Jebus King version selection on SNGonline — Online Tournaments

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Registered: 12/10/2018 8:47 AM UTC

Posts: 4

5/5/2020 9:18 PM UTC #33

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Dear MKS, since I was the one who conducted the negotiations with you regarding the template, allow me to express my opinion in the thread you created. On behalf of the studio, you were offered to stop making endless changes to the template, name it Jebus King, and acknowledge your authorship in the description. At the same time, you were offered further cooperation in promoting any of your templates within our studio. All these proposals were made in a very polite and respectful manner after we realized that neither I nor Sergey were involved in creating the new version. It was a complete surprise to us when a new version appeared after 2.41d. You refused because you had a different opinion about the further development of the template. You wanted to constantly change and refine it. You were offered to keep the template name invented by the studio (and the brand "Jebus King," in which the studio invested money and which is now associated with our studio), come up with a new name, and have the opportunity to post it on our resources. You were also offered to hold Tournaments on behalf of the studio using your templates. You refused. The negotiations ended without any result. We decided to develop the template without relying on your opinion. And you were banned after you allowed insults and profanities directed at me in private messages on Twitch. After that, any negotiations became impossible. Sincerely, Ilya "profiler" Anishchenko

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Registered: 12/23/2011 8:08 AM UTC

Posts: 2,462

5/6/2020 12:00 AM UTC #34

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And here's what I have to say about this

Version 2.5 is 95% a copy of my work. Therefore, I should be credited as the author, and there should be at least a link to the original somewhere on the site. This is quite reasonable.

Your work is an implementation based on someone else's template, using 95% of someone else's ideas. You yourself mentioned this, but you are the one making claims and demands...

In reply to yaddex

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Registered: 9/18/2018 7:31 PM UTC

Posts: 70

5/6/2020 2:11 AM UTC #35

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yaddex

You were banned after you allowed offensive remarks and insults directed at me in private messages on Twitch. After that, any negotiations are essentially impossible.

Sincerely, Ilya “profiler” Anishchenko

Actually, it was after communicating with you that I started thinking about leaving the project. To be frank, I don't like the way you express your thoughts. "In a very polite and respectful manner" – this is definitely debatable.

Specifically in private messages, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I was banned BEFORE that. I remember it perfectly well. I understand that your memory only works in favor of your own arguments. I was banned because you have something to hide; you distort facts to fit your narrative.

yaddex

On behalf of the studio, you were asked to stop endlessly modifying the template, name it Jebus King, and include your authorship in the description.

That's not for you to decide. The template belongs to me and the players. I mean those who actually enjoy playing with it, not just because they are paid by MCS Studio. Plus, I'm already done with experimental versions; the main focus now is on a single version for the lobby, based on player feedback.

No one asked you to promote my template. No one sold it to you. No contracts were concluded. The JK brand is just some wild fantasy. I agreed to use the name to support the tournament (and it sounded better), and I still have a reference to MCS Studio in the description. As soon as you remove my template from your website, I will immediately change the name.

I considered collaboration proposals and suggested finding a compromise that would satisfy both parties.
You didn't agree to this because Freeman wants to do everything his way, period. Without considering what the players want, without considering the new generation of players who don't care about such restrictive magic systems as in 2.5.

For me, the players come first, which is why I couldn't agree to your terms. My goal is to create a template that will serve as both a good introduction to Heroes multiplayer and an alternative to the mirror map. I honestly don't understand what MCS Studio's goals are.

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Registered: 11/5/2008 1:12 PM UTC

Posts: 914

5/6/2020 2:27 AM UTC #36

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A toad ate a viper, what a damn circus, guys, kittens.
In any order.

P.S.: But if we talk about the substance, I'm sick of the template (this is regarding the work you've done). Neither this nor that, neither fish nor fowl, chewing gum from the Heroes series.
I'm playing purely out of respect for Freeman, and it seems like the latest version is more or less decent. But it's not for me to judge, this is just an outside perspective.

http://www.youtube.com/c/Stingergames

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Registered: 9/18/2018 7:31 PM UTC

Posts: 70

5/6/2020 2:44 AM UTC #37

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HellLighT

And here's about this:

Your work is implementing it based on someone else's template, 95% of which consists of other people's ideas. You yourself mentioned this, but you're the only one making claims and demands...

As I said, you're the only one who can claim co-authorship of the template, so tell us about your contribution in detail. Show logs from our chat, look at what was in the early versions for comparison, etc.

Naturally, no one will bother with this, trying to figure out who came up with what. I implemented it, I collected feedback from players, and that's it. If you can do better, go ahead.
And for now, template creation is generally a thankless and time-consuming task (especially templates like JK, which are packed with all sorts of changes). And no one wants to do it. It's thankless because, firstly, the chances that anyone will even try to play a new template are very small. JK is a phenomenon in this regard; without Freeman, who fell in love with this template, no one would know about it now. I have no problem admitting this; I try to be friends with facts and reality. But this doesn't give him the right to dictate his terms and disregard the opinions of other people.*

Added 4 minutes later

=Stinger=

And to get to the point, I'm sick of the template (this is in response to the work you've done). It's neither one thing nor the other, neither fish nor fowl, just chewing gum from Heroes.
I'm only playing out of respect for Freeman, and it seems like the latest version is more or less decent.

So, the latest version was made according to your dictates, Stinger. You could say Stinger King is the one who shaped it.

See, even poor Stinger is disgusted by JK. Why listen to the feedback of a person who initially doesn't like the idea of the template? What's the point of adapting something for players who don't want to play it? There are already excellent templates for them: JC, 6lm10a, G+U, Clash, etc.

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Registered: 11/5/2008 1:12 PM UTC

Posts: 914

5/6/2020 2:46 AM UTC #38

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HAHAHAHAHAHA

You're so out of touch that I don't even feel like arguing.

I'm sick of the constant changes.
There are so many versions of this mess that it's hard to keep track, and it seems like that's what sparked your internal conflict.
But just so you know, I haven't made a single suggestion (except maybe wishing they'd add a utopia).
As far as I know, Hell and Gom are the main creators. I was happy with the first version.

P.S.: Stinger Tzar, remember that.
P.S.S.: And what's with this habit of making baseless accusations? I've read similar things from you in this thread several times... It seems like you're the rat who got the Studio banned for a while, right? And it happened right after your disagreements, literally the next day.
You reported something, and voilà? Go ahead, argue.

http://www.youtube.com/c/Stingergames

In reply to =Stinger=

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Registered: 9/18/2018 7:31 PM UTC

Posts: 70

5/6/2020 3:05 AM UTC #39

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=Stinger=

HAHAHAHAHAHA

You're so out of touch that I don't even feel like arguing.

But just so you know, I haven't made a single suggestion (maybe except for wishing to add a utopia).
Mostly, Hell and Gom are the creators, as far as I know.

Jokes don't translate very well over the internet, what can you do.
Hell and Gom are the ones I asked for their opinion about tweaking the versions. That doesn't make them creators; Hell and I simply had similar opinions about the development of the template from the beginning. That's the whole story.

Recently, he was talking about how to reduce the number of obstacles on the road; I made a test version, and it actually works. The number of obstacles has decreased significantly.

=Stinger=

P.S.S.: And what is this habit of making baseless accusations? I've read similar things from you in this thread several times... It seems you're the rat who caused the Studio to be temporarily banned, right? Especially right after your disagreements, literally the next day.
You reported them, and voilà? Go ahead, deny it.

Here we go. What accusations did you see?
I have nothing to do with the studio ban. I didn't even think about reporting them. I watch their streams, even though I'm banned. I have nothing to hide.

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Registered: 11/5/2008 1:12 PM UTC

Posts: 914

5/6/2020 3:09 AM UTC #40

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See, Hell said it, and you did it. But that's not what's needed at all. Roadblocks are the price to pay for trading at a loss (for a red color or for buying an expensive castle). I don't understand how you can edit the template based on the opinion of one person. And if before I didn't understand why your paths diverged from the Studio, now everything is clear to me. Good luck in finding the right balance and all that.

http://www.youtube.com/c/Stingergames

In reply to =Stinger=

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Registered: 4/29/2007 10:30 AM UTC

Posts: 11,704

5/6/2020 6:19 AM UTC #41

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Guys, Kittens

I was offered to remove the magic and wisdom boxes. Would that be better?

I think this speaks volumes. Someone simply suggests removing something, and he's already ready to do it.

Guys, Kittens

Jebus Cross is a completely different template; the only thing Cross and King have in common is the number of zones and their arrangement.

I don't think so. The number of zones and their arrangement are already sufficient, and the Jebus King template is just one of the many modifications of the Jebus Cross template (Poor Jebus, JCC, Jebus Native, etc.), and there will be even more. Therefore, there can be no talk of authorship. It's just ridiculous.

Guys, Kittens

The template belongs to me and the players.

:smile07:

Guys, Kittens

No one asked you to promote my template.

Without MSStudio, your template would be forgotten, and no one would even remember it, and it would remain with 8 warrior graves in the center as an attempt at "balance." At best, it would end up in the same category as JCC or Jebus Native, etc. Has anyone heard of the Chaton Souverain template, or does anyone actively play the Survival template? Where are they all? :confused: Therefore, if you think that without promotion, your work is worth something, take off your rose-colored glasses.

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Registered: 12/23/2011 8:08 AM UTC

Posts: 2,462

5/6/2020 11:37 AM UTC #42

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When I helped with the template, I wasn't thinking about authorship or anything like that. I just wanted to genuinely improve the template and contribute something to enhance the game. I understand that you put a lot of effort into the result, but it feels like the whole situation stems from resentment and a quarrel, and it's not worth it, in my opinion. I believe that the template doesn't belong to anyone, and anyone can use it. Everyone has the opportunity to play the version they like. And if a specific version is required for a tournament, then that's how it should be.
P.S. I think that if you're doing something like template creation, it should be seen as a hobby, not a job. If it brings in income, that's great, but after that, you shouldn't start treating it like a job and demanding something.

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Registered: 12/15/2015 4:48 PM UTC

Posts: 544

5/6/2020 12:02 PM UTC #43

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All of this is very similar to the classic case of "
“How to properly break up with a business partner.”

ICQ 694248141

In reply to HellLighT

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Registered: 1/14/2014 6:45 PM UTC

Posts: 1,111

5/6/2020 12:38 PM UTC #44

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HellLighT

When I was helping with the template, I wasn't thinking about authorship or anything like that. I just wanted to genuinely improve the template and contribute something to enhance the game. I understand that you put a lot of effort into the result, but it feels like the whole situation is due to resentment and a quarrel, and it's not worth it, in my opinion. The template doesn't belong to anyone, and anyone can use it. Everyone has the opportunity to play the version they like. And if a specific version is required for a tournament, then that's how it should be.
P.S. I think that if you're doing something like template creation, it should be seen as a hobby, not a job. If it brings in income, that's great, but after that, you shouldn't start treating it like a job and demanding something.

For the next Synergy, I'll make Jebus Synergy ;)

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Registered: 12/25/2014 10:00 AM UTC

Posts: 218

5/6/2020 12:53 PM UTC #45

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It would have been better if they had created a balanced "Jebus" for size L, by the way. That would have been interesting, new, fresh, and spectacular.

In reply to ЯR

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Registered: 12/23/2011 8:08 AM UTC

Posts: 2,462

5/6/2020 2:08 PM UTC #46

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YaR

I'm following the Synergy trend; I'll create a Jebus Synergy.

In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with that. If someone creates a template in the game, then everyone who has the right to play this game can freely use it without any guilt.