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In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Pit, there's no need to give much weight to Vik's words. Just take a close look at his analysis of the "Vitalik" game to understand what kind of "authority" he is. Many forum users have already formed their own opinion about him. He might be a decent person, but he clearly attributes qualities to himself that he doesn't actually possess.
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Oelm, +1, and to be honest, 95% of the negativity towards the Academy started with Wick, who doesn't care that there are people who are just as authoritative as he is, and most importantly, they made a decision that he disagrees with. Remove his posts, and everything will be peaceful.
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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I started replying to Pete’s post, but then I sort of abandoned it. Beating a dead horse is only interesting at first; without fresh input, the argument starts going in circles with no substantial changes.

So I’ll just ramble in another familiar role. The text below is a compilation of posts by comrade alexandrov_g. That is, it’s not a coherent piece, but rather a set of theses that, if desired, can be pieced together into a complete picture, but I can’t be bothered :).

So then:

You can’t have a state without boyars. In any state. And boyars exist in any state. Any.

In a “slave-owning,” “feudal,” “early capitalist,” “late capitalist,” “post-capitalist,” “socialist” — in short, any kind. They are called differently, of course, and they dress differently, but not only does their boyar essence remain unchanged, but the boyars of different nations also recognize each other unerringly. At the same time, boyars are boyars precisely because they understand that they can remain boyars only as long as the state exists. “Boyarhood” only makes sense in a state context.

If you isolate a conditional boyar with his “fiefdom” into a separate state, neither he nor his fiefdom will be able to survive in that capacity. And it is precisely in order to “stay alive” that he will strive to immediately, if not return to the old state or enter a new state directly, then at the very least he will be forced to “fall” (he himself will seek this) into the “sphere of influence” of a state (any state, even the first one that comes along), which alone can guarantee the very existence of our boyar. “His life and his people.”

For this reason, boyars “of one blood and one faith” try to stick together. “As a pack.” But since they are ambitious people who know their own worth and know what “power” is not from fiction films, the pack turns out to be a wolf pack. A pack of wolves, where each wolf knows not only that he is a wolf, but that all other members of the pack are exactly the same wolves. With exactly the same little eyes, little ears, and little teeth.

But our wolves are not just wolves, but “wolves with principles,” and by virtue of these principles they clearly understand that for “peaceful coexistence” in the pack, they need someone who will force them to tolerate each other’s existence, who will humble each of them individually, and who will reconcile them all.

Boyars are people in wolf’s clothing, and the force of circumstances sooner or later forces them to realize that they need not a leader, but a man who stands outside the pack — they need a judge, an arbiter. They need someone called a Caesar.

They need a Tsar.

They need the “one who restrains.”

And he appears. Inevitably. Because if there is no one to restrain and humble them, the state disintegrates into fiefdoms, and that’s not even the end, as each fiefdom carries the seeds of its own decay, and in the distance glimmer the eyes of a neighboring pack, whimpering with impatience — a wolf is always hungry.

So it turns out that from the people’s point of view, the Tsar is always good, for he is God’s viceroy on Earth, and it is in this capacity — he holds the World back from decay, from Chaos; the Tsar is the living embodiment of the state, the personification of world order.

The System of Power in a state grows by itself, and it always takes the form of a pyramid, in this sense mirroring the shape of the state itself — a broad base, converging sides, and a peak where there is room for only one. The Pyramid of Power and the Pyramid of the State (it is hard to say which is a copy of which in this duality) are similar in one very important detail: they are not solid. Visually, this idea is very clearly expressed in the famous image of the pyramid on the one-dollar bill that circulates throughout the world today.

The peak of the pyramid, that very pyramidion, not only hovers, detached from the base, but is also surrounded by a shining halo, directing our thoughts to that very thing — “there is no authority except from God” — but not only that; the ancient Christian symbol also hints at the obvious fact that one can only control, manipulate the pyramid from outside it; the Ruler cannot be part of the pyramid; a person, upon becoming a Monarch, crosses a certain invisible line.

A boyar may want to become a tsar, yes, and sometimes he does become a tsar. But only in that case does he lose his boyar status, the “material” one, and besides, he ceases to belong to himself — and not everyone is capable of that.

Therefore, a fight for the throne does not always happen. It could even be said that it almost never happens. Very often, a person who does not want it ends up on the throne. What is important is that the boyars recognize the necessity of a “throne.” Who actually sits on the throne is already much less important. Life itself will replace an unsuccessful candidate with a successful one.

Under certain circumstances, a tsar may even be a hindrance; the point is different — the Tsar must suit the boyars as a “judge,” for various reasons, but he must suit them. Each one must see some personal benefit for himself in the candidate. And not a monetary benefit, of course.

But that’s not enough — the boyars are pushed from below by the people; they “feel their mood in their gut,” and it becomes extremely important not only personal gain, but also how much the Tsar will, in the boyars’ expectations, be “beloved” by the people. And when all this comes together, “just right,” it results in a “successful reign.”

The Tsar can get rid of an undesirable boyar only with the help of other boyars, or at least with their tacit support. A situation of universal “boyar opposition” may arise; then the Tsar has no choice but to create another center of power — the “oprichnina.” But this happens extremely rarely, when all options have been exhausted and all other possibilities have been used up, when the state is “at the brink.” Because by doing so, the Tsar starts playing a very dangerous game; the “oprichnina” creates the possibility of maneuvering between centers of power, and “well-wishers” from outside immediately begin to take advantage of this. The conditional “Poles.”
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Wicc, do I need to explain the difference between monarchy, feudalism, slavery, and democracy in simple terms, or do you already know?
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Read the original post more carefully, especially the beginning:
A state cannot exist without boyars. In any state. And boyars exist in every state. In any.

In a "slave-owning," "feudal," "early capitalist," "late capitalist," "post-capitalist," or "socialist" state, or any other. They are just called by different names...
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Wicc, the thing is, you were aiming to be one of those "top players" whose opinion everyone respects. But when you realized there were equally authoritative people who could dismiss your opinion, you started writing lengthy posts filled with trolling and nonsense.
In reply to Wlk777
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16 years ago
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Wlk777
Wicc, but there’s one thing – you, with your “authoritative opinion that correlates with the opinions of top players,” were aiming to become one of these “boyars.” When you realized that there were people who were just as authoritative and could tell you to go away, you started writing kilometer-long posts filled with trolling and nonsense.
You either are a “boyar” or you aren’t; you can’t aim to become one (at least, not in the short term). It’s not a status or a position; it’s a mindset and a character trait.

The transition between these categories is only possible through the overall development (or degradation) of a person, and this doesn’t happen in 5 minutes, or even in a year. Many historical examples (the most recent being Khodorkovsky) show that people remain “boyars” even after being deprived of all their property and freedom.

But in general, this post wasn’t addressed to you. It’s your job to go to demonstrations, wave flags, chant slogans dictated from above, and throw feces at ideological opponents. You’re doing a great job with that.
In reply to Wicc
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16 years ago
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A state cannot exist without boyars. In any state. And boyars exist in any state. In any.

In a "slave-owning," "feudal," "early capitalist," "late capitalist," "post-capitalist," or "socialist" state, or any other. They are just called and dressed differently, but not only does their essence as boyars remain unchanged, but the boyars of different nations also recognize each other without fail. At the same time, boyars are boyars precisely because they understand that they can remain boyars only as long as the state exists. "Boyarstvo" makes sense only and exclusively in a state context.

If you isolate a conditional boyar with his "estate" into a separate state, neither he nor his estate will be able to survive in this capacity. And precisely in order to "continue to exist," he will strive to immediately either return to the old state or join a new state directly, or at least he will be forced to "end up" (he himself will strive for this) in the "sphere of influence" of a state (any state, even the first one he encounters), which alone can guarantee the very existence of our boyar, "his life and his people."

For this reason, boyars "of the same blood and the same faith" try to stick together. "In a pack." But since they are ambitious people who know their own worth and know what "power" is, not from fiction films, the pack turns out to be like a pack of wolves. A pack of wolves, where each wolf knows not only that he is a wolf, but that the other members of the pack are exactly the same wolves. With exactly the same eyes, ears, and teeth.

This is a stream of consciousness. Although not without talent. The chief ideologue for communicating with the masses, excuse me, with the public – Mikhail Leontyev – might envy this passage. By the way, if anyone is interested in exploring the issue of boyarstvo in more depth, I recommend studying the history of Andrei Batashov; although he was not a boyar in the formal sense, in essence, he is exactly the person that the unknown author from the city of Alexandrov writes about.
In reply to Wicc
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16 years ago
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Wicc
It's your job to attend demonstrations, wave flags, chant slogans dictated from above, and throw feces at ideological opponents. You're doing a great job with that.
Firstly, don't tell me what to do, and I won't tell you where to go. Secondly, regarding "throwing feces at ideological opponents," I am far from being like you, and that's a fact.
In reply to Wlk777
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16 years ago
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Sorry for barging in, but what do boyars, nobles, and other social and economic formations have to do with it? Does someone have a screw loose? What exactly does the esteemed Wicc mean by the word "boyars"? Originally, boyars were a military elite, and later they evolved into feudal magnates. If the esteemed person simply means influential and powerful people, then this class is completely absent in a socialist state (at least in theory). "You either are a boyar or you are not (at a short distance). It's not a status or a position; it's a mindset and character." This is just ridiculous. :) Study sociology. There is such a concept as vertical mobility. P.S. What is the point of all this demagoguery?:D I apologize again.
In reply to Wicc
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16 years ago
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Wicc
.........


I'm rolling on the floor laughing!!! :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40: :smile40:



Into the Hall of Fame for eternity!!! :smile40:
In reply to Skuns
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16 years ago
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"Actually, this post wasn't addressed to you. It's your business to attend demonstrations, wave flags, chant slogans dictated from above, and throw feces at ideological opponents. You seem to be doing a good job with that."
But what demonstrations are we talking about? What ideological opponents? What political worldview do you adhere to? What political literature shaped your ideological worldview? Why are you engaging in a dialogue in the style of "I'm a nobleman, and you're a commoner"?
In reply to Skuns
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16 years ago
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Skuns
Why are you engaging in a dialogue with the tone of "I'm a nobleman, you're a commoner"?
See, many people have already noticed this, Vicc. I would like to hear an answer to this question.
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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The word "boyars" wasn't really my choice; it was used by a colleague I was quoting. I thought the meaning in which it was used was clear from the text. Apparently, I was mistaken... But I don't see the point in elaborating on the terminology in detail – those who need to will understand what I'm talking about, and those who don't will keep finding new and new things to nitpick about. Here's a relevant quote:
One of the problems of the current era is the abundance of words. There are too many of them. Therefore, the skills of attentive and correct reading are rapidly being lost. No, what is said directly and repeated ten times is still understood. But problems have become almost insurmountable when it comes to what is NOT SAID. First, the culture of allusion was lost. When something is left unsaid in a text, and the very fact of this omission is part of the message. As long as there were few words, the reader gratefully delved into it – what does this passage indicate, why is it abruptly broken off here, why is an obvious conclusion from the premises not stated? No, not even delved into – they felt it. Receiving exquisite pleasure from such a watercolor. Now, all of this can be safely forgotten. At least in texts that do not claim to be artistic, but rather about "thoughts and ideas." Everything needs to be written down to the end, scratching out every detail and dwelling on any banality. On the other hand, people have somehow completely stopped being ashamed of "mental digressions." That is, false moves that take you outside the author's thought. No one considers that the author said ONLY what he said. No, they come up with things for him – and not what the author would like them to come up with or guess (see above about allusion), but what the reader has imagined out of habit. Usually, this leads them straight into some kind of mess or snowdrift, from which they then curse the vile author, who supposedly put them in this snowdrift. However, these assumptions can be predicted. Because, as a rule, they follow the line of "the author said something stupid" or "the author said something nasty." Since it is not difficult to figure out what specific stupidities or nastiness can be derived from a particular statement, one has to protect oneself by saying in advance – "do not misunderstand me in such and such a way." That is, before, one could write something like "not the first consonant letter." The reader would probably guess that it means the letter "v." Now, you need to write directly – "the letter V," without any ambiguity, you understand. And tomorrow, it will be desirable to express yourself like this – "the letter V, and not G, no, not G, and not D, and not Zh, I repeat, not Zh, because you are only thinking about Zh, so it's not Zh, and not all the other letters of the alphabet, but specifically V, V, remember, V... yes, I remind you – and not a vowel, not a vowel!!!" Or, here's a more realistic example. Before, one could allow oneself a metaphor like: "poverty is a bottomless barrel." Now, you need to say: "as practice shows, charity helps individual poor people for a short time, but poverty as a phenomenon does not disappear from this." And tomorrow, you will definitely have to add – "I do not mean by this that charity should not be done at all, that it is wrong to refuse unfortunate widows a penny, while we ourselves gorge ourselves and revel! I also did not mean to say that all the poor should be gathered in concentration camps and burned in furnaces! I did not mean that they are to blame for their own poverty, no, it happens in different ways, I know that! nothing in this text is aimed at inciting hatred and hostility towards the less well-off segments of the population, damn it!" This is very annoying, and sometimes infuriating. But alas. Yes, and by the way. I did not mean that people have become stupider, that they have forgotten how to read, or that they have gone mad. I also did not want to say that there are many malicious cretins and assholes around, picking at words, although there are such people. I only meant that, due to a combination of objective and subjective reasons, more responsibility is placed on the author than before, damn it.
Those who think that I called them "rednecks" should reread the above text.
In reply to Oelm
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16 years ago
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Another irrelevant troll post.

Added 3 minutes later
Wicc

To those who think I called them "rednecks" - reread the text above.
You don't say it directly, but you communicate from that very position, and many people have noticed it.

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