be honest, I was surprised to see that the opponent chose Daremyth.
Well, I thought, now I'll give him a good lesson.
===================
The computer clearly messed something up with the generation. VVV got the Giants' dwelling, and I got the Demons' dwelling! Apparently, the computer decided that demons are terrible warriors, and when there are many of them, they jump on the titans and simply tear them to shreds with their powerful paws!
===================
The game started, there was no easy start at all, but Inferno is doing great. On day 5, I place an Ifrit, and 2 Ifrits immediately replenish Octavia's army.

Ayden didn't appear in the tavern. Octavia urgently telegraphed him: "My love, come quickly. Your Octavia." Apparently, he had some business, but he promised to drop everything and arrive next week.

Octavia's strike army – 50 demons, 10 Gog, 3 dogs, later joined by 2 Ifrits.

Unlike me, VVV developed with an emphasis on money.
First day – upgrade gremlins, then straight to the Magistrate.
Strike army – 78 gremlins, 7 gargoyles

On day 4, VVV captured the Stronghold, and I captured the Tower on day 5.
==================
Day 121
Both have two castles

Inferno
All military buildings are fully built, except for Dogs and Devils, Stronghold.
Money: 1600/2350 per day, 3 heroes.
Army – 2 Ifrits, 9 Gogs, 3 dogs, and 27 demons. 3 Ifrits are available for hire

Tower
Magistrate and Master Gremlins
Money: 5630/3000, 3 heroes.
Army – 75 master gremlins and 2 gargoyles
16 master gremlins are available for hire

In the second week, as promised, Ayden arrived. Octavia with 5 Ifrits, level 2 Air magic, and Offense looked very good. But I decided to buy Ayden anyway.

The hero change moment is not critical, as the new hero usually quickly catches up with the opponent.

The task of the first week was completed perfectly:
The main military buildings were built, a strike army of 5 Ifrits was obtained, and the main hero was hired. The task of the second week is to establish a cash flow. And Inferno coped with this stage perfectly.

Ayden scouted in all directions, spies infiltrated and found out how things were going in neighboring kingdoms. Then Ayden arrived, and the empire was replenished with another city.
================
Day 131

Inferno
3 castles, and within a move – the 4th
In the city, Castle and all military buildings except for devils.
Money: 1250/4350 per day, all mines except gems and gold, 4 heroes
Ayden: 1.2.3.4 64/64
Strike army – 9 Ifrits

Tower
2 castles
The first 4 levels + Stronghold are built
Money: 23,880/5000 per day, all mines except gems and crystals, 4 heroes
Strike army: 78 gremlins

The task of the 3rd week: Capitol and Devils. Completed successfully.
===============
Day 141

Inferno
4 castles
In the city: Capitol and Devils, level 2 Magic Guild, and Dog Kennels
Available for hire – 4 Efreet and 3 Devils
Money: 17,950/8,350 per day, all mines, 4 heroes
Ayden (level 6) 1.4.4.6 98/98
Strike army: 9 Ifrits

5 heroes
In the city: Capitol, Nagas. Captured the Giants' dwelling.
Available for hire: 8 mages, 4 Nagas
Money: 31,540 / 7000 per day
Daremyth (10) 4.0.7.5 100/100
Strike army: 132 gremlins, 10 mages, 2 Nagas + giant, 21 gargoyles

The task of the 4th week: level 5 Magic Guild. Almost completed.
=================
Day 211

Inferno
3 castles
In the city: level 4 guild (Blind, Town Portal, Meteor Shower)
Ayden (8) 1.5.5.6 101/101
Strike army: 190 u-demons, 67 u-gogs, 34 u-dogs, 28 demons, 19 hellhounds, 17 Ifrits, 5 devils
Money: 150/6350, 4 heroes

Tower
3 castles
4.0.7,6 120 level 11
In the city: Giants, level 1 Guild
Available for hire 4 giants
Strike army: 258 u-gremlins, 79 gargoyles, 18 mages, 6 Nagas, 2 giants
Money: 48,090/9000, 5 heroes
================
Day 224, final battle

Ayden (10) 1.6.5.7 175/175
Expert of Fire
Army: 96 u-demons, 44 u-gogs, 33 u-dogs, 41 u-demons, 31 u-hellhounds, 21 u-Ifrits, 7 devils

Daremyth (12) 4.0.8.6 119/120
Expert of Earth
Army: 317 u-gremlins, 123+1 gargoyles, 34 mages, 14 u-genies, 10 u-titans

The battle was simple. VVV cast mass slow, and then consistently cast Antimagic on everyone. My brave soldiers slowly advanced and died, barely reaching the enemy. The titans shot down everyone in the approach.
================
So, the decisive factors of victory:
1. Titans' dwelling
2. Earth magic (mass slow + antimagic)

Conclusions:
1. Inferno worthily opposed one of the strongest castles
2. Ayden is a worthy magic hero
3. For Inferno, it is critical to have Expert Haste/Expert Cure/Expert Dispel. Therefore, it is reasonable to take heroes with a higher probability of obtaining air or water magic in the tavern.

Question: how legitimate is the outcome?
1. Schools of magic
Probabilities of obtaining schools:
Earth, Air, Water, Fire
Wizard: 3/6/3/2=14
Heretic: 4/3/2/5=14
Thus, theoretically, the probability that a Wizard will get Earth = the probability that a Heretic will get Air. The chances are equal here. But the main school will most likely be Fire for the Heretic and Air for the Wizard.

2. Spells
Probability of obtaining at Inferno/Probability of appearing at Tower
Haste 5/5
Slow 10/10
Cure 5/5
Dispel 10/10
Blind 12/2
Anti-magic 4/8
Teleport 8/8
Chain Lightning 10/10
Meteor Shower 10/10
Resurrection 10/10
Town Portal 10/10
Armageddon 5/0
Berserk 5/5
Clone 5/10
Prayer 0/5
Air Elementals 0/14
Fly 16/16
Dimension Door 16/14
Earth Elementals 16/14
Implosion 16/14
Fire Elementals 16/0
Water Elementals 0/14

Thus, the magical balance is approximately equal. It is better for Inferno heroes to take Air than Water. The second school is better to take Fire or Earth.
That is, the outcome does not demonstrate a critical disadvantage of Inferno as a race.

This is more of a coincidence or inability to play, but not a pattern.

Yeah, the outcome shows that the map generator really messed with you. :) As for your final battle, you had Titans on the Inferno side and Demons on the Tower side...

By the way, I analyzed your final battle (just out of curiosity), and here's what I found:

In terms of health: the Inferno army is in first place with 7826 HP.
The Tower army is in second place with 7662 HP.

The average damage of the Inferno army (including ranged units) is 1880.
The average damage of the Tower army (including ranged units) is 1760.

In general, the Inferno army had a slight edge over the Tower army in terms of damage and health. However, in addition to Earth Magic, the Tower also had 3 units of archers, whose damage makes up a significant portion of the total damage dealt. And, considering that the archers of Gog were already weak and in small numbers, the Inferno army had no choice but to advance, being slowed down and bombarded by the Tower's archers, and probably also by magic from the enemy Hero.

In general, KoR has already drawn the appropriate conclusion from all this... but in this case, it's striking that the Air element, which is so necessary for the Heretic, ironically has a better chance of going to his opponent... :)

By the way, why didn't you upgrade your Demons to Imps? In the final battle, these poor creatures probably didn't help much anyway... but at least you would have had 10 extra Imps. :)

By the way, why didn't you transform your Imps into Demons? In the final battle, these poor creatures probably wouldn't have been of much use anyway... but at least you would have had 10 extra Demons. :)

I would like to discuss demonology separately.
..................................
1. Demonology is not free necromancy. It costs money. And a lot of it. Let's calculate together: 1 Imp = 4 hit points. Therefore, for one Demon (35 hit points), we will need 9 Imps (9*4 = 36). But one Imp costs 50 gold, which means a Demon will cost us 450 coins!!! And the last quote for Demons on the London Stock Exchange gave us 250 euros per 1 troy ounce. It is only profitable to transform Pikemen and Gnomes into Demons – everything else will result in a loss. Apparently, Inferno has some special, extraordinary income that I missed.
2. When can we actually start practicing demonology? And at what cost? Correct, only when we build the second floor of the guild and collect 5 mercury and 5 sulfur. This means that in the second week (earlier is impossible on Impossible difficulty), all our efforts, including the Peasant, will be focused on searching for 9 mercury, 9 sulfur, 4 gems, and 4 crystals, instead of actively exploring the territory and finding new routes (a 200% difficulty game).

I can't name the author of this reasoning right now, but I agree with his words.

Sage, well, that's certainly correct, but I'm talking about the fact that he already had Hellspawn and 96 Imps at that point, which didn't really fit into the overall strategy. By the way, he could have just as easily converted the Gogs... in my opinion, they were 0.0% useful there.

In general, demonology is an expensive and, moreover, very delicate matter - resurrected demons need to be preserved, and then the opponents need to be destroyed, preferably without their help.
But still, one extra Demon is probably more beneficial than 9 Imps...

By the way, why didn't you upgrade your Imps to Demons? In the final battle, these poor creatures probably wouldn't have been of much use anyway... but at least you would have had 10 extra Demons. :)

But it still wouldn't have helped. As you calculated yourself, the armies were roughly equal, and the slowdown was the deciding factor. :)

So you don't have to spend a lot of time, I'm posting a small model that I created specifically for such cases :)

You choose the faction, set the number of units, and voila.
You're welcome. :)

...
I can't recall the author of this argument right now, but I agree with his words.

I'll join in. Demonology has potential, but it's not entirely clear.
If there are external sources for creating level 1 units, then they can be converted into demons.
But buying back troops and then converting them is tedious and not obvious.

I still haven't been able to understand the creator's intention - why is such demonology needed? :)

Sage, well, that's certainly correct, but I'm talking about the fact that he already had Hellspawn and 96 Imps at that time, which didn't really fit into the strategy. By the way, he could have just as easily converted the Gogs... in my opinion, they were 0.0% useful there.

This is just a discussion on the topic, without any particular connection to a specific game.
Of course, if there is an opportunity to convert Imps (which came with the heroes or from free recruitment) into Demons without being distracted from the main goal, then why not do it.

Sage,

By the way, they could have just as easily melted down the Gogs... in my opinion, they were 0.0% useful there.

No, brother, the Gogs fit the creator's vision. When you have external Gogs, it's great. They are average archers, but there are many of them. And their ability to hit adjacent troops is exactly what Inferno needs.

Imagine this: Inferno attacks, for example, a Fortress.
The logic of the battle is simple - the Fortress immediately gathers gnomes, dendroids, and centaurs around the elves. It places Unicorns nearby to increase magic resistance, casts Anti-Magic on the elves, and starts shooting at everything that moves. And then the Gogs start to annoy this group.

The opponent has a choice - to distract themselves with the Gogs and let the enemy get closer, or to shoot at the advancing brutes. :)

Since Inferno always tries to get close in battle, the opponent always tries to protect the archers, and the Gogs are always useful.

2 KoR

Bravo! It's been a while since we've seen such detailed online reports... :) You can tell it's the work of a master theorist... :D
If it's not a secret, where are you from?

No, brother, Gogs fit the creator's vision. When there are external Gogs, it's awesome. They are mid-tier archers, but there are many of them. And their ability to hit adjacent troops is exactly what Inferno needs.

No, I completely agree with that... :)
I'm just saying that in your battle, those 40-odd units clearly didn't make a difference... although, perhaps demons reforged from them wouldn't have helped much either.

I still haven't understood the creator's intention - why is such a demonology needed?

Well, maybe it was intended that on small maps, where there are many resources and the final battle happens relatively quickly, extra level 4 units would be very useful...