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Posts from Balance in Heroes 5.

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In reply to Snowball
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Snowball;89742
If I remember correctly, the main schools of magic for the Academics are Summoning and Light, so you can only get Armageddon with a library, and even then, if you're lucky. Well, okay, you got lucky and have Armageddon.

Here are a couple of options on how to defeat the Elf:
1) The simplest option is for the Archers to be eliminated before the Academy hero's turn with Armageddon. By the beginning of the 3rd week, Ossir will have 35-40 of them, and they can definitely take out 40 Gargoyles if they're lucky (which the Elves upgrade early and works often) or the Gargoyles are in Cursed and the ability triggers (and if a lucky attack from a Cursed enemy happens... it's devastating).
2) Option number two - Unique units. We build Unique units in the 2nd week (sometimes even in the 1st, if the city is already somewhat built up at the beginning) and place them on the battlefield next to other units. With the Magic Resistance ability (Luck branch), the chance that Armageddon will be deflected is approximately 45% (30% from the Unique units and 15% from the ability). Then, follow option number one.
3) Anti-Magic :) - why shouldn't the Elf build a guild to at least level 4 if the Academic has built it to level 5 (the chance of getting it is 50%)? We cast Anti-Magic on the same Archers and that's it.
There are other options, but I won't list them all. That's enough for now.
Regarding the Training for Heven - the statement that it has been nerfed is debatable. Yes, now you can train a maximum of 20 units per week... but the price... is twice as low, which means many, many more Inquisitors and Paladins instead of a bunch of Crossbowmen. It's simply a transition from quantity to quality. The Necromancers have the same situation, although they now depend heavily on neutral creatures.
They won't give you Armageddon, but they will give you a Phoenix, the probability is much higher than with Armageddon, anti-magic won't help, and neither will the archers, nothing will help against the Phoenix. If they don't give you a Phoenix, I'll make a Shield for the Gargoyles and attack enemies with Shock or weaker spells if Shock and Armageddon aren't available. Regarding your first idea with the archers, it's not going to work. Do you think I'm going to put all the Gargoyles in one stack? I'll divide them into seven stacks, and while you're trying to kill them, you'll be gone
Тот, кто находит удовольствие в уединении, либо дикий зверь, либо Бог (с) Аристотель

:smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24:
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To Lord Vampire: It's foolish to think that you can constantly win with the same tactic. You might win once, but the next time, they'll use a counter-tactic, for example, 2 skills with +15% resistance + unicorns. The shock will only go through one out of four times, and if you consider your army and your opponent's, you're guaranteed to lose. Furthermore, no one prevents you from recruiting neutral heroes, like Imps. No one stops you from attacking with 3 level 5 heroes with the same lightning spell before the main hero attacks. You'll either have to spend mana to quickly kill them in 7 slots, or you'll lose gargoyles, etc. As they say, for every clever trick, there's a counter-trick.
In reply to Lord Vampire
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Lord Vampire;89838
Armageddon won't be given, but they will give Phoenix; the probability is much higher than with Armageddon. Antimagic won't help, and neither will archers. Nothing will help against Phoenix. If they don't give Phoenix, I'll make a Shield for the Gargoyles and attack enemies with Shock or weaker spells if Shock and Armageddon aren't available. Regarding your first idea with archers, it's not viable. Do you think I'll put Gargoyles in one stack? I'll divide them into seven stacks, and while you're trying to kill them, you'll be gone. :)
A very interesting approach to the matter. So, you're going to attack elven archers with only Gargoyles? And you're going to divide them into seven stacks? I'm curious, are you considering a hypothetical situation where you only have Gargoyles and Snezhok only has archers?:cool:
In reply to Archer
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Archer;89854
What an interesting approach! So, you're going to attack the elven archers with only Gargoyles? Are you planning to split them into 7 stacks? I'm curious, are you considering a hypothetical situation where you only have Gargoyles and Snow King only has archers?:cool:
Probably, he will attack with only Gargoyles if he has Armageddon. But even then, not in the final battle.
In reply to Lord Vampire
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Lord Vampire;89838
They won't give you Armageddon, but they will give you Phoenix; the probability is much higher than with Armageddon. Anti-magic won't help, and neither will archers. There's nothing that can help against Phoenix. If they don't give me Phoenix, I'll create a Shield for the Gargoyles and attack enemies with Shock or weaker spells if Shock and Armageddon aren't available. Regarding your first idea with archers, it's not viable. Do you think I'll put Gargoyles in one stack? I'll divide them into seven stacks, and while you're trying to kill them, you'll be gone. :)

Well, you got Phoenix. :) Do you really think it will defeat my troops before I defeat yours? Or am I supposed to, like a newbie, immediately attack it with all my forces? :) It's a summoned creature, and as soon as the main army dies, it will disappear on its own. :) And don't tell me that's unlikely. :)
Regarding the Shield... interesting. :) Will you also divide the Gargoyles into 7 stacks with it? And then cast it on each stack? :) In any case, it only absorbs 50% of the damage. And how will you attack me with weaker spells if I have Anti-Magic? If there's no Anti-Magic, I still have Unique units, and the ability to resist spells, so your spells will hit with a 50% chance. Or maybe I'll get 5th level Resurrection in my guild. :) You kill the archers, and I resurrect them (while other units calmly destroy the Gargoyles). Or, let's say, those same 7 stacks of Gargoyles, and I have them as Cursed Ones and the ability "Arrow Shower." The hero will attack all 7 stacks in one turn. How many turns will your units last if my units are also attacking them? :) We also have a hero named Wingael, who gives a bonus to initiative at the start, 2% per level. A few times, use the tactic "Hit and run to the city," and that's it. :) No more Gargoyles. Just take archers and druids in his army, divide them into 7 stacks, and attack. Before your hero goes, all my archers will attack. After that, I simply buy my way out, and the hero with his unit ends up in the city, where he can be recruited again. Considering that the archer unit isn't very large on the 3rd week, and I'll definitely build a Capitol, I'll have enough money for this. :) Of course, there are also "War Chains," but you still have to find them. :)

There are many options. You just need to know how to play your race. :)
And one more question for you, how many games have you played on the "Heroes of Might and Magic" series? Or have you only tried fighting with friends? Or have you only fought against the computer? No offense. Just answer honestly.
Белый и Пушистый! Иногда.....
In reply to Snowball
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Snowball;89949
Well, you got a Phoenix:) Do you really think it will defeat my troops before I defeat yours?) Or should I, as a newbie, immediately attack it with all my forces?:) It's a summoned creature:) and as soon as the main army dies, it will disappear on its own:). And don't tell me that's unlikely:)
Regarding the Shield... interesting:) will you also divide your Gargoyles into 7 stacks with it? and then cast it on each stack?:) In any case, it only absorbs 50% of the damage. And how will you attack me with weaker creatures if I have Antimagic? If there is no Antimagic, I still have Unique units and a resistance skill, so your spells will hit with a 50% chance. Or maybe my guild will give me 5th level Resurrection:) you kill the same archers - I resurrect them (while other units calmly destroy the Gargoyles). Or, let's say, those same 7 stacks of Gargoyles:) and I have them as cursed units and have the Arrow Shower skill:) The hero will attack all 7 stacks in one turn:) how many turns will your units last? if my units also attack them?:) We also have another non-Hive hero named Winghael, he gives a bonus to initiative at the start, and 2% per level. Do a couple of "hit and run to the city" maneuvers, and that's it:) no more Gargoyles. Just give him archers and druids in his army, divide them into 7 stacks, and attack). Before your hero takes a turn, all my archers will attack:) after which I simply buy my way out, and the hero with the unit ends up in the city, where he is hired again:) Considering that the archer unit is not very large on the 3rd week, and I will definitely build a Capitol somehow:) then I will have enough money for this:) Of course, there are Chains of War:) but you still have to find them:)

There are many options:) You just need to know how to play your race:)
And one more question for you, how many games have you played on the Heroes of Might and Magic series? Or have you only tried fighting with friends? Or have you only fought against the computer? No offense. Just answer honestly.

Regarding the options, there are always many for any race,:) but what's the point of arguing, you can talk about this forever and provide arguments from each side:) It would be possible to test it in practice, but I don't have that opportunity:) Online games are not affordable for me:( I haven't played on UBI:( I play Heroes against my friends:) Playing against the computer is pointless, it's dumber than the dumbest person who knows how to play Heroes:D

2 ICE
With which other 3 heroes are you going to attack my army before attacking the main one?:confused: You forgot, I'm attacking him, not the other way around:) The attack happens on the 3rd week, he doesn't even think I'm going to attack him:D and if he gets caught far from the castle, not having time to buy an army from the castle, then he's doomed,:smile34: :smile13: and you're talking about attacking with three heroes!

2 Archer & Boris K
I'm not going to attack anyone with Gargoyles,:) they are in my defense, I will only attack with the hero's creatures:) I would also like to add that if I don't get Armageddon, I will also put Gremlins in the army, and I will have 150 of them by that time if I get Hafiz:)
Тот, кто находит удовольствие в уединении, либо дикий зверь, либо Бог (с) Аристотель

:smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24:
In reply to Lord Vampire
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Lord Vampire;90042

2 ICE
With which other 3 heroes are you planning to attack my army before attacking the main one?:confused: You forgot that I'm attacking him, not the other way around.:D The attack happens on the 3rd week; he doesn't even think I'm going to attack him:D And if he happens to be far from his castle and hasn't had time to buy another army, he's doomed,:smile34: :smile13: and you're here saying to attack with three heroes....
I meant specifically the situation when you're going to attack a castle. Anyway, this argument is pointless; it's like waving your fists at each other while being in different rooms and shouting about how hard you're hitting. Regarding online games, if you don't have the opportunity, ask your friends; surely someone has access. And even better, participate in some tournament; you'll discover a lot of interesting things ;)
In reply to ICE
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ICE;90044
Or even better, participate in a tournament; you'll discover a lot of interesting things. ;)
And I've already done that, as I've played in about ten tournaments, both for Heroes of Might and Magic V and Heroes of Might and Magic IV. I don't do very well in Heroes of Might and Magic IV, but if I work on it a little more, I might be able to achieve something in Heroes of Might and Magic V. :D
Тот, кто находит удовольствие в уединении, либо дикий зверь, либо Бог (с) Аристотель

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I've been reading what people are writing here about balance—my jaw practically hit the floor! Think about it yourself, dwarves are CHEATING! Simply put, their troops are incredibly hardy (don't even argue), their racial abilities are unreally cool—readiness, both herds, pyrokinesis—basically all their abilities are overkill, rune magic in the late game giving insane bonuses (resurrecting 40% of a living stack twice), building costs (for example, 8000 for the capitol instead of the standard 10000), the tower providing absolute invulnerability when fighting in the castle and, as a finale—dragons with unreal attack/defense and 280!!! health. Regarding balance, I can say that it feels like some races were created exclusively for rushing, while others are for the long game (that's what being tailored to specific maps means).
P.S. Demons and necro rule (Deleb, Kaspar and Vladimir are invincible super-wonder friends!)
In reply to elrocodelcasto
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elrocodelcasto;98970
I read what people are writing here about the balance, and I was shocked! Think about it: Dwarves are just cheating! Their troops are incredibly durable (don't even argue), their racial abilities are unrealistically cool – preparedness, both Hirdu, pyrokinesis – basically, all their abilities are devastating, runic magic at the end of the game, giving incredible bonuses (resurrection twice for 40% of the living stack), the cost of buildings (as an example, 8000 for the Capitol instead of the standard 10000), the Tower, which provides undeniable invulnerability during battles in the castle, and, as a finale, dragons with unreal attack/defense and 280!!! hit points. As for the balance, I can say that it feels like some races are created exclusively for rushing, while others are for long games (being tailored for maps – that's what it means).
P.S. Demons and Necromancers rule (Deleb, Kaspar, and Vladimir are invincible super-awesome buddies!)
So, in your opinion, there is no balance?! Judging by your reasoning about the Dwarves. As for the dragons, their attack isn't that strong, but :) the fire shield and strong armor compensate for it. I agree about runic magic; it's too powerful, but it requires resources. But other races also have their advantages... so everything is more or less in order


Барон
"Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!



In reply to elrocodelcasto
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elrocodelcasto;98970
I read what people are writing here about the balance, and I was shocked! Think about it: Dwarves are just cheating! Their troops are incredibly durable (don't even argue), their racial abilities are unrealistically powerful – readiness, both Hirdu, pyrokinesis – basically, all their abilities are devastating, runic magic towards the end of the game, giving incredible bonuses (resurrection of 40% of living creatures twice), the cost of buildings (for example, 8000 for the Capitol instead of the standard 10000), the Tower, which provides undeniable invulnerability during battles in the castle, and, as a finale, dragons with unreal attack/defense and 280!!! hit points. As for the balance, I can say that it feels like some races are created exclusively for rushing, while others are for a long game (being tailored for maps – that's what it means).
P.S. Demons and Necromancers are the best (Deleb, Kaspar, and Vladimir are invincible super-awesome buddies!).
Regarding Deleb, Kaspar, and Vladimir, you're right, and you're also right about the Dwarves. I agree with you that they are overpowered, but when I play against them as Necromancers, I still win. The main weakness of the Dwarves is that they can't do anything against the Phoenix, which I easily defeat them with. Demons have Pit Lords, Necromancers have Harbingers, Dungeons have enhanced Shock, Mages have Banish, and Life and High Elves also don't have anything against the Phoenix.:smile24:
Тот, кто находит удовольствие в уединении, либо дикий зверь, либо Бог (с) Аристотель

:smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24::smile24:
In reply to Lord Vampire
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I'll be honest with you: in my opinion, the balance is practically non-existent (read: a complete mess). If before, my beloved Necropolis with Vlad or Chaos with Deleb (my favorite hero:smile14:) dominated everything, now they've been joined by the Dwarves with their invincible dragons and first-level infantry:smile07:. Now, let's get down to business. Everyone is focusing on my comment about the Dwarves, but they're ignoring what's below it (before P.S.). If you look at all the factions, you can see that some (Dark Elves, Silver Cities, and Chaos with Deleb) are designed for early attacks on the opponent (while there are few enemies and the magic of Chaos/summoning/ballista deals relatively high damage), while others are designed for a long game (Necropolis, Dwarves, maybe Humans), where their pure strength and military bonuses will outweigh any magic, or, as in the case of the Necropolis, control over minds/berserker (the latter is better) + 1k skeleton archers will overwhelm the enemy with the size of their and the enemy's army. I'm not including the Elves because I don't like playing as them because they simply annoy me:smile35: :smile35: :smile35: (no offense to those who play as them).
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2 elro First, a few clarifications. The Rune restores 40% of the KILLED creatures in the stack, not from the initial number. Also, the 1k archers in the latest patches are no longer relevant for balance; they are not there.

Now, about the balance. Inferno is one of the weakest Castles. There is Deleб, but that is the hero's strength, not the Castle's. If you play without it (and often it is banned in tournaments), you get an incredibly difficult start right from the first days and an inability to fight on equal terms in the final stages, from weeks 4-7.

Next, about the Dwarves. They are strong in defense, when defending the Castle. And then what? They are very vulnerable to rushing. The option of sitting in the Castle is a utopia, because your territory will be taken over, and the rush will turn into a regular attack, but with an overwhelming advantage in forces, and then even a Tower won't help. Again, a very difficult start, especially without the Rune of Energy, while any archers/casters become a death sentence for the army. The race is very focused on defense; you need to get magic of light with good spells, etc. Although the Armageddon build is also possible, but it is unpleasant because it depends on a lucky spell and a Rune of Resistance. Yes, there is a cheaper construction of economic buildings, but the cost of building creatures is very high, mainly due to the large demand for crystals and gems (thank you, patch 2.1, because in 2.0 it was possible to build anything). Dragons? You still have to survive until then, and their parameters are quite compensated by the "elemental" property; you can't cast "resurrection" on them, although you can't cast "enslave" either, but it depends on who you are playing against.

Yes, there are races that are effective in rushing, and there are those that will dominate in a long game. But that doesn't mean that the former will always win against the latter (which, in the absence of balance, would be a 100% probability). So, in general, the balance in Heroes is excellent and is improving from patch to patch.

P.S. Although most people tend to believe that the Shadow League is superior to the others
Тьма - это то, что позволяет смертным не забывать, как ярок бывает свет.
In reply to Alan
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Alan;99065
P.S. Although most people tend to believe that the Dungeon faction is superior to the others.
Alan explained everything correctly, but it wasn't necessary to go into so much detail, IMO. The voting (post #1) shows that there is balance!
As for the Dungeon faction:
1) Its units have exceptional survivability, but this is offset by their low production rate and high cost.
2) The popularity of the Dark Dragon.
3) Enhanced offensive spells.
P.S. But in online practice:smile13: these advantages lose some of their significance!:smile42:
In reply to Alex_R
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Let's take it one step at a time:
1) Dwarf buildings are just cheat-level cheap.
2) The start for Dwarves is decent (shooters are already available at level 2, infantry almost never dies on its own, and the supply wagon compensates for the low ammo count of the shooters)
3) When playing on large maps, Dwarves have a clear advantage over everyone (except Necropolis)
4) Even 40% of those killed twice in a row toward the end of a game on a large map is not small at all.
I agree regarding the rush; that's the only way to get through to them. Only usually a proper rush doesn't work out, so you have to just hunker down (or gradually increase the skeleton population via reincarnation with a magical kick in the pants=))
P.S. Dungeon rules, especially Sinitar, but it's very difficult to manage the troops; only the hydras are hardy, the rest die like flies (it's almost a pity), and Deleb is what turns demons into a combat-ready army.

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