Rating system for online games in Heroes of Might and Magic IV. — Online Tournaments

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Announcement

OptiMAL

18 years ago

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Rating system for HMM4 online games!
The rating will be updated after the completion of each Tournament. The table will be populated by players who have applied for HMM4 online tournaments.
The following rating system has been adopted:
Rnew=2/3Rold+1000((N-i)/(N-1)+((N-i)/(N-1))^3)(1+SumRold/6000) and divide by 10 so it is not too large a number and (+ kGw-k1Gl), where k, k1 are coefficients that will depend on the rating.
N- number of people in the tournament
i- place in the tournament
^- exponentiation.
Rold- old rating
Gw- games won
Gl- losses:)
Rating graduations on which coefficients k, k1 will depend:
Up to 500 units k = 3 k1 = 1
From 500 to 1500 k = 1.5 k1 = 2
from 1500 to 3000 k = 0.75 k1 = 3
from 3000 and above k = 0.5 k1 = 3.5

Rating point graduations with ranks:
0-150 novice
150-500 recruit
500-1000 warrior
1000-1500 Knight
1500-2250 crusader
2250-3000 champion
3000-3500 master
3500-above hero.

№	Player	Current rating	Wins	Losses
1	LeSHiJ-MaX	215,000(recruit)	5	0
2	Lu4ik	149.203(novice)	3	1
3	Арандор	101,296(novice)	2	1
4	Пандора	100,296(novice)	2	2
5	Zybr	38,037(novice)	1	2
6	Starhan	18,129(novice)	1	2
7	Драккошка	-3(novice)	0	3

Player statistics for LeSHiJ-MaX
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	0	0
Death	0	0
Chaos	5	0
Nature	0	0
Order	0	0
Power	0	0

Player statistics for Lu4ik
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	0	0
Death	0	0
Chaos	0	0
Nature	3	1
Order	0	0
Power	0	0

Player statistics for Арандор
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	1	1
Death	0	0
Chaos	0	0
Nature	1	0
Order	0	0
Power	0	0

Player statistics for Пандора
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	0	1
Death	0	0
Chaos	0	0
Nature	0	0
Order	1	1
Power	1	0

Player statistics for Zybr
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	0	0
Death	0	1
Chaos	0	0
Nature	0	0
Order	1	1
Power	0	0

Player statistics for Starhan
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	1	2
Death	0	0
Chaos	0	0
Nature	0	0
Order	0	0
Power	0	0

Player statistics for Драккошка
Games as:	Wins	Losses
Life	0	0
Death	0	0
Chaos	0	1
Nature	0	2
Order	0	0
Power	0	0

Rating calculated after the Summer tournament.
Rating is strictly internal to the portal

In reply to OptiMAL

BASON

18 years ago

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If all Tournaments were held using a single-elimination bracket, then we could adopt a rating system similar to that used in tennis. However, group stage Tournaments also need to be systematized. Since things are so complicated, let's start with the simplest concepts – from the very beginning. And then look for any errors there. For example: does every match always involve 2 players? If so, we can use that as a starting point. A Tournament is a Tournament, but I think the discussion has become too focused on them! What if a Tournament has only 2 participants? How would it differ from a regular match? And how would it differ from a large Tournament with, say, 16 players? The point is that something like a proportion emerges. However, the values are different: the second player is naturally better than the first. But both are still Tournaments. I think we should consider each match separately, based on the fact that only 2 players are competing. And then calculate each match separately. Moreover, calculating the "strength" of the participants is an extremely thankless and unnecessary task. But many people disagree with this. The importance of the Tournament. A separate mini-formula could be created: each place receives a bonus depending on the position. Although I'm leaning towards a simple number. Starting rating: 0. Because, in theory, it should only increase. Otherwise, a player with no games will always have 100, while another active player who is losing will have a lower rating. This is unfair. P.S. I've already seen on another forum how people struggled with the rating formula. And when the formula worked, I immediately looked at what and how was worked out. And the main points looked something like this. Of course, not everyone will like everything, but it's also impossible to please everyone without exception. Therefore, I will be glad if I can bring you at least a little closer to the right answer.

In reply to BASON

IronAxe

18 years ago

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BASON;115648

A tournament is a tournament, but I think the discussion is too focused on them! And what if there are only 2 participants in the tournament? How will it differ from a regular match? And how will it differ from a large tournament, for example, with 16 players? That's the point: it's like a proportion. Only the values are different: the second one is naturally better than the first.

You are reasoning incorrectly. Who told you that the second tournament is naturally better than the first? Have you considered the scenario where the second tournament has 16 beginners, while the first tournament has 2 super-champions? I would go and watch the first tournament, even if these participants had a low Player Rating. Therefore, a system that starts assigning a rating to participants from the last place and thus strongly depends on the NUMBER of people in the tournament is, to put it mildly, not suitable.

BASON;115648

But both are still tournaments. I think that each match should be considered separately, based on the fact that only 2 participants compete. And then calculate each match separately. Besides, calculating the "coolness" of the participants is an extremely unrewarding and unnecessary task. But many do not agree with this.

We are not considering "coolness," but the Player Rating. Well, in sports, the Player Rating of players and teams is also taken into account.

BASON;115648

The importance of the tournament. A separate mini-formula could be created: each place is given a bonus depending on the place taken. Although I am leaning towards a simple number. Starting Player Rating: 0. Because, in theory, it should only increase. Otherwise, a player with no games will always have 100. And another active, but losing player will have a lower rating. This is unfair.

I think I agree with that.

In reply to IronAxe

OptiMAL

18 years ago

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Yes, it seems correct that the rating should be 0 for everyone at the start. I've already corrected this in the table. So, let's think this through to the end. The formula looks like this: Rnew=2/3Rold+1000((N-i)/(N-1)+((N-i)(N-1))^3)(1+SumRold/6000) and divide by 1000 or 100 or 10 to avoid a very large number, and (+ kGw-k1Gl), where k and k1 are coefficients that will depend on the rating. If the rating is low, say up to 500, then k will be 3, and k1 = 1. If the rating is from 500 to 1500, then k = 1.5, k1 = 2, and if the rating is from 1500 to 3000, then k = 0.75, k1 = 3. If it's too small, it can be further divided into gradations. (THIS IS JUST MY EXAMPLE) What are your thoughts?

In reply to OptiMAL

BASON

18 years ago

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Good that at least on something our opinions coincided.

In reply to OptiMAL

Starhan

18 years ago

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OptiMAL;115908

Rnew=2/3Rold+1000((N-i)/(N-1)+((N-i)(N-1))^3)(1+SumRold/6000) and divide by 1000 or 100 or 10 to get a not-so-large number, and add (+ kGw-k1Gl), where k and k1 are coefficients that will depend on the rating. If the rating is low, say up to 500, then k will be 3, and k1 = 1. If the rating is from 500 to 1500, then k = 1.5, k1 = 2, and if the rating is from 1500 to 3000, then k = 0.75, k1 = 3. If it's too low, you can divide it into more gradations. (THIS IS JUST MY EXAMPLE)
What are your thoughts?

When are we going to implement this?:p
(I haven't read the whole thread, it's hard to understand the notations)

What is the purpose of the gradation and the dependence of the coefficients K and K1?
Does it turn out that we derive it empirically?

Каждый может быть героем ...

In reply to Starhan

OptiMAL

18 years ago

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Starhan;116149

When are we going to start the Tournaments?:p
(I haven't read the whole thread, it's hard to understand the notations)

N - number of players in the Tournament
i - place in the Tournament
^- exponentiation.
Rold - old rating
Gw - won games
Gl - losses:)

Starhan;116149

What is the purpose of the gradation and the dependence of the coefficients K and K1?
Does it turn out that we derive it empirically?

The gradation is used so that a leader with a decent rating doesn't increase it even further, that is, to give a newcomer a chance to somehow climb up. For example, the rating of Player 1 will be 1700, and Player 2 = 0
Then, for Player 2, the coefficient k (which stands before Gw) will be 3, and k1 (which stands before Gl) will be 1 - this will give the newcomer extra points and a "boost", and for Player 1, the coefficient k will be 0.75 and k1 = 3, to slow it down. If you want to be a leader, you need to try to win. Therefore, having a high rating, you need to keep working hard, otherwise you can go down.

Starhan

18 years ago

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then we need to implement the system and test it in practice:smile54:

Каждый может быть героем ...

In reply to Starhan

OptiMAL

18 years ago

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Starhan;116413

then we need to implement the system and test it in practice:smile54:

Well, that's great. Theoretically, the system works. Now we need to prove it in practice. So, the Summer Tournament will be scored using this system.
And one more nuance: in the ranking, the last digit will be removed (i.e., divided by 10). Otherwise, no one will reach above 1000 points.

LeSHiJ-MaX

18 years ago

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OptiMAL, honestly, I am simply amazed by your (perhaps I can say) persistence and patience. I can't grasp the entire formula at once, but I think the tournament will immediately reveal everything. And your Autumn-Winter one will definitely expose and highlight everything.
P.S. Where do they erect monuments to people while they're still alive?:smile02:

С самого начала позаботься о своем месте в жизни, чтобы не уподобиться маятнику. /Херберт. Ф./
Клан: "Смертельный Альянс" - "Mortal Alliance"

Brackman

18 years ago

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Damn, I'm not there:(. Why?

Хороший сон укрепляет боевой дух. Хорошая еда укрепляет боевой дух. Хорошие деньги укрепляют боевой дух. А больше всего укрепляет боевой дух - отсутствие врага.

In reply to Brackman

OptiMAL

18 years ago

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Brackman;139105

Ugh, my name isn't there:(. Why?...

Hehe, these are the players who signed up for the online tournaments. Don't be upset, you'll see your nickname next time when you sign up for the next online tournament;).