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Posts from CIS Club Championship 2010-2011

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Offline Nagan-4
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#76
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Friends, thank you very much for your support. I agree that in Egypt, you should just relax and enjoy. Plus, "a revolution has a beginning, but no end..." They are in a situation similar to Russia after the February Revolution of 1917. They united to overthrow the Tsar, and now the victors will compete for power, which could lead to a bloodbath, like in neighboring Libya. Regarding the dates. The club is available from April 30th to May 8th. April 30th is the first day off; it can be dedicated to gathering and traveling to Michurinsk. Starting May 1st, there will be one round, as it was in Krasnodar. Some will manage to play 4 rounds in 3 days, while others will quickly be eliminated and play only a couple of rounds. And the winners, in the worst case, can also play on May 4th and 5th, with mutual agreement, to determine the champion. There are no strict deadlines; some will be satisfied with two days, while others will need five. For players from Ukraine, they can arrive on May 2nd, or they can play one round among themselves in advance, or they can receive half the points and start immediately with the second round – this does not worsen their chances of overall victory if they win the remaining games. Now about the finalists. It is very important for me to know the number of players who will definitely come. The more players, the less each person will have to pay for the club. Please let me know who is in favor of Michurinsk, either in person, by phone, or here on the forum. 1. Wicc - judge 2. Scorp. 3. Mizrael 4. Lexa 5. Preds 6. AlextheGreat 7. Vitalic 8. Yama-Dharma 9. Term 10. Piterius 11. Dust 12. Merlin We talked to Vik about his desire to come: 13. Horn 14. Bayazet. 15. Dirty Player - has problems in real life, but would really like to come, as he wrote on the forum. This is 14 or 15 finalists. Two out of three players from Yekaterinburg and Kobra from St. Petersburg are in favor of Egypt. This does not mean that they are in opposition; if they chose Hurghada, it does not mean that they are prohibited from entering Michurinsk. I am sure that we will reach an agreement and play together. I would very much like it to be in Michurinsk. 18. Kobra 19. Mee 20. 911fx No information from the following players: 21. Deep Mike 22. Forrest 23. Volodimer 24. Napalm. I would like to ask Dust, Vik, and Piterius to ask these players for their opinion on the final and their willingness to come in May. Thank you in advance. I am definitely in favor of all 24 people coming to the final and playing. But it may turn out that they cannot. If 2-3 cannot come, then we will definitely contact the players who took the next places in the qualifying rounds and offer them to participate. If 4 to 9 people cannot come, then we need to think about holding additional qualifying rounds. The captain wrote that Kyiv cannot. In Michurinsk, I could organize it, plus there is the option of online qualifying on our website. We will find players; think about it, the most legendary player, Tema Stinger, could not participate and did not make it to the final, although he really wanted to play. And this is not an isolated case. That's all for now. If we sort out the composition, then we will decide on the dates and the number of finalists. Regarding the country house. Yes, there is one. But I already have agreements with the club and with the television channel. It is inconvenient to travel 15 kilometers in the morning and then back at night. And the atmosphere, lying on the beds, will not be conducive to a tournament. I am focusing on the gaming tone that was in Krasnodar with Alan Prosta; I will organize it based on that model.
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Offline KobRa_RR
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#77
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Nagan-4

...it might turn into a bloodbath, just like in neighboring Libya.

Libya and Egypt are similar to Chechnya and the rest of Russia in terms of their warlike nature.
Nagan-4
.....
Regarding the out-of-town resort. Yes, there is one. But I already have agreements with a club and a TV channel.
So, will I have to pay a penalty?
Nagan-4

Traveling 15 kilometers in the morning and then back at night is too much. And the atmosphere, lying on the beds, won't be conducive to a tournament.
I'm aiming for the same gaming atmosphere that Alan Prosta had in Krasnodar, and I'm organizing it in a similar way.

Alan Prosta (in 2003) already had comfortable conditions for relaxation; he rented a two-story apartment for us, plus a country house for Antal and Co. Even I (a student at the time) could afford it. It's just that laptops weren't as common back then, so no one even thought about playing outside of clubs. But it turns out it's possible, and everyone enjoys it, as the recent tournaments in Minsk, held at a resort with country cottages, have shown.
I still don't understand why it's impossible to combine relaxation, socializing, and a tournament. Why does any deviation from the planned schedule cause such rejection? Why are you so attached to this club? Does everyone really want to go to Michurinsk and spend 4 days cooped up in a club? :confused: I still hope that common sense will prevail over conservatism! :smile12:

A trip to Michurinsk will cost a resident of St. Petersburg 10-12 thousand rubles, while a trip to Egypt will cost 16-20 thousand rubles, depending on the hotel. So that no one thinks that there is some kind of obsession with Egypt, I propose a compromise: MINSK. The cost of the trip is 10 thousand rubles. In return, you'll also have participants from Minsk, Moscow, and probably Ukraine.
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Offline PReDS
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#78
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I understand that Kobra wants to eliminate a strong competitor in the person of Alex, who is already planning to participate in the May Day tournament in Michurinsk, and it is unlikely that he will be able to travel to another time or another place:D
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Offline Piterius
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#79
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Piterius

P.S. Eric, I don't quite understand who and how you are scamming. This is business, circumstances change every day, the one who pays is right, and agreements can only be preliminary in this case. You need to please most of the players, not just the club, right?

I still haven't received an answer to my question and am a little confused. Is the gathering for the club and television, or for the participants themselves? Does anyone even need this television coverage? Maybe it's worth starting a poll about the dates and location, and planning it based on where the majority wants to be, regardless of whether it's for the club or not? Right now, I see that it's not the club that the dates are being adjusted for, but the players are being adjusted for the club. How is that? What qualifying rounds are being held to recruit for the club?? What was the point of holding the ones that were held? Nonsense, in my opinion.

Unfortunately, I don't have a teleporter, and I won't be in Michurinsk on the 2nd, 800 km is a long way, and it's not great to come for the third round and miss half of the tournament events. Unless I just come as a spectator.
Playing online for the first round is fine for the qualifiers, but it's not suitable for the final. Not everyone will find the motivation to travel with zero or 0.5 points after the first round. The Kyiv experience showed that 0.5 points are no longer enough to take first place.
Хаос - это порядок, которым сложнее управлять.

icq: 407907277
skype: piterius_i

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Offline MerlinTheMagician
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#80
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Qwerty
However, our forum has certain rules, and in light of this, we need to make a few adjustments to the second-to-last sentence of your post.
Feel free to make the adjustments. If something doesn't meet the stated requirements, moderators usually make corrections. I didn't use any explicit language, and censorship is supposedly prohibited in our country... But again, moderators have the right to edit posts according to the forum rules. I have no objections. I just don't have a similar, equally concise saying in my repertoire.
Qwerty
You expressed very positive impressions of my comments on the final of the World Championship.
I am very flattered and disappointed by such a high assessment of the drunken rambling I was spouting. I gave myself a grade of two for the first broadcast. Mee won't lie – I was clearly not at my best...
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Offline Mike_HP
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#81
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Nagan-4

No information from players -
21.Deep Mike
22.Forrest
23.Volodimer
24.Napalm.

I won't go.
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Offline MerlinTheMagician
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#82
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I'll repeat my question, which got lost in the text.
Why do we want to gather? What is our goal? What are our priorities?
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Offline Nagan-4
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#83
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Regarding the country resort. Yes, there is one. But I already have agreements with a club and with a TV channel.
So, will I have to pay a penalty?

2 Kobra

In a moral sense, yes. I don't want to hear "What a blabbermouth," and I wouldn't allow anyone to say that.
A trip to Michurinsk for a resident of St. Petersburg will cost 10-12K, while a trip to Egypt costs 16-20K, depending on the hotel. So that no one thinks there is some kind of obsession with Egypt, I suggest a compromise: MINSK. The cost of the trip is 10K. In return, you get more people from Minsk, Moscow, and it will definitely be more convenient for Ukrainians.

Why not Mars then? If Minsk had the conditions for a Heroes tournament, they would have held it. If it's just to go anywhere, but not to Michurinsk, then why?
Alan Prost (in 2003) already had comfortable conditions for recreation; he rented a two-story apartment for us + a country house for Antal and Co. Even I (a student at the time) could afford it. It's just that laptops weren't so common back then, and that's why no one even thought that you could play not in clubs. And it turns out you can, and everyone likes it, as the recent gatherings in Minsk at a country cottage base show.

Alan Prost was forced to accommodate all the Heroes players throughout Krasnodar and drove around at dawn in his car, picking them up so they wouldn't oversleep; I spent one morning with him in 2004. God forbid.
I still don't understand why it's impossible to combine recreation, communication, and a tournament. Why does any deviation from the intended plan cause such rejection? Why are you so attached to this club? Does everyone really want to go to Michurinsk and spend 4 days sitting in a club? I still hope that common sense will prevail over conservatism!

We are combining recreation and communication with the tournament. You are suggesting replacing everything with just recreation and communication. If it's like in Minsk, there will be no tournament; there will only be separate games played, nothing more.

I will give a detailed answer to a detailed question.

1. Let's say I ditch the club, rent a country resort. I get enough laptops. People arrive, get drunk, eat, and sit down to play poker. The country resort is only for recreation; it would be very strange to spend 4 days there playing Heroes. And people won't care about the schedule; a sleepy mood will prevail.

2. I don't see the point in accommodating everyone at a country resort and playing at a club in the city. Getting up early to catch a taxi, paying a lot of money for a trip to the resort, then waking everyone up, then calling a bunch of taxis and taking everyone to the city... and at night, everything in reverse - I physically can't handle it.

3. The only possible option. Some of the Heroes players will stay with me - about 7-8 people (it works well), and the rest will stay in a hotel near the club; I will reserve adjacent rooms on the same floor in the same wing. It will be easy for players and guests to get together; there are plenty of places near the club where you can grab a bite to eat. During the day, people hang out in the computer club, playing Heroes and blitz. In the evening - bowling, billiards, clubs, and if the weather is nice, you can go for a late-night barbecue. It won't be boring.
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Offline Wicc
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#84
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Nagan-4
But I already have agreements with the club and with television.
What does it have to do with television? :eek: Does that mean I'll have to limit myself to beer? :smile18:

Agreements with the club are, in my opinion, secondary; they won't refuse to work in the usual mode. Moreover, we are not putting them before a fait accompli, but rather more than a month in advance.
It's expensive to travel 15 kilometers in the morning and then back at night.
15 kilometers is about half an hour by transport, taking into account waiting time. It also takes time to get from home to the club by minibus.
And the atmosphere, lying on the beds, won't be conducive to a tournament.
What beds? We will be playing in the conference room. Or we will move the tables outside to the veranda (most likely). In the photos, I saw some kind of large canopy with tables and chairs under it.
I am focusing on the gaming spirit that was in Krasnodar with Alan Prosta, and I will organize it in a similar way.
We have a slightly higher average age now, and also a higher weight, not to mention the experience in Heroes. That's why the spirit is a little lower. This is what we are talking about.

Added 10 minutes ago
Yes, in a moral sense. I don't want to hear: "Here's a chatterbox," and I wouldn't allow anyone to say that.
Hmm... actually, if the club owners react like that, then they are fools who don't understand what business is, and especially business in the service sector.
People came, drank, ate, and sat down to play poker. A resort outside the city is intended only for relaxation; it would be very strange to spend 4 days there playing Heroes. And people won't care about the draw; of course, a sleepy mood will prevail.
It's their right if a sleepy mood prevails. It can also prevail in the club; there have been precedents in Kyiv. The main thing is that they make a contribution to the prize fund.

I remember the last gathering in Minsk - people played 4-5 games, and without any schedule. And they didn't deny themselves poker and drinks.

Added 7 minutes ago
Piterius
Unfortunately, I don't have a teleporter, and on the 2nd, I won't be in Michurinsk, 800 km is a long way, and it's not great to come for the third round and miss half of the tournament. Unless I just come as a spectator.
It's difficult to change the dates; some players will be unavailable on May 9-10.

I can suggest the option that Bayazet and Vitalik had in Kyiv - upon arrival, you play 2 games in parallel.

Surely there are no night trains or buses from the 1st to the 2nd? Or is it critical for you to travel by car?
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Offline Nagan-4
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#85
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The agreements with the club are, in my opinion, of secondary importance; they won't refuse to work in the usual mode.

Yura, this is the only point I won't discuss. I am very particular about matters of honor, so please excuse me.
15 kilometers is about half an hour by transport, taking into account waiting time. It also takes some time to get from home to the club by minibus.

This isn't St. Petersburg; if transport runs towards the recreation center, it does so twice a day.
Our average age is a bit higher now, as is our weight, not to mention our experience in Heroes. That's why our energy levels are lower. This is what we're actually talking about.

If you're writing about this... then I have a feeling that I've gotten myself into something I shouldn't have.
Hmm... actually, if the club owners react like that, they're fools who don't understand what business is, especially in the service sector.

Yura, if you did to me what you're suggesting, I wouldn't shake your hand. Business isn't everything in our lives, that's a fact.

I will create a separate topic regarding the dates. 9-10 is definitely not possible, but from May 2nd to May 5th - we'll try to suggest that. The only chance is that the time between the holidays is short, and people might be able to get away for longer. Let's say on May 1st, we organize a big barbecue for those who want to come, May 2nd - the first round, May 5th - the last, fourth round.
May 3rd - Ukraine arrives, having played their first game against each other...
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Offline Wicc
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#86
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Eric, you have a very strange idea of honor. Are you sure that everyone else (including the club owners) thinks the same way? For some reason, it seems to me that it's the opposite. In this case, it's purely business - people have a club, and we have the money for the rental. There's no need to add anything else to it. In the service industry, there is a concept called booking, and that's what you used. So, refusing a booking is a perfectly normal occurrence - circumstances can change. Moreover, the club isn't really suffering - it's not opening specifically for us; it will still make the same profit from regular customers.
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Offline Piterius
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#87
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Hmm, I understand, I won't get answers to my questions.
Vik is right, they are indeed fools. But it seems the situation with the club is so dire that it's almost like a marriage contract. Or maybe there's something else we don't know.
In any case, contractual practice should provide for the right to deviate from the intention, especially if these intentions depend on many factors and there is a significant amount of time available. The problem is that you, Eric, didn't have and still don't have the desire to use this right. If you've already promised something, then yes, everyone will have to adjust, but what's the point?

They may also face various unforeseen circumstances, such as an inspection, an accident, a power outage, or even a May Day demonstration organized by some cell, and many other things that could lead them to say, "Sorry, it's business..." Why not shake hands? I don't quite understand the approach.

Vik, it's not critical to travel by car, but there are no night trains (and I won't even mention buses), and there is no direct connection between Dnipro and Michurinsk, or between Kyiv and Michurinsk. There is also no way to get to Tambov or Gryazi. I don't know, maybe there will be some summer trains, but for now, you can only travel with transfers through Tula or Moscow. This takes a day from Dnipro or Kyiv, and another half-day from Kakhovka or Simferopol. By car, it's twice as fast, even with customs. Plus, if you travel in a group of three or four, it's twice as cheap as by train. These are the aspects to consider.
Хаос - это порядок, которым сложнее управлять.

icq: 407907277
skype: piterius_i

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Offline Wicc
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#88
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By the way.
3. This is the only possible option. Some of the Heroes players will stay with me – about 7-8 people (it's been tested, they fit well), and the rest will stay in a hotel near the club; adjacent rooms on the same floor in the same wing will be reserved.
It will be easy for players and guests to gather for the tournament; there are plenty of places near the club where you can grab a bite to eat. During the day, people hang out at the computer club, playing Heroes and Blitz. In the evening, there's bowling, billiards, clubs, and if the weather is nice, you can go for a late-night barbecue. It won't be boring.
However, this will take at least half an hour (or even an hour) for morning and evening gatherings and travel to and from the club.

The same applies to billiards and barbecues – the game schedule will be disrupted, partly due to the events themselves and partly due to the confusion they cause.

This is the case where the weakest link slows down the rest. If someone falls asleep in the toilet :rolleyes: – 10 people are waiting for him. The same goes for meals – practice has shown that people can be gone for more than an hour, and since they go in large groups, some delay others.

Remember what it was like in Michurinsk in the summer? It's the same – we went to the beach, had a barbecue, and played bowling. That's all great, but where will we find another 6-10 hours a day for the game itself?

A recreation center is different in this respect – everything is nearby. There are beds, meals, a gaming area, and entertainment. You can have a barbecue without interrupting the game. The process of waking up and going to bed is reduced to moving your body from the 1st floor to the 2nd. Plus, delays of one person don't affect everyone, but only his opponent.

Similarly, with meals – it's either a collective meal, where everyone is served at the same table at once (the Minsk option), or an individual meal – in a local cafe near the gaming area (it was like that in Kingisepp last time). Time is optimized, to the point of being able to eat while at the computer.

Those who want to play billiards can move to the billiards room, which is within walking distance. Poker – without interrupting the game, you play on your opponent's turn, and when it's your turn, you sit out. Many people combined this in Minsk.

Again, if a game takes a long time, players can continue it until late at night, and this won't bother anyone. In Kyiv, for example, several matches had to be postponed until the morning, precisely because of the need to organize transportation.

That is, the advantage of a recreation center is that the accompanying activities do not interfere with the game – everything is at hand. It's roughly like being at home, when you do chores while it's your opponent's turn. This saves a lot of time. I've already said that in Minsk, people played everything to their heart's content – Heroes, poker, billiards, and tennis; they would have easily included football if the weather had allowed. And all without any pressure, simply because this kind of organization of life provided a lot of free time.

The hotel + club format is much more time-consuming in this respect, precisely because it is difficult to combine different activities, and it also takes time to transport yourself and to coordinate the transportation of groups of people.

P.S. If you're worried about having to travel from home to the recreation center, no problem, I'll pay for your taxi or even your accommodation at the center. I think Kober will also be happy to contribute. The main thing is that everything goes well.
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Offline Captain
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#89
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I completely agree with Vik. We talked about this a lot in Kyiv.
Although I suggested that everyone go to Minsk for the next tournament. :)

Nagan, why are you so attached to the club?
Is it hard for you to find a resort? IMHO, it takes only half an hour – there are plenty of options online... Surely, you won't have any problems finding a resort in the Moscow region? The prices start from 500 rubles.
In Michurinsk, the prices are: 1100 rubles per day for a hotel, 1500 rubles for the club (4 days - 25,000 rubles) plus almost everyone has extra travel expenses from Moscow to Michurinsk (coupe 1063, reserved seat 900 rubles).

In Kyiv, people stayed for 300 rubles, and the club cost 450 rubles for all the days. Maybe we should all go to Kyiv again? ;)

UPD: We also had beer for 16 rubles per half-liter. :)
Дипломатия - искусство говорить собаке "хорошая собачка" до тех пор пока не найдешь подходящую палку.
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Offline KobRa_RR
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#90
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Nagan-4


If you're writing about this... it makes me think that I might have gotten myself into something I shouldn't have.
...
Yura, if you did to me what you're suggesting, I wouldn't even shake your hand. Business isn't everything in our lives, that's a fact.


I suggest lowering the intensity of the discussion, and even better, everyone should take a cold shower, as summer is coming soon, and it's the perfect time to toughen up. :p There are no unsolvable problems, only bad negotiators (a free translation). There is a desire to play in the Championship and at the same time have a good rest. This is completely possible if the organizers are Nagan and Vik, and all the players are in the same place. Just imagine how much time and nerves that would save, Eric! By the way, it seems to me that another problem is that Nagan hasn't been in Kingisepp or Minsk for a long time and has forgotten (if he was there at all) how all this happens. ;) Listen to people, please. Now, a question... Eric, what exactly did you promise the club, seriously? Please send me a private message.
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