Posts from Турнир с HeroesPortal

The heroic Community of the Russian-speaking internet cannot always, or even should, be divided based on the resource they use. There is no need to ask questions like "who do you love more, your father or your mother?". I know only a few good players about whom one could say "they are from this or that resource." Moreover, in the second Heroes of Might and Magic online, it was precisely through interaction between players that it became possible to hold tournaments – simply because there aren't that many people playing this particular version on each specific resource... The players and the tournament organizers in this version are constantly in communication, and almost all the people who actually play are registered on our website. I have met with both players from the Portal and from the League – they are good people!
In general, if a person comes to us from another resource and wants to play for the team representing our forum, it is up to the coaching staff to decide.

P.S. If the League and the Portal were to play a match online in the second Heroes of Might and Magic, I would offer myself as a substitute player for any team that was short on players...

We have reached the following agreement with the online leaders of the Portal: it would be desirable to play a match in Heroes of Might and Magic III – especially since the leading players of the Portal are already participating in our team tournament. The match is planned to be held only after the team tournament is completed, no earlier than July; by that time, the players will have an idea of what the opposing team is like. The division of players based on their affiliation with a particular resource is quite clear in Heroes of Might and Magic III, and thank goodness for that. Currently, there is a team of seven players from each resource; in my opinion, we would like to have more, around 10-12 players. In the future, we plan to hold a large random tournament in Heroes of Might and Magic III, of course, a joint one, but not before autumn. If players of Heroes of Might and Magic V can join us, it will be great.

For players with a rating of 5, there are total inconsistencies with HP, the game version, and the type of competition.

Wow, I really stirred things up, I apologize, I didn't mean to.

There are total inconsistencies with HP, the game version, and the type of competition for those who always get top marks.

Regarding the tournament, here's what I would say. Undoubtedly, playing with the mod has its own peculiarities; it might even result in a slightly different game. Of course, some practice is needed here as well. However, since there probably won't be any more patches, and in Heroes 5, there are obvious things that dominate and that players usually focus on when developing their main hero, the game becomes somewhat one-sided – usually, players focus on upgrading machines and wasps. I don't think anyone will argue with that.
In principle, the mod balances many of these and other things. In principle, you can read about all the changes; now, there's also a changelog and a description of the changes for the mod. That is, if someone wants to understand the game with the mod, they can easily do so.
Based on my own experience playing, for example, on the fixes, and playing with and without the mod, I would rate the degree of balance differently.

Here, I would suggest the following: perhaps before the inter-portal tournament, if the decision is made to hold it with the mod, we could hold our own internal tournament on this resource – to get a feel for what the mod is like, and ultimately, to practice. Of course, there will still be many opponents after that when playing with the mod. But I think these will be the players who haven't really grasped it, or who simply don't know how to play.

I'll say right away that I'm not promoting the mod; if you read my posts on the League, you'll see that I've always approached it critically, but partly, the criticism of the mod also served as a starting point for its improvement.
Conclusion: I suggest holding a preliminary online tournament with the mod (TE) – a tournament is the best way to get acquainted with something new in real combat gaming conditions.

However, since it seems there will be no more patches

Where did this info come from? I think I heard that version 3.1 is just around the corner ...

and in Heroes 5 there are obvious things that rule and which the main hero is usually built for, so the game becomes partly one-sided - as a rule, upgrading machines and wasps. I think no one will argue with that.

Well, everyone can still do it - meaning conditions are equal ...
Every game has flaws - this problem reminds me of the problem with Heroes 3 players - there are people who practically scream that "newbies" play SoD - while all the "real ..." play on TE etc.
In any case, a fan version cannot be as popular as the original or an addon, and therefore holding large-scale Competitive events is simply foolish (irrational) ... you could have a small closed Tournament or mess around on a separate resource, especially since the Heroes 5 mod, as I understand it, is still very young and hasn't undergone mass testing ... the only step towards the mod, IMHO, would be to add a point in the rules - that if players mutually agree to play on the mod - then it is allowed - which simply needs to be indicated in the report (for reference).
P.S. And most importantly - a player playing on the mod knows the original and will have no particular trouble returning and playing decently on 3.0 - but for someone unfamiliar with the mod - just to remember and feel all those changes in practice - they need to play at least 2 games with each race ...

P.S. And the most important thing is that a player who uses the mod knows the original and will not have much trouble going back and playing on version 3.0 properly - but for a person who is not familiar with the mod, in order to remember and feel all those changes in practice, they need to play at least twice with each faction...

No, it's not a problem; I play both the original and the modded version, and there is no difference for me. And regarding getting used to it, the changes are hardly noticeable; some moments just don't work as well in the game, and that's all. Those who have played the mod know this. The best way to test the theories is through practice. And without it, they will just be simple arguments.
Playing twice with all the factions - well, is that really a problem? It's not even about that; you just need to try it and decide for yourself what is more interesting, and there is no need to force yourself to play with or without the mod.

I laughed a lot, especially about "the attractiveness of HeroesWorld."
Just to clear up any misconceptions right away, I personally, as the mod creator, contacted people from Nival (for example, from the marketing department and the department handling GSC). They said something like, other projects are taking up time, so who knows when the patch will be. Just a reminder that rumors about the patch have been going on since last fall ))). "soon, soon, soon,...soon?.... hahaha I heard SOON!..............". Do you keep naively believing in this?
As my father says: "People who can do something and want to do it — do it, while those who don't want to do it find any excuse." I'm not going to campaign for anyone to play the mod. I'll gladly read this thread, because it's always fun to smile at people's cluelessness ):smile04: Guys, relax — play whatever you want. If you don't like the idea of the mod itself, the original is always at your service. If you like it, you're welcome to our camp. If you have any questions, we'll always help and explain. Moreover, every player who can reasonably and sensibly explain their position has a chance to influence the mod. For example: Kolobok, wanted to, tried it, played it, criticized it — improved the mod.

By the way, I heard a great argument: if a player is strong, they play both versions well. Well yes, a strong chess player can also play Chapayev very well, let's organize a Chapayev tournament then )))

P.S. The portal will find 5 good 3.0 players, but will HeroesWorld find 5 good TE players? The strongest players really play TE, simply because it's MORE INTERESTING and they like it more, that's why they certainly won't want to play 3.0. But if HeroesWorld is really struggling to accept TE, then for the sake of the tournament, I think we could return to 3.0.

Well, it seems we're really in trouble with duels — we're noobs here (and can't field a decent lineup. Sorry... The duels turned out to be uninteresting.

....I will gladly read this thread because it’s always fun to laugh at someone's stubbornness ) ....Great phrase. I never expected such a person to sink so low... And you definitely can't call this stubbornness.... Conservatism is more accurate. Stubbornness means not knowing about something and therefore not using it. But conservatism means knowing but preferring the old ways.

Regarding testing Tournaments, let's look at the topic /topic/4407/. It says that if a test tournament for Tournaments is held, few people will play in it because most people are not interested in Tournaments.

....Well, with duels, there seems to be a real problem - we are newbies here and won't be able to put together a decent team. Sorry... Duels turned out to be uninteresting.......

But what about this being the main point?! What if Tournaments isn't interesting to us – isn't that a counter-argument?????

The same can be said about.....p.s. The portal will find 5 good players for version 3.0, but will ХВ find 5 good players for Tournaments?

ХВ will find 10 worthy players for duels; will the portal find them???

So I already wrote on the portal, and someone else mentioned it here. ХВ is willing to compromise and refuses to participate in duels. The portal is willing to meet ХВ halfway, and we will play on the original version. In my opinion, this is the only compromise.

P.S. And this is despite the fact that I am in favor of Tournaments, and I have even been advocating for it here. But in my opinion, the portal has enough people to choose from for Tournaments. As for ХВ, I’m sure they don’t, and I don’t expect them to in the near future. Also, I heard a wonderful argument from Moza on the portal: "The most important thing is that the game should be fun!!!" I am confident that 5 people from ХВ could try out Tournaments and play in a tournament, but I'm not sure if the competition would be exciting and interesting. So decide for yourselves.

conservatism in the sense of being traditional. Being a conservative is cool) I know from experience.
We are trying to find a way to play that will suit both portals. Duels are out, TE is out. That leaves original fixes or randoms (I assume you haven't tried fan-made templates either due to "conservatism"?).
Accordingly, we will play on 3.0. The only thing left to decide is what to play on).

P.S. By the way, almost all players from the league and the portal tell me, "Just forget about these noobs, why bother trying to convince them of anything?" Personally, I still hope that this is not the case and that you have some reasonable people on Hv who can break out of their conservatism and at least try the mod, maybe it's not as scary as it seems?

Duels are definitely a different game. There's no desire to compete with the "Chapayevites."

Yeah, we've had quite an interesting discussion here...
Regarding the appeal of the Hive, you can laugh as much as you want, but it seems we have a lot of inexperienced players who are easily swayed. Lately, we've been getting a lot of criticism from people from other, more experienced communities, saying that we're not good enough because we don't play The Eastern Expansion. But nobody has abolished ethics yet, and whether or not someone wants to play a certain game is their own business. And no matter how much you say there's no propaganda, all the talk has turned into insults directed at our entire community, simply because most of us don't play The Eastern Expansion. Questions about this topic have become rhetorical on the Hive, because we're tired of defending ourselves against you "enlightened" people. Those who want to play The Eastern Expansion do, and those who don't, well, we'll just have to accept that and move on. We have a thread dedicated to The Eastern Expansion, and those who are interested can download the mod and check out the changes it brings. My friends from the Hall of Legends also said that such a tournament is destructive and hinders the integration of the Heroes community. My gut feeling also doesn't bode well with your attitude. Notice that we're not imposing anything; it was you who made the offer, and we gladly accepted. If the Heroes Portal doesn't want to play, then they don't have to. We already have a good number of players and a solid tournament schedule on our "noobish" forum, and the overall strength of our players is only growing, thanks to the growth of our player base and the large migration of very strong players from other communities, who, for example, don't see it as a disgrace to play duels.
Before the tournament starts, you should decide whether you even want to participate, because it seems like you don't. And I apologize to Sir Zerzes and Nagan-4, but I doubt that with this attitude from the Heroes Portal, our players will still be willing to participate in this competition.
I really hope I'm wrong, so I'll summarize the current situation: version 3.0. We'll agree on the maps. Please tell me, have some of the issues been fixed in your templates, such as the lack of mana wells or non-functional roads on snow, or is this only fixed when the mod is installed?

I laughed a lot, especially about the "appeal of HotA."
To immediately dispel rumors, I personally, as the mod's creator, contacted people from Nival (for example, from the marketing department and the department dealing with GSC). They said that other projects are taking up their time, so they don't know when a patch will be released. I remind you that rumors about a patch have been circulating since last autumn. "Soon, soon, soon... soon?... Aha, I heard 'SOON!'... Are you still naively believing that?"
As my father says: "People who can do something and want to do it, do it, and those who don't want to do it, find any excuse." I'm not going to encourage anyone to play the mod. I will gladly read this thread, because it's always fun to laugh at such stubbornness :smile04: People, relax - play whatever you want. If you don't like the mod's idea, the original game is always at your service. If you like it, welcome to our humble abode. If you have any questions, we will always help and tell you. Besides, every player who can reasonably and clearly explain their position has a chance to influence the mod. For example: Kolobok wanted to, tried, played, criticized - and improved the mod.

I heard a great argument: if a player is strong, they play well in both versions. Well, a strong chess player can also play Chapayev very well, so let's organize a Chapayev tournament.)))

P.S. The portal will find 5 good players for 3.0, but will HotA find 5 good players for TE? The strongest players really play TE, simply because it's MORE INTERESTING and they like it more, so they won't want to play 3.0, of course. But if it's really difficult to get people to accept TE on HotA, then for the sake of a tournament, they can return to 3.0, in my opinion.

Well, it seems that duels are really a problem - we are noobs here and we won't be able to put together a decent team. Sorry... Duels are not interesting.

I will be brief - it's unpleasant to read, he wrote as if he were a "king" for whom the concepts of tact and respect are unknown. When one of our HotA players allowed himself to be sarcastic about the duel capabilities of the HP, we condemned his statements, he understood and apologized. That's enough for me to be proud of my portal, and the game is just a game, sir_moz:smile48:

Added 38 minutes ago

"Stubbornness" in the sense of conservatism. It's cool to be conservative) I know it myself.
We are trying to find a way to play that will suit both portals. Duels are out, TE is out. That leaves the original game with fixes or random maps (I assume you haven't tried fan-made templates because of "stubbornness"?).
So, we will play on 3.0. It remains to decide on what).

P.S. By the way, almost all the players from the league and the portal tell me, "Come on, forget about these noobs, why bother trying to convince them of anything?" I personally still hope that this is not the case and that you on HotA still have some reasonable people who can break out of conservatism and at least try the mod, maybe it's not as scary as it seems?

Duels are definitely a different game. There's no need to compare. No one wants to compete in Chapayev.

It seems to me that this guy is just making fun of us. If he is the leader of HP and authorized to negotiate, then I personally refuse to participate in any tournaments with this resource. If it doesn't work out, if there are disagreements, let's leave the idea for better times. Why pour out all this verbal garbage, attaching labels of "noobism," "stubbornness," and "incompetence" to the entire resource, and in addition, anonymously refer to similar unpleasant statements by "almost all the players in the league":mad: Who are you, that you allow yourself to say such things?????

I was forced to register after all.) 1. Well, Moz has a rather sharp temper. There are occasional heated discussions both on the portal and in the league. Just consider it an element that enlivens the discussion. From experience, I know that the sharp edges will soon smooth out, and it will be better to discuss constructive ideas. 2. I'm not a hero master (unlike Moz, who has won many things), but I play at a good level and have played a lot, and I also played in 3.0. 3. I initially argued that the mod was premature, that a patch would be released, and Nival would fix everything themselves. Half a year has passed... 4. Templates. Unfortunately, I didn't have time to study the templates that were released in 3.0, but I studied the previous ones thoroughly, I know everything. There were more or less playable ones – 3-6 of them. The most tournament-oriented one was B3. However, it is nowhere near as interesting as the custom templates we are discussing. By the way, several strong players and Moz, who implements and adjusts, balances, and catches bugs based on suggestions (and doesn't just do everything himself, although he does that too), took part in their creation. He will be happy if any of you take part in creating new templates, even at the level of ideas. You can find the templates with the latest changes here (our league is, I think, neutral territory?). There are also discussions, diagrams, etc. If you have any questions about the templates, I will be happy to answer them (but not about the technical aspects of creating them – that's for Moz). http://forum.heroesleague.ru/viewtopic.php?t=4247&start=60&sid=3a9deabe257c9911a3bad8e86e06a422 Here are the discussions. http://forum.heroesleague.ru/viewtopic.php?t=7029&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=330 Here is the latest version of the mod, which is also a set of templates. And here are the discussions, suggestions, and criticism of the mod. By the way, you can play these templates without the mod. 5. The mod. It is definitely not perfect yet and is still in the optimization stage. By the way, reasoned comments and suggestions are taken into account. I don't understand everything myself, and I don't like to delve into the numbers. But the global changes he made, in my opinion, are what make this game "Heroes" again, like in the 3rd part. There was a tournament on the league without the mod, on the fixed version... Mostly fast maps, though. 90% of the games are about machinery and anti-machinery. Is this "Heroes"? Okay, let's say there are larger maps or templates. But even on most of these templates, the most likely time for the first encounter is the 6th week. At this point, the Order and Ice factions are still very decisive. But what's worse is that other "tricks" of 3.0 start to be used here. And the game lasts a long time – for example, 6 hours – and what's the result? In the end, there will be a Dark with a BPD and 2 stalkers (the risk is zero – only shackles, the effect is clear); or a Dwarf with a BPD and a resurrection rune and the resurrection itself. And so on, including Orcs with their shield, including the amusing Vengeance, Path of War, etc. I'm not saying that it's not fun to play "who has the coolest mega-blaster" sometimes. But this is no longer "Heroes". "On the 30th turn, the grandmaster used a new trick." This is an overabundance of decisive skill combinations (1-3 for each race in a long game and 1 in a fast game). Plus, luck/bad luck in obtaining them quickly. You probably can't even imagine how difficult it is to give up on machinery or logistics or evasion for a BPD (depending on the race and map). Removing the multi-variant development from the Heroes is, for me, removing the game itself (well, it's still fun to play for 2-3 months, or sometimes for variety). If I'm being completely honest, even with the mod, there are still too few development options for the races in the 5th game (but without the mod...). 6. I'm already confused about who is from which resource. Most people don't have a specific attachment to a site. But there will definitely be strong players from the portal on TE. I think we can gather some from 3.0, we'll lure Kolobok over (just kidding), but there's no certainty, and many strong players will refuse. And don't take this refusal as arrogance. It's just that there are now many tournaments on the league and there is always an active platform on the portal where you can usually find someone to play with. And after trying something good, why would they want to go back to something bad (in their opinion, and in mine)? And so far, there hasn't been anyone who, after playing, said, "No, I don't like it, I'm going back to 3.0" (but many don't even want to try – that's true). Comments and criticism, however, are welcome. In general, if your position is firm, then the recruitment of participants from the Portal for 3.0 depends, in my opinion, on the timing of the event. If there is a tournament on the mod on the league at the same time, almost everyone will be more interested in playing there. If not, we will try to gather a team too, but many people don't really have a specific attachment to a site, people just play everywhere and don't worry about where they are from

Dear Sir моз. Trying to prove the meaning of words to someone whose mother is the dean of the philology department is, in my opinion, utter foolishness. Calling someone "obtuse" is even more offensive. It doesn't suit you, I assure you. I repeat and urge you to remain calm (I have communicated with you about the mod; you even said then that you were surprised that I was interested in this mod, and although I consider myself a noob, I am well aware of all the advantages of the Tactical Engine and that all the best players use it, but at the same time, I perfectly understand that it will not be possible to gather so many decent players for the Hive version in any case, and I want the competition to be interesting first and foremost). In general, my opinion, in a slightly modified form, is as follows: If you come to a compromise, invite me to play on the Hive. If you don't, don't invite me. I'm already opening this page, knowing that someone will again impose their opinion on someone else in their post... In my opinion, this is not heroic. Someone here has to give in. We have already given in with the duels... Maybe we will give in with the Tactical Engine as well, but this will not make you, esteemed portal users, look any better. I understand that we are all noobs and so on. But can't you come down from your high horse just to play? Finally... Tournaments for duels are held on the League even more often... So go there and say that lazy people play duels. I think they will have a lot of nice things to say to you there. And I think that people like us are especially pleasant to everyone... Maybe you are a good player and a modder, but you are a terrible person. And you don't know how to have a dialogue.

Okay, let's put an end to the arguments once and for all. Who I consider to be a good player on HotA is my business, and I personally don't consider anyone a noob until I've played with them. Also, my opinion about local players not even wanting to try a couple of games is my business. Let's leave it at that. Valgalla, out of respect for you personally, I'm willing to completely stop these verbal squabbles. Now, let's get to the point, so that each player can weigh the options: 1) On the original game and on HotA, roads don't work on snow, wells, trees, Silvan settlements, bandit camps, and sunken Temples don't generate. Standard HotA maps are very poorly playable (you'll have to take my word for it; I've played many maps over and over again, and I can say that from the point of view of not just a "pro," but an ordinary player, it's simply boring to play them after 1-2 games: a) they are half-empty, b) many of them essentially resemble a map fix (whoever gets to the center first wins), c) they are completely devoid of tactical nuances. 2) Fixed maps (both fan-made and standard) are, of course, more balanced and better populated, but they still have the main drawback that they don't change – that is, the game will resemble an offline battle between two players – whoever does better with the monsters wins. The strategic part is almost completely absent. Also, someone who has played a map 20 times has a significant advantage over someone who hasn't played it at all. 3) Fan-made maps: they are MUCH better balanced (even without a mod), the population is fine, they have a very different tactical layout (currently there are 9 maps that are very different from each other), with a strong strategic component. A player who has played a map 20 times has almost the same chance of winning as someone who has never played it, because both have approximately the same information about the map (thanks to the map layout). Since there are layouts for all maps with a description of the zones. That is, for example, even if I have played the Spider map 50,000 times, I still don't know the map much better than someone who comes and sees it for the first time. In addition, we have the opportunity to choose from fan-made maps either those that will have a long game, or choose mega-fast maps to speed up the gameplay. And the main advantage of fan-made maps is that they were helped by not 10, but many more players, among whom there were both very strong players (who naturally wanted to improve the game) and newcomers who moved the process in their direction. Don't think that I just made them up and am advertising them here. Therefore, let everyone think about it and express their opinion about what they prefer and what they are willing to spend their time on.

Added 1 minute ago

Maybe you are a good player and modder, but you are NO kind of person. And you don't know how to have a dialogue.

But somehow, I don't even feel offended. Maybe because I can see the log in my own eye? Yes, by the way, think about it: is it pleasant to have a dialogue with people who are offered something from the heart – "take this cool thing, you don't have to do anything special, just try it." And in response: "Oh, no, that's terrible, why do I need it, leave me alone, you're even being rude to me." Does this create a positive attitude towards these people?

As I’ve said many times, I don’t understand all this. Haven’t you gotten tired of playing this “democracy” game? Someone took the initiative, created something, and established criteria. They asked: do you agree? No? They discussed it privately with the judges from other resources. What’s the point of this public spectacle?

And of course, players aren’t divided by resource; they’re not sheep, excuse me. It’s about individual rankings, and there are no difficulties.

I won’t talk about the advantages of the Tournament Engine. Those who aren’t narrow-minded can see them anyway, and I don’t have the energy to try to convince the others. I’m amazed by your energy and patience, Alexey.