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Let me explain for clarity: A combination of high attack and a large number of units results in a significant amount of damage, which is what I refer to as offensive potential. And I didn't write anything about angels in this context.
Building an army of angels is more complex than building an army of champions because it requires a lot of resources and money. Champions only need wood and stone, a considerable amount, but in my opinion, gathering these resources is easier than gathering "expensive" resources (sulfur, mercury, gems, crystals), and it's also slightly more profitable to trade them on the market.
Behemoths also deal a lot of damage, and gnolls deal even more. But neither of them will be allowed to reach their target. That's the situation. So, the potential may exist, but it almost always remains just potential. ;)
P.S. Don't get upset, I was just joking about the building process, if that's what you're concerned about. ;)
I've only played a couple of times, but the last time was recently. So, indeed, the Champions won't really get a chance to attack properly. Because their speed is worse, and if their morale isn't good, they won't be able to attack effectively – by the time it's their turn, the opponent will already have blocked them, and there won't be an opportunity to build up momentum. That is, the Champions' advantage lies in the initial attack, a hit-and-run. But, of course, it's probably great for quickly taking down neutral creatures:D. As for the Knights, I won't say anything; in my opinion, everything has already been said about them many times.
With neutrals, things aren't always great, as you need to keep an eye on the champion's HP and other factors.
As for the first attack... well, in my opinion, it depends more on the opponent and your own magic. By the way, "flight" largely solves the problem of speeding up units.
But don't think that I'm saying you should always put champions instead of angels, especially in online games. That's not the case, because speed is one of the determining factors. I just recently tried them on a map again, and I actually liked them. They keep you on your toes! You get a little careless, and one champion is gone.
And I liked them on dueling arenas, but there you don't have a choice.
2 oxygen_hl, who are gnashers?
Отдай свои прошлые сны, В сомненьях себя обрети, В бешеном танце душа кружится! Не думай, что будет потом, Здесь и сейчас мы живем, Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!
vo-VO, by the way, I also tried them in the arena – I didn't like them. Although there's a lot of meat, it's just... meat. It's neither fish nor fowl, in general:D.
2 oxygen_hl, and who are Gnashers?
Please, enlighten me – tell me about the nuances of "heroic" slang:D. Because I'm also lost in guesswork – although I've heard it many times, I still don't understand who they are. I can't logically deduce it – "gnash" seems to mean "grinding," but they are slow and deal a lot of damage... Hydras????? Who can grind? Could it be Golems? I've never played Heroes in English.
By the way, regarding Champions...
Just about 5 days ago, I finished a game with Lord on Spot. The situation was such that by the finale, I managed to gather 20 Champions and not a single Angel, as they weren't found among the neutrals or in the market. In short, I was once again convinced that Champions are by no means a weak unit. With a Tactician and a Life Mage, they are simply a killing machine due to their first strike (this is the main thing, as it reduces losses) and their ability to boost stats. Because of the Tactician, the initiative will be high, meaning the Champions will go first - there will be plenty of room for boosting (and in the worst case, you can run around the enemy in circles), and the Life Mage can heal or resurrect them if necessary. In general, I don't think Champions are too much weaker than Angels. I proved this to myself again in a recent game :)
In total, Champions potentially outpace Thunderbirds, Titans, Ifrits, and Unicorns. And they definitely outpace Venom and Crystal Dragon. The rest will almost always be faster. Do you think there's someone who would let you attack with 20 Champions at full speed, when they have faster units? Also, don't forget that with such low speed, Champions aren't very dangerous in a wait state. A speed of 11 (with a Tactician) can be easily outrun by a hero with a couple of crystals and one speed-boosting item. And even less than that. Such conditions exist on every map.
Yes. And one more thing. The first row usually consists of weak units. And after that, Champions can't break through. That's why they only play a role when there's either a huge number of them or they're in a "dog-eat-dog" situation. :).
Oks is back to theorizing! I gave a specific example! ;) I know that Champions aren't the fastest unit and have the least experience among the level 4 units, so they're also not very expensive. That is, it's quite possible to gather a "huge number" of them. And I encountered the "dog's life" situation this time on Spot, when there were only Champions and Catapults among the level 4 units.
Do you think there will be someone who will let you attack with 20 Champions in a charge, when they have faster units?
A Lord was found! :) And the charge can be carried out even in cramped conditions. As I said, you can just run in circles.
In short, I'm not saying that Champions are as cool as Megadragons, and on other maps I will definitely build angels, but if you gather a large number of them, they will perform very well. I'm not even talking about wars with neutrals.
P.S.: GrandpaOks, please stop calling me PapaLars. :D
Yes, and one more thing. The first row usually consists of weak units. And champions can't break through it. So, they can only play when they are either facing overwhelming odds or when they are in a very advantageous position.
that's exactly what I'm talking about. But even if they are facing overwhelming odds, like in the recent arenas - 64 champions or 32 angels to choose from - I conducted a test battle - nothing can be done with champions, it's a guaranteed loss. Of course, this is assuming that the opponent knows how to think and play. Lars
A lord has been found! And you can even achieve a good position in limited conditions. As I said, you can just run in circles.
you won't get far running in circles when you're cornered by all sorts of weak units. You won't even be able to take a step, let alone run in circles. And again, it depends on the terrain of the battlefield.
I put spearmen because it doesn't make sense to put ballistae (we're talking about one castle; if there are many castles, then ballistae are used there), as it's very difficult to drag them around with you at the beginning of the game... Although, it's a very powerful weapon, no doubt. If you do build them, you need to bring them to decisive battles and castle sieges. Although they can also be used for defense... I used to always build monks, now I build crusaders. If I have many castles, I build both in a ratio of approximately 4:6 for 10 castles. Although, both are good. I'm used to building champions. Because they help to get out of not very serious battles without losses, thanks to their first strike.
Someone asked me about teleporting hippos into the enemy base. I'll answer here since there's no other place to respond on the forum. The probability of a teleport appearing near a Barbarian is so low that such outcomes are about as common as a powerful pirate stack. ;)
What kind of tricks do you use to win tough battles?
Most likely with Crusaders.
With such low speed, Champions aren't very dangerous in wait mode.
But why would you put them in wait mode? Buff them up and charge! You yourself wrote that their wait mode isn't very effective, so you can surprise an opponent who is used to battles starting with all their troops retreating into wait mode:D
You won't get far if you're cornered by all sorts of junk. You won't even be able to take a step, let alone move in circles. And again, it depends on the terrain.
But that's a matter of player skill. In that case, you can not only slow down the Angels but also clip their wings;)
2 oxygen_hl, you should have posted this in "Power Buildings." Oh well, let it be here, otherwise it will be taken out of context.
Отдай свои прошлые сны, В сомненьях себя обрети, В бешеном танце душа кружится! Не думай, что будет потом, Здесь и сейчас мы живем, Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!
Most likely, it's by overwhelming the opponent with numbers, as you can build up to level 4 faster than your rival. And they arrive right away :) I can't think of any other strategies for using champions... Since champions are the choice of a player with limited resources. I don't think there can be any other motivation for building them. Angels are superior in terms of price/quality ratio in any case. Although, of course, a player with angels can lose to a player with champions if the latter is more experienced ;) But we are discussing units here, not strategists.
I used to always build monks, now I build crusaders. If I have many castles, I build both in a ratio of approximately 4:6 for 10 castles. Although, both are good.
By using two types of level 3 units at once, you are sacrificing one hero... which would definitely be useful. And besides, you are reducing the striking power of both resulting stacks. But since you mentioned a large number of castles, you probably meant playing against the AI? If so, then any choice will work, what else is there to discuss :smile02:
you won't get far when you are cornered by all sorts of trash. you won't be able to move, let alone go in circles. and again - it depends on the terrain.
And who can corner champions with "trash" except for the Nature faction? I don't think anyone else can. Other races simply don't have that much trash to spare :) And if that's the case, then it turns out that the only weakness of champions is their vulnerability to druids? I'm not trying to "defend" them, these units are quite mediocre, but it is worth noting that their speed boost combined with the first strike ability is a serious cause for concern.
that's what I'm saying. but even if there are a lot of them, as in the recent arenas - 64 champions or 32 angels to choose from - I ran a test battle - nothing can be done with champions, it's a clear loss. of course, provided that the opponent knows how to think and play a little.
I completely agree. If we consider the ratio of 2 champions = 1 angel, then the latter definitely win. However, if we are playing on a small, resource-poor map, where you can reach the opponent as early as the second week, then champions will show themselves to be a quite decent unit.
Как можно сделать мутную воду прозрачной? - Не трогай её, и она очистится сама. :smile04:
Who else can effectively "choke" champions with low-level units, if not the Nature faction? In my opinion, no one. Other races simply don't have access to that many low-level units. And if that's the case, then it turns out that the only weakness of champions is their vulnerability to druids? I'm not trying to "defend" them; these units are quite mediocre, but it's worth noting that their ability to quickly gain experience, combined with their first strike, is a serious cause for concern.
They are easily overwhelmed by any army due to the terrain.
By using two types of level 3 units at once, you sacrifice one hero...which would definitely be useful. And besides, you reduce the attack power of both resulting stacks. But since you mentioned a large number of castles, you probably meant playing against the AI? If so, then any choice will work, so what's there to discuss?
I agree about the hero, but on many online maps of sizes S and M (for player vs. player), there is an additional castle, and even two additional castles. Examples: heartwinter, If These Walls Could Talk, showdown.
Отдай свои прошлые сны, В сомненьях себя обрети, В бешеном танце душа кружится! Не думай, что будет потом, Здесь и сейчас мы живем, Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!
oxygen_hl
