A program for calculating the strength of the guard on random maps in Heroes of Might and Magic III, called H3CalcGuards. — Reference materials for online players.

LeBron

13 years ago

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Haha) The development of the Heroes community is very similar to the development of online poker) Both in terms of the average skill level and in the area of software development.

Redwhait

13 years ago

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On one hand, the program is good; at least there will be fewer blunders due to miscalculating the amount. But on the other (which I agree with more), it was rightly said that online is turning into offline, and that is not a good thing...
A chess timer in SoD becomes more and more necessary every time

Noom

13 years ago

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Wouldn't it be possible to make the timer tick length variable, depending on whether the player is in combat or on the strategic map, as it is implemented in Heroes of Might and Magic V?

In reply to numOne

Dirty_Player

13 years ago

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StickyFingaz

Someone was thinking about creating a check for the terrain on which the neutrals are located.

There is already such a feature. :)

numOne

With these trends, only a chess timer with a time limit in battles will save us. Let them write encyclopedias during their turn - their time will punish them! :smile31:

And that's right. :)

Regarding the topic. Maybe it would be better to ask Baratorch to create a display showing the exact number of neutrals? :)

dnaop-wr

13 years ago

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And what is the purpose of a spell for such a view? As for the range, it seems like you just need to place a text file in the DATA folder (and you posted it).

Wicc

13 years ago

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The algorithm behind the program is interesting.

Has anyone delved into the code and figured out exactly how Heroes determines the number of monsters? Or, based on a large sample of generations, has anyone discovered an approximate correlation?

Captain

13 years ago

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Another suggestion – let's implement a feature where, similar to a single program, the content of the units is displayed when hovering over them with the mouse.

Added after 47 seconds

Wicc

The algorithm behind the program is interesting.

Has anyone delved into the code and figured out exactly how Heroes chooses the number of monsters? Or, based on a large sample of generations, has anyone determined an approximate dependency?

A tourist on HugoLK described the algorithm. I think the authors used it.

In reply to Captain

Wicc

13 years ago

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Captain

Another suggestion – let's implement a feature similar to one program, where hovering the mouse over a town would display its contents.

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Tourist described the algorithm on the forum. I think the authors used it.

Tourist described it in very general terms.

I described it in more detail in my article later.

And here, it seems, even more precise values are displayed.

In reply to Wicc

Captain

13 years ago

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Wicc

The tourist described it in very general terms.

I then described it in more detail in my article.

And here, even more precise values seem to be derived.

I forgot, it wasn't the Tourist, but the author of Heroes who provided a detailed algorithm in his presentation. Smedstad. The presentation is still available on Google Drive.
But I haven't seen yours, Vic. Where did you publish it?

pHOMM

13 years ago

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I wrote the program for viewing terrain. Only it is still in the form of a separate app (and it's difficult to use because you have to manually enter coordinates and the ground type of the cell where the mobs are standing), whereas I wanted to integrate it into BT (with a script automating all the routine for the player) - and possibly tie the ability to view it to some skill like Eagle Eye.
No skill - nothing is visible; basic - only the layout for banks/towns/heroes (for heroes, only regarding the set and two-cell nature of both heroes' troops and without the landscape itself); advanced - with terrain in all field battles; hypothetically, at expert level, you could attach perks like auto-calculation of walking distance, mob placement, and the presence of GS - but that would already go far beyond the scope of my program - other algorithms would be needed, such as calculating GS on a cell and calculating the division of mobs into squads considering the ratio of army strengths.

I should note that I don't consider such a thing to be game-breaking - because it would be a reasonable price for 1 skill point for the Pope - it's also a strategic element, especially if you further tie max distance to the hero's level - then, for example, you could pump up some dummy a couple of levels, raise their Eagle Eye, and carry them with the Pope for scouting complex battles.

As for the subject - I think it's quite reasonable; an approach like a competitive sport requires tools for improvement. Whoever doesn't want to use it has chosen so themselves, or let their vast experience in assessing neutrals grow.

Regarding how they did it - Sav is a programmer on the HotA team - he was working on exactly this in the debugger - to build in compatibility with the HotA mod, and decided to release the findings as a program along the way.

Javdet

13 years ago

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rebellious

Regarding the matter... Now it's clear why there's such a large range in the guards of level 7 dwellings (I recommend you investigate this yourself by digging around in the program ;))

Good bait and switch!))) After digging around in the program, I realized that the answer remains the same as before: I have no idea
Please enlighten the uninitiated))
And at the same time, maybe we can find out where 31 cyclops came from guarding the angel's dwelling. It's a normal spawn, similar to the starting one on the Necropolis, 2nd week.

There's nothing in the program itself that violates the spirit of the game. Only one negative point - the lack of a timer. After all, one person knows the number of guards without the program, while another will start digging around in the program, which is, of course, worth paying for by the second)

Wicc

13 years ago

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No matter how I tried, I couldn't generate realistically spawning guards, like 33 bull creatures on a giant's lair. The parameter "Zones count" is unclear. And yet, it is precisely this parameter that determines the guard strength on lairs.

In reply to Wicc

Javdet

13 years ago

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Wicc

No matter how I tried, I couldn't generate realistically spawning guards, like 33 beefy creatures guarding a giant's lair.

The parameter "Zones count" is unclear. And yet, it's precisely this parameter that determines the guard strength in lairs.

Yeah, that's true.
For now, the program only guarantees one thing: more losses. :D

Noom

13 years ago

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I predict lawsuits against the author for leaking information in tournament games.

Sav

13 years ago

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Wicc

The algorithm behind the program is interesting.

Has anyone delved into the code and figured out exactly how Heroes determines the number of monsters? Or, based on a large sample of generations, has anyone determined an approximate correlation?

Here is everything the program is based on:
http://forum.df2.ru/index.php?s=&showtopic=2342&view=findpost&p=559149 (it also contains information about the value of resource nodes and Pandora boxes)
http://forum.df2.ru/index.php?s=&showtopic=27998&view=findpost&p=558697
http://forum.df2.ru/index.php?s=&showtopic=2342&view=findpost&p=546608 (with clarification http://forum.df2.ru/index.php?s=&showtopic=2342&view=findpost&p=560072, the misunderstanding regarding 1 Azure Dragon is likely due to the fact that in games where it appeared, the WT text file was used)

All of this was determined through code analysis, i.e., the information is accurate (although I cannot guarantee that I haven't made any mistakes anywhere :)).

Javdet

And perhaps an answer can be found as to where the 31 Cyclops guarding the Angel dwelling came from. It's a normal spawn, similar to the starting spawn on the Castle map, week 2.

For example, monsters avg + strong, 5 zones of the Castle out of 16.

Wicc

No matter how I tried, I couldn't generate a guard that would realistically appear, like 33 Minotaurs on a Giant node.

strong + strong, 4 zones of the Tower out of 16.

Wicc

The parameter "Zones count" is unclear. Especially since it is precisely what determines the guard on resource nodes.

Value of a resource node = (AI Value of the creature) * (Growth of the creature) * (1 + (Zones count: city of the creature) / (All zones with towns count)) + (AI Value of the creature) * (Zones count: city of the creature) / 2

Value of a Pandora box = (AI Value of the creature) * (Number of creatures) * (1 + (Zones count: city of the creature) / (All zones with towns count))

Value of a Seer's Hut = (2 * (AI Value of the creature) * (Number of creatures) * (1 + (Zones count: city of the creature) / (All zones with towns count)) - 4000) / 3

How these "Zones count" are determined, I wrote about here:
http://forum.df2.ru/index.php?s=&showtopic=29068&view=findpost&p=575859

And also, if there are resources near the resource node, they also add to the value.

Another point regarding resources: the generator generates both clusters of specific resources, each with its own value, and clusters of random resources with their own, different value. The former will remain the same from game to game on the same map, while the latter will change. It is impossible to distinguish them in the game, so it will not be easy to accurately calculate the guard of resources.

Roger DAltavilla

You are on the wrong path, fellow programmers! You are making the game simpler, but you should be making it more interesting.

Actually, I was initially interested in the question of adding objects to the map. :) I successfully solved it and, at the same time, posted the information I had accumulated. I considered developing this program to be interesting and useful; in any case, it is better than if someone else wrote it based on my information, and in case of errors, it would be unclear to me whether I needed to look for them myself.