Posts from Which came first: matter or spirit?

I repeat: NO, it is not officially REGISTERED or obtained as a result of HUNDREDS of mutation experiments that led to a change in species. It's a mutated dog, but still a dog. And you can't just attach wings to it. It's a mutated butterfly, but still a butterfly, not a dragonfly. The gap has NEVER been overcome. That's it. And evolution needs exactly THAT, not minor changes.
By the way, gentlemen atheists. You appeared from stone and water. There were stones, and it rained... then many years passed... and here you are. Remember! Stones + Helium + Hydrogen and ordinary laws of physics. And here you are. :(

What about your grandparents? How strong were their bones? As far as I know, pathologies are passed down through generations, including positive ones, although less often!
As for the spirit (or soul), I'm not sure if I have much of my ancestors in me, although there probably is, but these qualities have adapted to the surrounding world so much that they seem to be my individual traits.

I don't remember my grandfathers at all (they died before I was born), and my grandmothers now suffer from various growths on their legs and pain in them.

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I repeat: NO, and it is NOT officially REGISTERED or obtained as a result of HUNDREDS of experiments with mutations that led to a change in species. A mutated dog, but still a dog. And you can't attach wings to it. A mutated butterfly, but still a butterfly, not a dragonfly. The gap has NEVER been overcome. That's it. And evolution needs exactly THAT, not changes at a minor level.
By the way, gentlemen atheists. You appeared from stone and water. There were stones, and it rained... then many years passed... and here you are. Remember! Stones + Helium + Hydrogen and ordinary laws of physics. And here you are. :(

Yes, that's exactly it!:smile47: :D

As far as I know, pathologies are passed down through generations, including positive ones, although less frequently!

Just a small correction – pathologies are never positive; it's almost a synonym for diseases. Hereditary (meaning harmful mutations) don't necessarily get passed down through generations, although this often happens...

I consider myself an example of positive mutations (I'm not a Ninja Turtle). My dad has quite fragile bones. Mine, on the other hand, are quite strong (I've never complained) and I've never broken anything, even though others have broken bones in similar situations:smile47:.

Don't confuse it; this is already genetics, pure genetics. I'm sure that your mom, grandmothers, grandfathers, or great-grandparents also had strong bones.

Don't confuse it; this is already genetics, pure genetics. I'm sure that mom, grandmothers, grandfathers, or great-grandparents also had strong bones.

Vupor didn't see it. He fell from 4 meters and broke his arm (dad), stepped on it wrong and broke it again, started lifting a considerable weight, holding his hand incorrectly, and broke it again (grandfather). I'm a mutant, no doubt!:smile47:

Aaa, Iskmens on the forum!!!

Any thought is material in nature, therefore I believe that matter came first.

I believe that as soon as matter appears, the spirit immediately "enters" it (though "enters" isn't quite the right word).

Any thought is material in nature, so I believe that matter came first.

Here, it seems they are not talking about thought, but about the spirit, which exists calmly, exists... And thought exists only in the brain.
P.S. I read that some mathematician-priest was able to derive some intricate formula and prove that the probability of God's existence is 60% (I became curious myself). Does anyone know anything about this?

Read everything - it hit me hard, like I've just smoked a joint. Next time I want a rush, I'll read this thread again. Especially the part about astral codes.

The soul is either immaterial, or it weighs 29 grams (experiments have proven that after death, all people are lighter by this mass).

No wonder, because after death the sphincter relaxes and the contents fall straight into the pants - 29 grams of excrement are lost. There's your soul for you. Am I a heretic? Burn me at the stake now.
But still, a bit of toilet humor probably won't hurt this topic.
Generally, this is a matter of religion. Since I am an atheist, for me there is no omnipotent little god, no heaven, no hell, no "past life," no ghost-girls made of ectoplasm who scare people at the site of their violent death because they weren't buried (essentially - crazed spirits of bodies rotting not in a coffin a couple of meters underground, but in a ditch).
And therefore - matter. Agi is right: everything a human has is not a mystical soul and the notorious spirit, but consciousness. Essentially - a special structure of neurons, views formed on the basis of life experience, blah-blah-blah. Animals have it too. It's just that they are stupider than humans in and of themselves. Their brains are less convoluted. And smaller in size. Does that mean their "spirit" is stupider?
And "matter" is by no means only that which is perceived by the sense organs, as some have written here shortsightedly and naively. Matter is everything. It is everything existent in this world. Radio waves cannot be touched, seen/smelled/heard, but they exist - and that is a fact. And in physics, they are also considered matter. Consciousness is also matter. A kind of bio-currents of the brain that constitute the mind.
When a person dies, they don't go to heaven/Valhalla/the Valley of the Gods. They just die. They were - and now they aren't. And their body remains lying where it was buried. And rotting. After some time, even the possible memory of the person will disappear. End of story. People invented paradise, reincarnation, ghosts flying around the world only for consolation. The realization that they will die forever is terrible to them. So they soothe themselves with illusions. And they invent gods. Like there is someone who will help in trouble, and he will definitely punish the fat ones after death for gluttony.
Regarding the falsity of the theory of evolution - gods are also people, right? They supposedly create people in their own image and likeness. Well, if we ignore the fact that they are incorporeal "beings beyond the veil."
Now then, when did the first human appear? A long time ago. Who was he? A subject with a heavy jaw and brow ridges? Lacking speech?
Primitive? It turns out that God himself, creating people in his own image, specifically Adam, swung a club? Because you cannot deny, you Christians, that Adam certainly wasn't cruising in a car; there were no technologies back then.
And now people get tattoos and wear jeans. What about God? Did he change along with people? First he wore a fig leaf and a club, then - a toga, sandals, and a trident, now - a man-bag, sneakers, and a cap? Or did he not change? Does he still carry a club and a leaf? And have prominent brow ridges? Doesn't this mean that people have strayed from the canon? Either people evolved and the Lord couldn't keep up, meaning he is underdeveloped, a degenerate; or people mutated from the ideal into genetic freaks?
Then it's not surprising that, in essence, we are all victims of global incest in the Christian perception. Everyone descended from Adam. From Adam and his rib. That is - mixed, shuffled genes of the same person. Smacks of narcissism, don't you think?
So what does that leave us with? It turns out incest is the key to success? Right? God created many animals. All sorts of different ones. But only one human. Yet animals remain animals, while humans become more and more perfect. Or perhaps, it turns out that evolution is, in essence, degradation? And degradation and incest are perfection, evolution, development?
And this is just one religion out of thousands around the world. And already it's bursting at the seams upon detailed study.
So attacks on Darwin's theory are just empty speculations like "what if" and "why."
And therefore. The world is arranged this way, and it will be a long time before we understand it. Maybe we will never even know when it began its existence, relative to what it exists, whether the Universe ends anywhere, how life arose, why everything is exactly this way and not otherwise, where a black hole leads, if there is a parallel reality, what the nature of ball lightning is, why aliens perform anal probing on humans...
Though, the last one is much easier to determine than the previous points... just catch a specimen alive...
But one thing is clear - the absence of gods is much easier to prove than their presence.
PS Experiments to create life are doomed to failure from the start. I understand, of course, that it is very easy to find out that some Explosion occurred 300 billion years ago, I can instantly determine which compounds and substances were involved at that moment, it's all very easy to detect. Isn't it?! There is so much evidence for this. For example, the theory of some scientist...
But has it never occurred to anyone that at that time something was different? How is it? Everything tends toward Chaos? Doesn't this mean that some elements could simply have disappeared over such a huge period of time, or transitioned into another quality? And, surely, the physical constants of the Universe were far from always being as they are now. Like on our planet. Maybe a vacuum is needed, a special temperature, or who knows what else. I understand, of course, that scientists are capable of much, but I am interested in the very nature of the conjectures about the Big Bang. Where did such a theory come from? And what did the explosion arise from? From a gray void? And what is a void?
PPS All these things only blow the mind, and therefore one should stick to the most reliable knowledge available today, if you don't want to fall into illusion and self-deception. Right now, that is atheism and science.
PPPS The Pope believes in and officially recognizes the existence of aliens.
And were they created by their own god? In his own image and likeness?

P.S. All these things just mess with your mind, so you should stick to the most reliable knowledge available today, if you don't want to fall into illusion and self-deception. Right now, that is atheism and science.

Correction: even this knowledge is far from reliable, so it's better not to think about all these things at all, but stick only to those facts in which you are 100% sure.

Correction – even this knowledge is far from reliable, so it's best not to think about any of these things at all, and stick only to the facts in which you are 100% certain.

I disagree with that. Even pondering something you can't solve makes you smarter. IMHO.
I agree with Locken.
There's also a thought that religion wasn't created as a cult for some god who spoke to someone. That is, it was originally conceived simply as an invention to make life easier, and what we see now is just the result of the interpretation of religion, which is understandable to the masses. Indeed, it's easier to live as a slave, to endure various unpleasant things and see how the master enjoys life, and think, "Well, it doesn't matter, I will enjoy eternity in paradise, and you will suffer in hell. Eternity is longer than life!" Now, faith still helps people who believe. If they don't go crazy, they become quite balanced and pleasant people.
Another thought is that all believers create a colossal energy that helps them.