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Is it necessary to adjust the invisibility stat for Tower units?
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18 years ago
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Well, to be honest, yes... I take assassins because at the beginning, I don't notice that I have 500 mana, and there's really no need to hide; it's better to just shoot them down. A little later, yes, but at the beginning...
Well, generally speaking, at the very beginning of the game, if you manage to gather a decent number of archers and the mines aren't guarded by shooting neutrals, you can use archers; sometimes I do that. But later, I definitely upgrade to griffins.
The question remains: why don't other races even dream of these things? Why are they forced to act in the old way?
Night Stalkers. They hit hard, a little harder than witches shoot.
Witches usually shoot at the second half of the field, which means the damage will be halved, while Night Stalkers will always deal full damage.
Invisibility lasts exactly one turn, no matter how you move the Night Stalkers, so you need to have a very bad memory not to know where they are.
And have you seen how they (Night Stalkers) walk? To reach the end of the field, you need to admire this graceful but slow gait.
Well, if the choice of upgrade depends on how the unit moves... I don't even know what to say... I know that invisibility lasts for a turn, but if the opponent can't reach them, won't they be able to dispel the invisibility?
And how, for example, can you use the witches' sabbath with Erin? Will the Night Stalkers throw their whip?... And the spells cast by the whip? You hit a bunch of cyclops, cast berserk, who will be the nearest random target? Mass spells perfectly break invisibility.
Erin isn't the only hero in the game. I never rely on her ability. The ability of the witches themselves is sometimes annoying, but the Night Stalkers also have this drawback. Besides, the chance of casting berserk is 33 percent. And mass spells... Who will cast them? Either another hero with the "Expert" skill, or a mage. Well, and a dwarf. That's it. Not to mention that you won't be able to cast dark spells.
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
18 years ago
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How, for example, can you use the Witch Coven ability with Erin?
As far as I know, any witch can use it, even those who shouldn't be able to shoot in the first place. First, it's the most logical solution, and second, the ability itself is incredible, if only because when it activates, the witches can shoot at an adjacent stack, a friendly stack, or even themselves. O_o
O God of Earth and Altar,
Bow down and hear our cry,
Our earthly rulers falter,
Our people drift and die,
The walls of gold entomb us,
The swords of scorn divide,
Take not thy thunder from us,
Take away our pride.


G.K. Chesterton: English Hymnal
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18 years ago
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No, the Erin faction cannot shoot under the ground. I checked by creating a duel preset.
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
In reply to Vayshan
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18 years ago
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Vayshan;187600

After all, witches usually attack from the second half of the battlefield, which means their damage will be halved, while the Night Lords always deal full damage.

If the choice of upgrade depends on how the unit moves... I don't even know what to say... I know that invisibility takes up a turn, but if the enemy can't reach them, won't they be able to dispel the invisibility?

Erin is not the only hero of the Shadow League. I never rely on her ability. The ability of the witches themselves is sometimes annoying, but the Night Lords also have this drawback. Besides, the chance of a Berserker appearing is 33 percent. And who will cast mass spells?... Either another Shadow League hero or a mage. Or a gnome. And that's it. Not to mention that Dark spells cannot be cast.

But doesn't it matter that the Night Lords move only half the distance? Plus, witches have no retaliation when attacked.
"Full damage in most cases..." at the beginning of the battle - certainly.

I mean that the developers didn't intend for witches to be melee units, so they don't rush around the battlefield, kicking up dust like Rakshasa.
What exactly prevents the enemy? They can focus on destroying the other units, and when they're done, the invisibility will be over.

Erin. She is not the only hero of the Shadow League, but nevertheless, she is a HERO and has an ABILITY that should work.
"Whirlwind's quote" - "As far as I know, any witch can attack, even those who shouldn't be able to attack at all" - thanks, I'll check that out today.
Drawback. Night Lords don't need to engage enemy troops in melee combat, so this drawback rarely manifests itself.
Darkness. What about mass plague? Destructive Ray?
Mass spells.
Well, the Knight will probably take out all the troops first, cast Anti-Magic, and wait for the Night Lords to arrive.
The Demon will summon troops everywhere and pick off the Night Lords like the Holy Inquisition.
The Barbarian... will find a way. For example, with free Cyclops, they deal damage to multiple units at once.
The others will find a way, or they will take Chaos magic. They don't suffer much from the lack of mass spells.
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18 years ago
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Is it really a problem that the Night Lords only cover half the battlefield?
And is it a problem that they can do this multiple times?
What's stopping the opponent? They can focus on destroying the other units while the Night Lords are invisible, and by the time they're done, the invisibility will have worn off.
Invisibility is also needed to launch an unprovoked attack, not just to sit around doing nothing.
"Quote from Vortex" - "As far as I know, all witches can cast spells, even those who shouldn't be able to." - Thanks, I'll check that out today.
I've already checked and written about it.
Drawback. The Mistresses don't need to engage enemy troops in melee combat, so this drawback rarely manifests itself.
Darkness. What about mass plague? Disintegration Ray?
No, no mass spells of darkness affect invisible units. Only chaos spells, but there aren't many of those, and there aren't many races that are worth fearing.
Well, the Knight will probably wipe out all the troops first, cast Antimagic, and wait for the Night Lords to appear.
The Demon will summon troops everywhere and hunt down the Night Lords like the Holy Inquisition.
The Barbarian... will find a way, for example, by using Free Cyclops, which deal damage to multiple targets.
The others will find a way, or they'll use Chaos magic. They don't really suffer from the lack of mass spells.
Don't turn their ability into something incredibly overpowered. They probably won't even pay attention to the Night Lords, so making it their sole goal to find them at all costs is pointless. They will try to, of course, if possible, but not necessarily.
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
In reply to Vayshan
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18 years ago
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Vayshan;187662
Isn't it a problem that they can go there multiple times?

Invisibility is also needed to deliver an unreturned strike, not just to sit there.

I've already checked and written about it.

No, no mass dark spells affect invisible units. Only chaos, but there aren't that many of them, and not that many races worth fearing.

There's no need to exaggerate their ability and turn it into something incredibly overpowered. They probably won't even pay much attention to their owners, so setting a single goal to detect them at all costs is pointless. They will try if possible, but not necessarily.


Yes, they WALK there, but during this time, the Mistresses could shoot.

An unreturned strike once is not very effective; they will quickly target and eliminate them.

I know... sorry... I just realized it was too late the second after I wrote it. But I didn't delete it anyway, I was just too lazy. :)

Why don't they work? Was that also checked? And as for chaos spells... since removing invisibility by killing with chaos isn't that important, then chaos isn't a priority either.

And no one is calling them cheaters; I'm just saying that anyone can easily deal with invisibility if they want to.
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18 years ago
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Why aren't they working? Have you checked that as well?
Yes, I created two Necromancer heroes and a Warlock in the editor. I gave the Hunters and Mistresses the Invisibility spell, and the Necromancer general spells. It doesn't work on the invisible units.
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
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18 years ago
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Actually, WisTrit is right; if the Stalker's ability is an overpowered perk, then the invisibility of the Witch is just absurd. I tried playing in different ways, and here and there. By the time the upgraded Witches appear, invisibility is almost useless. In the endgame, it's just a nice feature, good for a single retaliatory strike, but no more. And about the piercing attack... what prevents you from still deploying only Stalkers? Or, in general, stop scrimping and fighting with a normal, large army?
Oh yes, the Witches only shoot at half the battlefield, which means they need two shots for full damage. Well, for full damage in one hit, our Mistresses also need at least two turns, the only difference being that anything can happen to them along the way, up to an encounter with the Devil, while the Witch will deal damage already in the first turn.
But all these arguments don't have a solid basis, since Witches are usually used to cast (de)buffs. You can say something now about splitting the Witches into single units (as I do), but if we're talking about the endgame, there are usually no more than two free slots, although sometimes that's enough.
And now imagine - they go invisible, and the attacks start targeting the Riders. Unpleasant, isn't it? Of course, the Witches are "more expensive and stronger," but the Riders are still tougher and can withstand even the strongest beatings, and you, of all people, Johnny, know that Riders are an indispensable unit in the final battle, very useful and strong.
The Mistresses, indeed, move very, very slowly, even the alternative Gargoyles don't move that slowly.
So, invisibility is great, but not so great that you should fanatically use it everywhere.
If I have a choice - to lose a couple of Hunters during a piercing attack, or to lose an extra five minutes painstakingly arranging, moving, and calculating all sorts of possible paths for the Witches, I'll choose the first. I love having fun, and that's what it's all about.
Первый, кто был забанен за Правду.
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18 years ago
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In the final stages, it's just a nice feature, good for a single, decisive strike, but nothing more.
What about immunity to Darkness and targeted spells?
What prevents you from still deploying only Stalkers? Or, in general, stop scrimping and fighting with a normal, large army?
I could defeat a significant number of Titans without any losses, simply by having only Stalkers and Mistresses (and, of course, a hero) on the battlefield, thanks to the Invisibility ability. But if I deployed everyone, I would get my butt kicked.
Witches only shoot at half the battlefield, which means they need two shots for full damage. Well, for full damage in one hit, our Mistresses also need at least two turns, the only difference being that anything can happen to them along the way, up to an encounter with a Devil.
In general, this unit, judging by its speed, is not designed for attack at all. They can calmly go invisible and wait for particularly agile enemies, and no one prevents them from casting spells while invisible.
And now imagine - they go invisible, and the attacks start hitting the Riders.
By that time, the Riders will either run to the other half of the battlefield (may they rest in peace) or get beaten by fast-attacking troops like Nightmares or Paladins. Everyone tries to eliminate them immediately; the Witches have nothing to do with it.
If I have a choice - to lose a couple of Hunters when breaking through, or to lose an extra five minutes painstakingly arranging, moving, and calculating all possible Witch movement paths, I will choose the first option.
Okay, if it's a couple, but what if it's a couple of dozen?
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
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18 years ago
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and no one stops you from quietly casting spells while invisible
but why do my sorceresses lose their invisibility as soon as they start casting spells?
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18 years ago
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Why do my sorceresses stop being invisible as soon as they start casting spells?
No, they don't become visible. I basically knew that, but I logged into the game and checked specifically. Most likely, you're just starting to cast spells when their invisibility is about to expire.
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...
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18 years ago
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Invisibility for Stalkers is clearly overpowered. It's perfectly normal for Witches. Why should all 6 stacks not have amazing abilities (Devour, Regeneration, +6, Touch of Death, etc.)? But the biggest imbalance is Battle Discipline for magical factions.
So many centuries
So many Gods
We were the prisoners of our own fantasy
But now we are marching
Against these Gods
I'm the wizard, I will change it all
Valhalla - Deliverance
Why've you ever forgotten me


19.08.2008 СК Олимпийский.Я запомню это навсегда!!!

Как играть онлайн в Герои 5??Ответ здесь
In reply to Shogun
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18 years ago
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Invisibility is overpowered, especially if there are more than 450 Stalkers and more than 45 Matriarchs.
Пришёл,увидел,нафлудил.
In reply to Visiteur
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18 years ago
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"That's an invis sham" - they're not shams, there's no need to insult anyone. :smile48:

"Even alternative gargoyles don't move that slowly" - you're right, gargoyles are a universal scourge. ;)

"What about immunity to darkness and targeted spells?" - What, do you have to cast spells on them? Besides, this immunity only lasts for 3 turns.

"I could defeat a decent number of Titans with only Stalkers and Matriarchs (and a hero, of course) on the battlefield without any losses, thanks to invisibility. But if I had deployed all my troops at once, I would have been crushed." - Well, that's just your case, not an axiom. Maybe someone else with different troops and stat distribution would have saved a turn by gathering all the troops.

"By that time, the Riders will either run to the other half of the field (may they rest in peace) or get beaten by fast attacking troops like Nightmares or Paladins. Everyone tries to eliminate them as quickly as possible; Witches have nothing to do with it." - It always seemed to me that at the beginning, everyone tries to disable as many ranged units as possible, but since there are no ranged units in this situation... the Riders end up in the fray anyway. And if the magic is good, why should they run to the other half of the field? Just stand there and watch as Nightmares, Succubi, and Devils are destroyed by a rain of meteors.

"Why do all 6 stacks have uber abilities (Devour, Regeneration, 6, Touch of Death, etc.), but they shouldn't have them?" - Well... everyone has them. :)
"But the biggest imbalance is Bdp" - Bdp... please explain.

"Invisibility is an imbalance, especially if there are more than 450 Stalkers and more than 45 Matriarchs." - What's going on with the enemy then?
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18 years ago
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"But what about invulnerability to darkness and targeted spells?" - Does it mean you absolutely have to cast them? Besides, this invulnerability lasts only 3 turns.
And it doesn't necessarily have to be cast on them specifically, because mass slow and other similar mass darkness spells will automatically affect everyone, but not the witches, thanks to invisibility. And 3 turns may seem like a short time when fighting neutrals, but in the endgame, it's a lot.
Well, that's just your case, not an axiom. Maybe someone else, with different troops and stat distribution, would have saved a turn by gathering all the troops.
The key word is "maybe." Anything is possible, but I've definitely verified what I wrote.
It always seemed to me that at the beginning, everyone tries to eliminate as many archers as possible, but since there are no archers in this situation... the riders will be caught in the fray anyway. And if the magic is good, why should they run to the other side of the field? Just stand there and enjoy watching the nightmares, along with the succubi and devils, decay under the meteor shower.
Actually, archers are not popular in the Dungeon faction for some reason. Apparently, their damage is too low. Compare the damage of the riders charging and the shot of the Sovereigns. There's no need to think about who to eliminate first. And they will still have to run, because if the battle is with a demon, where are you going to get mana if the imps steal it? And even if it's not a demon, everyone understands that you can't delay with the Dungeon faction; you need to attack immediately. And in this case, the riders might not be lucky if they end up facing paladins, for example. No, if you want to get the most out of them on the battlefield, you need to run without thinking. Otherwise, there will be no one left to run later.
"But the biggest imbalance is the Battle to the Death" - Battle to the Death... please explain.
The question is not for me, but I will explain: Battle to the Death, also known as БДП.
"Invisibility is an imbalance, especially if there are more than 450 Stalkers and more than 45 Matriarchs" - What's going on with the enemy then?
Yes, at this stage of the game, the Dungeon faction cannot win with invisibility or chaos. You definitely shouldn't bring the game to this point
Армия баранов под предводительством льва сильнее армии львов под предводительством барана.

God save us everyone
Will we burn inside the fires of a thousand suns...

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