Changes to the rules starting with the letter G (Graal and Galtran). — Tournament History

Marmot

8 years ago

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If you think about a software fix for the Grail, it could be implemented so that it only provides bonuses in gold and troops, and the special bonus that depends on the city could be completely removed. That way, no one would feel disadvantaged. And it could be prohibited to establish the Grail until a certain day, depending on the size of the map.

Redwhait

8 years ago

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Before the CIS tournament, I played a match on the same mini-map where someone in Dragon Utopia got full control with a tea kettle on the second turn. There is nothing to counter that. Let's just ban control until 131, and then go completely old-school and play with a total ban on control. How does that sound? Resources and time are spent on every element of the game, whether it's a Mage Guild in Dragon Utopia or a Grail. I was amused by comments like "I'm too lazy to dig (learn), so let's ban it." If you don't know how to do something or you do it worse, that's your problem.
Nevertheless, I agree that the optimal way is to use it in a conference after building the Mage Guild.

Regarding Gosha, I have said repeatedly: until we try banning him, we won't understand anything, but the forum will be against it. There is a second option that I liked: programmatically make it so he always gets 1 stack.
Regarding Goflux, unbanning fairies and psychs, or choosing a hero—all together it would be too much. For Luna, as well as Izru + Vidu, programmatically ban the upgrade of Fire own-experience to the last level.

Allow RR on all templates
where there is trade

Wicc

8 years ago

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I remember when Goshan was completely banned from HotA, everyone felt it was their duty to criticize, saying how could they, a Necromancer, be so weak on Jebel.

And now the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction, it's amusing :).

In reply to Redwhait

Freeman

8 years ago

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Redwhait

Before the CIS tournament, I played a game on the same mini-map, where the opponent got full control with a teapot on the second island. There’s nothing to counter that. Let’s ban control until level 131, and then completely switch to the old rules and play with a control ban. What do you think? Any element of the game requires resources and time, whether it’s a grandmaster utopia or a grail. I was amused by comments like, “I’m too lazy to research (learn), so let’s ban it.” If you can’t do something or do it poorly, that’s your problem.
Nevertheless, I agree that the optimal solution is to use it in a conference after building the grandmaster.

Regarding Gosha, I’ve said many times that until we try banning him, we won’t understand anything, and the forum will be against it. There’s a second option that I liked, to programmatically give him 1 stack.
Regarding Hofluks, unbanning fairies and psychics, or allowing the choice of a hero – all together is too much. Let’s ban Luna, as well as Izru + Vidu, programmatically preventing the upgrade of fire elementals to the last level.

Allow RR on all templates
where there is trading.

Hello everyone, Zhenya, you’re a loser!! and don’t deny it)))) No need to hide behind skill)))
Regarding the grail: Don’t play SoD in HotA, everything has already been done, and if you suddenly decide to change something, just copy the principle of placing the grail from HotA.
Regarding Gosha: if you ban Gosha, then let’s ban Luna, Tanta, I would also add Grinya, listen, this is nonsense. In SoD, it’s not a fact that Gosha will get 3 stacks, yes, he’s strong, but in general, if you have a pair of infernos against a necropolis, either give 10k right away or take a regeneration with a necropolis ban, and what’s your problem?

In reply to Redwhait

HellLighT

8 years ago

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Redwhait

Before the CIS games, I played a match on the same mini-template where the opponent got full control with a teapot in a Dragon Utopia on the second day. There's nothing to counter that. Let's ban control until 131...

What nonsense is this, after such crappy writing, tons of ignoramuses think these are equivalent concepts, when was the last time you took a max-level Dragon Utopia with 4 unleveled heroes without an army? Or at least a tier 3 one? What heresy is this, to capture an object, even a Hive or a Griffin Conservatory, let alone a Dragon Utopia, you have to be resourceful, often in bad layouts you can even lose your army to them, how many times have you lost while digging? If magma elementals crawled out of the holes and gave you pimples, the question would disappear, but as it is, this is just demagoguery about luck, which you still have to earn, not just look at a puzzle picture.

scorp

8 years ago

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Is it possible to open a map in Shadow of Death mode?

positive

8 years ago

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1) It's a good idea to place the Grail only in the starting castle. But it kills the chance to balance the game if one player gets full control quickly, while the other gets neither Dragon Utopia nor control spells after 1-2 rebuilds.

In reality, the grail is not OP. It's just randomness, same as one player getting 3-4 Griffin Conservatory and the other getting 0. Same as one player getting 8 hives on Jebus Cross and the other getting 2.
It's Randomness. Whether it appears nearby or in a duplicate. Whether Kiril gets Tower or not a single warrior, while you are playing mm6a and it's already the second contact, but you have nothing to fight with.

Leave the Grail as is.

2) Gregory: yes, the man is respected, and banning him would be like cutting out an element of the game. A good idea would be to limit his necromancy to "advanced". That way, if necessary, you can take Dragon Utopia with navigation, which is also fine. But if you say Navigation isn't a hindrance—then Eagle Eye will explain everything to you.

Nerf Gregory's "Necromancer" skill. (Judging by Vidomina, this is possible).

3) Flax. It's about time to give this castle a choice of hero. Nerf Luna's fire to advanced (then taking the second tier would require 11 strength instead of 8). This will lower the tempo and the opponent will also be able to take the second tier with their own troops, rather than Luna already having 2 angels by day 4).

Nerf Luna's fire to "advanced".
Everything else as is.

In reply to scorp

Dirty_Player

8 years ago

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freesha

Regarding Gosha: if you ban Gosha, then let's ban Luna, Tanta; I would also add Grinya; listen, this is nonsense.

Seryoga, you probably didn't understand the essence of the question. Luna is already banned from the selection, but Gosha is not. The proposal is to limit the selection of Necropolis heroes. Honestly, I think it wouldn't be so bad to make the hero selection random for all Necropolis templates, similar to Conflux.

scorp

Can you open a map in HD mode?

There is a program called HDmodHackPro. I am selling a paid subscription. Write to me in PM:cool:

Added 4 minutes later

=Lizard=

Ahhhahaha. IDEA! (regarding the connection between the GM and the Grail in the Flux campaign)

We discussed such a fix in the CIS community. There was even a suggestion to use magic from the Grail to build a GM of the corresponding level in any city (similar to scrolls), but opinions were divided. In general, I like this limitation. Let the Tower remain as it is; at least the miners will have some joy.

In reply to HellLighT

kamukag3e

8 years ago

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HellLight

What nonsense, after such terrible writing tons of ignoramuses think these are equivalent concepts, when was the last time you took a max Dragon Utopia with 4 unleveled heroes without an army? or at least a triple? what heresy is this, to take an object, even a Hive or Griffin Conservatory, not to mention a Dragon Utopia, you need to get clever, often in bad layouts you can even lose to them, while you were digging did you lose much? if magma elementals crawled out of the holes and gave you god-mode the question would disappear, but as it is it's just demagoguery about luck, which you still have to work for, not just look at a puzzle picture.

HellLight I respect you, but regarding the Grail you are wrong. It's about the time spent digging, not comparing skill points spent on taking Dragon Utopias, Hives, and Griffin Conservatories compared to digging the Grail. Yes, indeed the Grail can be dug up in 1 day by 1 hero in 1 attempt. And everyone has seen this repeatedly on streams. The last time I saw Yar dig it up in 1 day by 1 hero in 1 attempt. Maybe I'm crooked-handed, but here's an example

where I dug the Grail with 7 heroes for a week and a half, and managed to dig it up exactly 1 turn before the opponent broke through the GY on SM and attacked my castle, the presence of Grindan and 200 mana and the Grail decided the outcome of the battle.
I haven't played much on HeroesWorld, but in those games where the Grail was dug up, not always did the one who dug the Grail win.
1. Dan_Choi on Jebus Cross places the Grail in native Conflux, but Crag at that point is far ahead in stats and already has full control (not a representative example)
2. Sonic111 places the Grail in Tower on SM, but it doesn't help, because in tempo I was ahead of him by exactly one day and killed the hero and army.
3. I myself on SM playing Castle with Müllich having an Angel external dwelling place the Grail in Conflux and lose to Benis_xDD, because the time spent digging is not equal to the time the opponent spent on demoning and gaining stats.
4. The only time I dug the Grail in the second week in 1 day with the third hero and placed it again in Conflux, but at that point no hero had leveled Earth and Expert Wisdom.
Conclusion: on small maps the time lost digging the Grail can be critical compared to the time the opponent spends on power-stacking. On large maps, provided the game drags on, the Grail can have an impact, but try finding it first.
P.s. a question for the dads: in the picture with a bunch of holes, where do you think the Grail ended up (at the moment of the screenshot the Grail is not yet dug up)?

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In reply to kamukag3e

Dirty_Player

8 years ago

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kamukag3e

P.s. question for the "daddies": in the picture with a bunch of holes, where do you think the Grail ended up (at the time of the screenshot, the Grail hadn't been dug up yet)?

Either below or to the left of the fairies' hiding place.

In reply to Dirty_Player

kamukag3e

8 years ago

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Dirty_Player

Either below or to the left of the fairy's hiding spot.

Both assumptions are incorrect.

In reply to kamukag3e

Juristis

8 years ago

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kamukag3e

Both assumptions are incorrect.

The upper right corner. Well, I mean, the corner of the excavation site.

Redwhait

8 years ago

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In the lower corner, next to the fairy hideout, or above the topmost excavated area.

In reply to Juristis

kamukag3e

8 years ago

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Juristis

Top right corner. Well, that is, the corner of the excavation site.

Again, incorrect, and many think that it's easy to dig up the Grail.

Added after 55 seconds

Redwhait

In the bottom corner, below the fairy hideout, or above the very top excavated area.

The bottom corner is incorrect; the second assumption is close.

In reply to Redwhait

Dirty_Player

8 years ago

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In general, the screenshots are very revealing, in the sense that any newcomer can easily find the location of the Grail by looking at just one obelisk. How many attempts it will take him to capture it is a matter of chance – sometimes it takes 20 tries, and sometimes just 1. Personally, I wouldn't want to be in the opponent's shoes and have to test it out.

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