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Posts from CIS-2014 in Minsk.

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In reply to =Stinger=
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Offline PReDS
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#168
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I already wrote that there are 2-3 decent symmetrical templates besides h3dm1, a couple of which are fast-paced. Jebus Cross is a bit rough, but tournaments are needed to introduce them. I’ll clarify right away that I’m no tournament organizer. Vic is fixated on pushing Demoniac, while Kostya on ВТ is busy with his favorite Jebus Cross.

Running a tournament exclusively on symmetrical templates isn’t viable: you get just as burned out on them, and after two games in a row (like GoD and I did in Odessa), you feel the urge to switch to something else.
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Offline Javdet
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#169
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Mirror Jebus Cross exists - but hasn't caught on, and is unlikely to catch on due to objective reasons
Даже если вас съели - у вас два выхода:smile19:

Зима 2011-12.
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Offline Dirty_Player
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#170
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Javdet
You too. You haven't even tried it, but you're already complaining.
I haven't tried it, not because I don't want to, but because at this stage, SOD is much more interesting to me than Warlord Tactics. I even declined to host 2v2 matches on mirrored maps in favor of SOD, which resulted in a larger number of participants.

And if we are going to push mirrored maps, we could try creating a mirrored Skirmish on S maps and with 200% speed. That should be a hit!!
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Offline Javdet
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#171
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Dirty_Player
I haven't tried it, not because I don't want to, but because at this stage, SOD (Simultaneous Order of Development) is much more interesting to me than VT (Variable Turn Order). I even declined to host 2v2 matches on mirrored maps in favor of SOD and, as a result, more participants.

And if we are going to push mirrored maps, we could try creating a mirrored Skirmish on S maps and with 200% resources. That should be a hit!!
It's quite possible that it will be successful, but who will do it?
Regarding hex maps – I'm not sure yet when a random game becomes interesting, starting from the 3rd or 4th day of the game. We've played enough with the Year map to confidently say that the template is excellent.
Даже если вас съели - у вас два выхода:smile19:

Зима 2011-12.
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Offline PReDS
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#172
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Javdet
It might work out, but who's going to make it?
As for Hexaggio - I'm not sure yet where on random the game becomes interesting from day 3-4. We've played With God enough to confidently say that the template is awesome.
Rom, the question is different: earlier the TE/HotA community acted as (let's not get beaten up too badly) the vanguard of Heroes online, promoted new templates, not all endeavors were successful, but it was something. And now: SoD players are actively mastering new templates, introducing new ideas, while HotA players are fixated on Jebus Cross and are happy with everything.
Javdet
Mirror Jebus Cross exists - but it didn't catch on, and is unlikely to catch on due to objective reasons
I didn't write that it doesn't exist - it was and is, but neither the first version nor the revised one is particularly playable.
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Offline Javdet
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#173
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For now, the discussion is pointless, as there are very few people in the thread. I'll keep bumping the thread, and I hope to find 16 people who want to try something new.
Даже если вас съели - у вас два выхода:smile19:

Зима 2011-12.
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Offline Redwhait
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#174
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One mirror game shouldn't be made, as was already said above.
And even on a mirror, the element of randomness is also great, but it gets boring after a couple of games.
There's no point in coming up with something new and raw for this Sng. For the next mirror skirmish and refined Jebus Cross, it's already possible to try.
If in the HD mod it is truly possible to implement money transfer, then trading for a version could really become a solution.

Another possibility is to refine the King of the Hill version; when interests clash, this option could work: the PvP player from all SoD templates leaves 1-2 SoD ones, and the opponent decides which one to play
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Offline PReDS
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#175
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Javdet
For now, the conversation is pointless, as there are very few people in the thread. I'll keep pushing for it, and I hope to find 16 people who want to try something new.
Nah, you probably won't find them. Jebusoids don't need it, some are busy, some are taking a break from Heroes: there are no new players, and there's nothing to attract them with, and without a fresh influx of players, nothing will work out.
In the past, you could promote it by saying that VT players are more skilled, but now the skill level has evened out.
Who has joined VT from the new players? Graf_Baranov and that's it, it seems, in the last year.
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Offline =Lizard=
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#176
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No one ever commented on the coin toss in the "SoD player vs VT player" match based on the principle of either "pure SoD" or "VT under SoD".

p.s. For the record, I only organized 1 Jebus Cross tournament. And according to all reviews, it was awesome. Later there were equal MM6/Mirror/Jebus games, and the matches played specifically on Mirror decided the tournament. And now a tournament on MM6 200% also turned out to be fresh, in demand, and interesting. So there's no need for groundless talk about "Jebus-obsessing" here.

p.p.s. I liked Hexaga too, but I'm not bringing it up for real discussion here, because everything is basically heading toward burying VT in the same grave.
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Offline Dark
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#178
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Chingis
ALL serious tournaments should be played only on mirror maps.
if, of course, the goal is to identify the strongest, and not the luckiest. :)

How can an event be called a sport if, for example, one team enters the football field with 11 players, including a goalkeeper, and the second team enters with 7 players WITHOUT a goalkeeper? :)

It's a pity that HD Mode doesn't have such a template ...
you are comparing things incorrectly. In football, according to player purchase statistics, one team has spent 1 billion, while the other has spent 1 million, even though during the match between them, the number of players, referees, goals, and balls is exactly the same; the result is predetermined and so is the advantage. So don't give me that—a game is always more correct when it's in its original version, not reworked into something else—and that's SoD!:smile14:

лето 2012.
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Offline Сатир
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#179
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Tuesday should be reserved for mirror matches and GM adjustments for HL+U. Otherwise, it's a relic of the past, like TE.
The main settings should be tailored for SoD, even on these templates.
Не бійся коли ти один, бійся коли ти нуль.

484800548

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Offline PReDS
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#181
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Lizard B
No one has commented on the coin flip in the "Sodovets - Wtshnik" match, deciding whether it's either a "pure SoD" or "WT under SoD"....
Commenting (softening): it's not an option.
"WT under SoD" is a fairy tale about a white bull invented for VLC, Duba, and others, and promoted by them. At the same time, WT glitches (purely WT glitches that don't exist in SoD) won't disappear.

You're too lazy to remember (or rather, to re-learn SoD), but what incentive do SoD players have to learn WT? A kilometer has already been written about the project's prospects.

The only acceptable option is this: a pair agrees to play a mirror match - they play on WT, if not - they use standard templates and play on SoD. If a pair of WT players agrees, they play WT, but not on the monstrous limits you specified.
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Offline =Lizard=
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#182
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2Darkello etc.: Football in its original form lacked the offside rule, basketball didn't have the three-second zone, Formula 1 cars were extremely unsafe for drivers, and so on. Was all of this correct?

Is it correct to start with 1 or 3 stacks? Is it correct to have 50+% of the spells needed for victory in a single element? Is the classic SOD-style diplomacy correct?... You can continue this list for a very long time, and the only answer is the well-known "SOD is evolving, while WOTN is not." A very "cool" argument. Well, it's up to you. Indeed, the strongest and most right-minded people have always been in the absolute minority.

At the end of February, I will specifically discuss all the details with the base – right now, I was told that "it's still too early, a lot can change." Starting in mid-February, we will begin registration for participants/viewers/cooks.
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Offline PReDS
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#184
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Lizard B
Is it correct to start with 1 or 3 stacks? Is it correct to have 50%+ of the spells needed for a win in a single school? Is diplomacy correct in its classic SoD form?... One could go on for a very long time, and the only answer is the infamous "SoD evolves, but WT doesn't." A very "cool" argument. Well, suit yourselves. ...
That's what restarts were invented for, by the way. Not for fishing for chocolate. Maybe we should remember how you played Jebus on WT with Dubrovin in King? "Oh, my respawn is empty, no way to go center on turn 1, let's re!" - and so on 15 times. In your game with Vasya on Jebus, he had one Dragon Fly Hive on respawn, and that was on WT, if you recall.
Lizard B
Indeed, the truly strongest and the righteous have always been an absolute minority....
I see you've become really strategically strong now, well of course, you beat Alex himself. Go ahead and repeat that with Stinger about 5 times, preferably on mirror, if he can't be bothered.

Kostya, since you're such a fan of equal starting conditions, please tell me how many games you've played on mirror?
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Offline Dark
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#185
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Chingis
SOD is it a clinic or a diagnosis?:)

I personally like SOD. But if YOU want your championships to become REALLY popular among the masses,
then you need to do something to make the games OBJECTIVE (i.e., so that players have equal opportunities)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

otherwise, all your games will remain the domain of a small group of enthusiasts, and it will be like always: a few newcomers come - they play for a while and leave.:)

those who do not develop yield their place to others.
I repeat once again, if we are discussing a separate series of games, 2 players 1 on 1, to find out who has the bigger... well, you know, maybe I would agree that we can talk about it in the context of a mirror match, but if we are talking about games in general, then it is a different question.

лето 2012.
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