(Hero - Rogue) in Heroes 4 — General

Registered: 7/29/2006

Posts: 1,584

#189 8/4/2007 12:56 PM UTC

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Haha, yeah, that's true. Here, a lot depends on the map... But in the early stages, you'll have to drag the thief around the main hero and army. And only release him when his Stealth skill is strong enough.

In reply to Пандора

Registered: 4/18/2007

Posts: 5,612

#190 8/4/2007 1:04 PM UTC

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Pandora;105420

Haha, yeah, that's true. Here, a lot depends on the map... But in the early stages, you'll have to drag the thief around with the main hero and his army. And only release him when his Stealth skill is strong enough.

It's not necessary; just level up his combat skills a bit and let the thief move around on his own, especially in the early stages, and then focus on Stealth.
P.S. Why did you change your image so drastically, and why are you disappointed in mages?:)

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

Registered: 7/29/2006

Posts: 1,584

#191 8/4/2007 2:54 PM UTC

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Not necessarily, just level up the warrior a bit and let him roam around on his own. Especially in the early stages, and then focus on stealth.

Well, you can, but what's the point? Maybe it's better to take a Barbarian first and level up his Stealth. But still, at least have an army in the early stages.

Why did you change your image, and drastically at that? Did you get disappointed with mages?

Why is that...? I also like druids. Nature and Haven, I think you know that. But I'll repeat it one more time, just in case :) ZYbr, and by the way, let's continue this in AIM or a private message, okay?

In reply to Пандора

Registered: 4/18/2007

Posts: 5,612

#192 8/4/2007 4:50 PM UTC

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Pandora;105442

Well, you could, but what's the point? Then maybe it would be better to do the opposite: take a Barbarian first and level up their Stealth. But still, in the early stages, at least an army will be needed.The point is so that he doesn't get killed immediately. By the way, regarding the barbarian, I don't remember exactly, but can't only... um... barbarians hire them in the Castle? Taverns on the map don't count; you have to find those first.

Added after 1 minute

Pandora;105442

Why is that... I love druids too. Nature and Order, as everyone knows, it seems. But I'll repeat one more time, just in case :) ZYbr, actually, let's move all this to ICQ or PMs, ok?

well, I'm writing this in addition to the main point, well alright, I'll correct myself so as not to incite other people:) Order on the thread above all!

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

Registered: 3/17/2007

Posts: 477

#193 8/4/2007 5:33 PM UTC

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I played an XL map against a human opponent. I bought a Rogue((( I was playing, not as CHAOS, and he leveled up his Rogue better than his main hero with all that running around. He leveled up a lot)))))). When I approached him with the ROGUE, he just surrendered))) He was quite the killer)))

С самого начала позаботься о своем месте в жизни, чтобы не уподобиться маятнику. /Херберт. Ф./
Клан: "Смертельный Альянс" - "Mortal Alliance"

Registered: 7/29/2006

Posts: 1,584

#194 8/4/2007 6:13 PM UTC

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The point is to not get him killed right away. By the way, regarding the Barbarian, I don't remember exactly, but isn't it true that only, um... Barbarians can recruit him in a castle?

No, he's not in the Chaos castle, I think. But the point is that it's not just about the Chaos castle. Sometimes it's mentioned that having a Thief is also a good idea.

I played against a human opponent on an XL map. He bought a Thief((( He wasn't playing as Chaos, and he leveled up his Thief better than his main hero with all that running around. He leveled up a lot))))) When the Thief reached him, he just surrendered))) He was quite the killer)))

And what else did he level up besides his direct skill? I'm just curious...

In reply to Пандора

Registered: 4/18/2007

Posts: 5,612

#195 8/4/2007 6:36 PM UTC

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Pandora;105466

No, it doesn't seem to be in the Chaos Castle. But we're not just talking about the Chaos Castle. Sometimes it's mentioned that it's good to have a Thief anyway.
quote]
Well, I was just saying in general, that Barbarians can only hire Barbarians, or something like that...

Added 4 minutes later
LeSHiJ-MaX;105461I played against a human opponent on an XL map. He bought a Thief((( He wasn't playing as Chaos, but he leveled up his Thief better than his main hero with all that running around. He leveled up a lot)))))). When he came to me with the Thief, he just surrendered))) He was quite the killer)))

Did you come to him without an army? On an XL map? Well, then you're just... it's scary to play with you:D or the opponent messed up:)
In general, the most striking example of a Thief is probably Agroniel (Storm campaign), although her class is Bard, but she's basically a Thief, especially in the first 2-3 levels, although it depends on how you level her up...

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Пандора

Registered: 3/17/2007

Posts: 477

#196 8/5/2007 4:28 AM UTC

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Pandora;105466

And what else did he pump up besides his direct skill? Just curious...

The most difficult thing was to max out Stealth (I had to sacrifice a few chests to pump it up), and then it was just a matter of technique. Then I fully pumped up combat:D In my opinion, I pumped up magic of Chaos to level 3 and a little bit of magic of Life.
The point is that on the map there were many level 4 creatures guarding cool artifacts. At the beginning, they gave up to 2 levels (if my memory serves me right:D)
So, I ended up with a pumped-up fighter with Logistics and boots, and cool artifacts:)
And the MAIN heroes didn't even manage to fully pump up their own branch:D

ZYbr;105469

Did you come to him without an army? on XL? well, then you are just... it's scary to play with you:D or the opponent messed up:)

We were playing on Champion difficulty, there was no money for an army or buildings, and the Rogue was just running around and pumping himself up:D

С самого начала позаботься о своем месте в жизни, чтобы не уподобиться маятнику. /Херберт. Ф./
Клан: "Смертельный Альянс" - "Mortal Alliance"

In reply to LeSHiJ-MaX

Registered: 12/18/2006

Posts: 230

#197 8/5/2007 8:29 AM UTC

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LeSHiJ-MaX, it's really tough to play! By the way, a Rogue can actually level up faster than anyone else. I passed by a group of black dragons and got 80% experience from them, which is great. But let's say a Rogue passes by, for example, some Gnomes and then defeats them, resulting in 180% experience. Then, as stronger and stronger units appear, the leveling up will be simply amazing! So, you just need to know when and where to use the Rogue!

Registered: 7/29/2006

Posts: 1,584

#198 8/10/2007 7:03 PM UTC

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So, you just need to know when and where to use the thief!

The "where" is clear, the main thing is "how." For example, Leshy's games are a great illustration; you can't say it's better or prove it...

Registered: 4/24/2007

Posts: 454

#199 9/26/2007 11:39 AM UTC

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YES, INDEED :) URGENTLY NEED TO REDUCE STEALTH AND NECROMANCY.

and it seems the developers didn't realize that (I think that the fact that the hero also gains all the experience in battle is a bug; he should only receive the remaining 20% :))

Каждый может быть героем ...

Registered: 7/16/2007

Posts: 17,425

#202 5/13/2008 5:08 PM UTC

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I like the rogue hero. I realized this when I played as Agraenel and could freely roam the map wherever I wanted. The rogue is perfect for clearing the map, and he will gain just as much experience as the main hero. There's no point in having him lead an army, because then the point of stealth is lost. In my opinion, the best way to develop him is to level up his Combat skill, and choose Chaos or Nature magic, so that the lack of an army doesn't prevent him from mowing down everyone. IMHO, it's a great choice for those who like to play with a single hero.

А, вот почему.

🏹🎪+⛓️♿=💕

Registered: 11/19/2007

Posts: 780

#203 5/15/2008 11:17 AM UTC

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I've always had mixed feelings about him. In theory, everything looks great – you wander around, gain experience, capture mines and resources, and it's all wonderful. But in reality, it's incredibly difficult to level up his stealth. You have to sacrifice all the chests you find because he can barely reach level 2 by shooting at archers or fairies. This has a negative impact on the main hero or the economy, depending on the difficulty level. And you can't even rush through them. Plus, chests are limited, and they are often guarded by creatures above level 1. On top of that, you also need to level up scouting for stealth, and there's another skill in a different branch. So, in practice, by the time you level up the thief, you might already have a powerful creature. This is true for a typical map. But maybe if you play on a large, super-rich map with ten chests before the castle, the thief might actually be useful.

Первый, кто был забанен за Правду.

Registered: 4/18/2007

Posts: 5,612

#204 5/16/2008 4:49 AM UTC

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Well, if you take the thief from Heroes of Chaos, he immediately has both scouting and stealth skills, so you won't have to sort through and choose unnecessary skills for a specific purpose.
But the thief is also useful because of his speed; you can level up not so much stealth as pathfinding, if I'm not mistaken, which will then increase the speed of the entire army.

Барон "Vampires"

Отдай свои прошлые сны,
В сомненьях себя обрети,
В бешеном танце душа кружится!
Не думай, что будет потом,
Здесь и сейчас мы живем,
Стань хоть на миг сам собой, слышишь!

In reply to Zybr

Registered: 11/29/2007

Posts: 191

#205 5/16/2008 5:47 AM UTC

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ZYbr;176870

But the thief is still useful due to his speed; you can level up not so much stealth as pathfinding, if I'm not mistaken, which will then increase the speed of the entire army.

That's right! :)
However, on online maps, stealth is often disabled to avoid interference (on many multiplayer maps, the landscape is built in such a way that stealth is useless there), because in online matches, the thief is taken in the vast majority of cases only because of the "Pathfinding" skill, since movement range is the key to victory. :smile10: